From: "L-Soft list server at Indiana University (1.8d)" To: "ARTF@MemoryAlpha.nil" File: "LOISCLA-GENERAL-L LOG0102C" ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 00:25:54 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Marnie Rowe Subject: Re: Question for a fic #32768 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Phil, Middle to late September is when they harvest the wheat in the fields, generally right before the the first frost and then they have a Harvest Faire/Festival to celebrate getting the job done before mother nature does them in you have already been told what goes on tho in numerous other posts so i won't bore you there... Marnie > One for the agriculturists or rural dwellers among us: what kind of > excuse-- ahem, *reason* might everyone's favourite small town in Kansas > have for a festival/party/celebration/whatever a la the Corn Festival > in mid-to-late September? > > Thanking you in anticipation, > > Phil ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 10:08:21 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nicole Wolke Subject: Re: Be My Kal-entine MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ah Missy, that was sweet! Thanks for the Waff :-) Nicole -- AKA CKgroupie on IRC/AIM NKWolke@t-online.de Are you always searching for news about Dean Cain? And you don't have enough time to search? Here's your solution: Go to "The Dean Cain News Page" http://members.tripod.de/CKgroupie/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 08:29:26 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Gerry Anklewicz Subject: Re: Valentines Day Rules Comments: To: w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK In-Reply-To: <019001c09676$3961ec40$916105a0@hrm.keele.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks Wendy for your nice comments. I appreciate it. Gerry ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 09:55:48 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Judith Williams Subject: More questions for story MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit These are questions about the kinds of little details that bring my writing to a standstill until I work them out. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. 1. What is the current fashionable ensemble for alpine skiing? 2. If a character says, "La vida esta buena," does that mean' life is good', or is there a more colloquial expression for that? 3. If a character refers to his parents in a way that sounds like 'momma and poppa' would you spell the words that way, or would you spell them 'mama and papa' even though some readers might hear them as 'maMA and paPA giving them a very un-American sound? I've tried these words both ways; while 'momma' seems to be okay, 'poppa' is beginning to have that weird look that words sometimes get when one frets over them. 'Mama and Papa' look fine, but I'm concerned over what would be a very inappropriate sound for the character. Thanks for your help. :) Jude ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:27:04 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Gerry Anklewicz Subject: Re: More questions for story In-Reply-To: <001201c09778$8a663e40$6dfcfd3f@v1t9j4> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit LOISCLA-GENERAL-L@LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU writes: >These are questions about the kinds of little details that bring my >writing >to a standstill until I work them out. Any assistance would be greatly >appreciated. > >1. What is the current fashionable ensemble for alpine skiing? Don't have a clue. > >2. If a character says, "La vida esta buena," does that mean' life is >good', or is there a more colloquial expression for that? Ne habla espanol. > > >3. If a character refers to his parents in a way that sounds like 'momma >and >poppa' would you spell the words that way, or would you spell them 'mama >and >papa' even though some readers might hear them as 'maMA and paPA giving >them >a very un-American sound? I've tried these words both ways; while 'momma' >seems to be okay, 'poppa' is beginning to have that weird look that words >sometimes get when one frets over them. 'Mama and Papa' look fine, but >I'm >concerned over what would be a very inappropriate sound for the character. > Now here I have something to say on this. If you have the character speaking with an accent, then usually the use of Mama and Papa blends into the accent you are having them use. I read Mama and Momma the same way. That's not the same for Papa and Poppa. We're used to seeing the Papa. I'd go for Mama and Papa. Gerry > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 19:55:51 +0000 Reply-To: ampaes@etsii.upv.es Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Amparo Palacios Escrig Organization: Universidad Politecnica Subject: Re: More questions for story >2. If a character says, "La vida esta buena," does that mean' life is >good', or is there a more colloquial expression for that? That's something I can answer you. If you say "La vida esta buena" it means that you have eat life and it tastes good. Don't worry is a common error because in spanish there are two different verbs used for the verb "to be" in english. In this case you'll have to say "La vida es buena". Glad to help you Amparo ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 19:29:18 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Okay, I have two questions for a fic. I need techno babble here, so don't worry about giving too much info and boring me. Replies welcome either on the list or to me directly at jextra42@hotmail.com 1. I seem to remember hearing that NASA had some sort of room where they could simulate zero-g, or turn the gravity off, or something, so astronauts could practice before going into space. Does anyone know anything about that? And if so, do you know anything about how they create the effect? 2. On a similar note, I know that people seem lighter (or maybe *are* lighter) in water -- for example, I can pick up my six foot brother with hardly any effort when we're in a pool. And this is why a lot of physical therapy is done in pools. But, I'm at a loss as to *why* water has this effect. I remember learning it in high school, but can't remember what it was I learned! Thanks, Bethy _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:55:01 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: James Tull Subject: A Nomination for Gerry Anklewicz Sorry to post this to the List but I couldn't find a current Addy for Gerry. Hey Gerry! I nominated "Valentine Expectations" for Best WAFFY. James ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 15:10:39 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Diyan Subject: Re: More questions for story I don't know much about fashion and it's been years since I've been skiing in any mountains, and I know next to nothing about colloquial Spanish. But about the other question: If you want un-American sound or the stress on the 2nd sylable, you might consider the French spelling "maman" instead of "mama." I agree with Gerry that "pappa" looks strange, so you might want to stick with "papa," but you might consider... -nevermind. That looks way strange in our alphabet, even if it doesn't sound strange. Stick with "papa." -Dia ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:11:53 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nancy Smith Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I can't tell you about the NASA thing, but the reason you are lighter, so to speak, in water is that water is denser than air. It's the same principle as why a hydrogen or helium balloon floats in the air. Hydrogen and helium are less dense than oxygen, nitrogen, et. al. Nan Bethy Em wrote: > Okay, I have two questions for a fic. I need techno babble here, so don't > worry about giving too much info and boring me. Replies welcome either on > the list or to me directly at jextra42@hotmail.com > > 1. I seem to remember hearing that NASA had some sort of room where they > could simulate zero-g, or turn the gravity off, or something, so astronauts > could practice before going into space. Does anyone know anything about > that? And if so, do you know anything about how they create the effect? > > 2. On a similar note, I know that people seem lighter (or maybe *are* > lighter) in water -- for example, I can pick up my six foot brother with > hardly any effort when we're in a pool. And this is why a lot of physical > therapy is done in pools. But, I'm at a loss as to *why* water has this > effect. I remember learning it in high school, but can't remember what it > was I learned! > > Thanks, > > Bethy > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 16:33:58 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Ann E. McBride" Subject: Re: More questions for story MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/15/01 1:03:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, judithwilliams@PRODIGY.NET writes: > 1. What is the current fashionable ensemble for alpine skiing? > Haven't a clue. > 2. If a character says, "La vida esta buena," does that mean' life is > good', or is there a more colloquial expression for that? > Not that I know of, but my Spanish is rusty. > 3. If a character refers to his parents in a way that sounds like 'momma and > poppa' would you spell the words that way, or would you spell them 'mama and > papa' even though some readers might hear them as 'maMA and paPA giving them > a very un-American sound? I've tried these words both ways; while 'momma' > seems to be okay, 'poppa' is beginning to have that weird look that words > sometimes get when one frets over them. 'Mama and Papa' look fine, but I'm > concerned over what would be a very inappropriate sound for the character. > Mama and Papa, definitely. Momma and Poppa look very weird. Ann ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 15:51:54 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LaNita Cornwall Subject: OFF TOPIC - Program to make hot keys MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain This is a free download that will let you use the windows key on your keyboard + another key as a hot key to open a program or web site. I just made one for the archives and am going to do one for Anne's Place. Much faster than going through favorites. Have several things set up using this and it's great. This is from an about.com newsletter. http://windows.about.com/compute/windows/library/bl_freebie.htm Go to the above link, click on WinKey (2 in the box). In the text is another WinKey link. When you click, you may get an about.com top frame with a this page cannot be displayed message in the next frame, but it will pull up a download screen. Tell it ok and it will download this program. quinn ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 17:06:48 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Marilyn Puett Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I know this one! My hubby retired from NASA last year. They don't have a room, but they do have a plane, lovingly called the "Vomit Comet" where they can create zero-G effects. This is where the astronauts train. As a bit of trivia, parts of "Apollo 13" were filmed in the Vomit Comet! Here is a link to give you probably more info than you wanted to know! http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/kjenks/kc-135.htm Marilyn AKA Supermom >From: Bethy Em >Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" > >To: LOISCLA-GENERAL-L@LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU >Subject: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity >Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 19:29:18 -0000 > >Okay, I have two questions for a fic. I need techno babble here, so don't >worry about giving too much info and boring me. Replies welcome either on >the list or to me directly at jextra42@hotmail.com > >1. I seem to remember hearing that NASA had some sort of room where they >could simulate zero-g, or turn the gravity off, or something, so astronauts >could practice before going into space. Does anyone know anything about >that? And if so, do you know anything about how they create the effect? > >2. On a similar note, I know that people seem lighter (or maybe *are* >lighter) in water -- for example, I can pick up my six foot brother with >hardly any effort when we're in a pool. And this is why a lot of physical >therapy is done in pools. But, I'm at a loss as to *why* water has this >effect. I remember learning it in high school, but can't remember what it >was I learned! > >Thanks, > >Bethy > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:11:46 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: JaT Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Bethy, Long time no hear from. Answer to #1: NASA has two methods of simulating zero-g. a. A very large tank of water. See, your second question answered your first. b. The Vomit Comet. Basically a big plane that goes up really high and then plunges down at a very fast speed. Nan answered 2 very nicely. ===== World's Wisdom (a bumper sticker): He who dies with the most toys wins. God's Wisdom (Luke 12:15b): Be careful and guard against all kinds of greed. Life is not measured by how much one owns. NCV 7 Days of Superman-Finished!http://www.geocities.com/mr_d8a/7dos.htm WIP for Elisabeth: Story of a Lifetime-TOC http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003563.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 18:55:33 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: btinternetmail Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:______Valentine's_Day_Rules?= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gerry This was so sweet and romantic. I loved it that you wrote about Martha and Jonathan and showed that just because you are old in years, doesn't mean you're too old for romance. Regards Eileen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 15:18:48 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > > Okay, I have two questions for a fic. I need techno babble here, > so don't > > worry about giving too much info and boring me. Replies welcome > either on > > the list or to me directly at jextra42@hotmail.com > > > > 1. I seem to remember hearing that NASA had some sort of room > where they > > could simulate zero-g, or turn the gravity off, or something, so > astronauts > > could practice before going into space. Does anyone know anything > about > > that? And if so, do you know anything about how they create the > effect? I don't know about a room, but they do have a plane that (don't know what kind, I keep thinking C-25 but I don't think that is even a plane) that they fly way up into the atmosphere and then back down fairly fast. UP and down, UP and down in a, again I want to say hyperbole -but that's not right either. It is like a wavy line~~~~~ up down etc. I think it may be a sine/cosine wave, if you are familiar with calculus. On the way down, if done right, they will be weightless. (Similar to Mr. Freeze and other roller coasters where you experience a second of weightlessness. This is how they filmed the weightless scenes in "Apollo 13". They only have one or two minutes of weightlessness at a time. I think in "Armageddon" they have a room that simulates extra gravity for the asteroid. And this is LC world - we don't really have holgrams and stuff like they do (Or am I just out of the loop?) so maybe they have something that we don't - a weightless room. They also train in pools with thier suits on to simulate better weightlessness but it is still not the same. Hope that helps even if my terms aren't right and it isn't really technobabble *bg* - it's been a while since I've had math or science - but if you want me to, I'll ask around - I am a college teacher. CM ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 17:39:36 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: More questions for story On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 09:55:48 -0800, Judith Williams < judithwilliams@PRODIGY.NET> wrote: >1. What is the current fashionable ensemble for alpine skiing? For what age and gender character? Serious skiers, or those who just want to "see and be seen" on the slopes? Kids today dress more casually; I believe the "snowboard grunge" look is still in, but of course it's also "how much money can I spend on an outfit that looks like I got it from a Thrift Store?" But this depends a lot on how much money the kids have, what their peer group does, etc. People still ski in jeans, though they tend to be the casual skiiers who don't want to spend a lot of money on an outfit they won't wear much. A basic outfit for a serious or semi-serious skier would consist of water- proof, lined/insulated snow-pants (either bib-style or regular waistband), and a nice ski jacket. The pants might match the jacket, or they might be black. Jackets are often in bright, rich colors, either solid or mixed with complementary colors -- a bright color or two and black is always a sharp mix. Women can also find tighter legging-type snowpants that look "sexier" than the bulkier ones men would use. Underneath, a skiier would dress in layers if it's cold -- long underwear, a cotton turtle-neck, maybe a sweater or fleece pull-over. If it's a warm day, you might find someone skiing in just their waterproof ski-pants and a fleece jacket, pull-over, or vest. Accessories would match the colors of the pants/jacket, and would include good quality mittens or gloves (mittens are warmer, but gloves are more stylish), a ski-hat or headband (covers the ears but not the top of the head), and a scarf or neck-gaitor (a tube of fabric that goes around the neck; it doesn't "wrap" like a scarf.) Fleece is very popular now -- you don't see hats/scarfs/gaitors made out of cotton or wool much anymore. Goggles are also a must for serious skiiers, but many people still just wear the more fashionable sun-glasses. Boots and skis themselves could also match the colors in the outfit, if the skiier wanted to make this a priority. For the "see and be seen" socialite, you could either go with a really expensive professional-skier type outfit (for someone who never actually hits the slopes but wants to look like they do) or as an alternative, think "Mindy Church goes skiing" , all fur and fluff. >3. 'Mama and Papa' look fine, but I'm >concerned over what would be a very inappropriate sound for the character. I don't have the aversion to Momma and Poppa like some who have posted seem to, but I agree that you wouldn't go wrong by using Mama and Papa -- I would read them the same way, though I am in the US. Sometimes it's hard to get the exact spelling to match the pronunciation of words like that. My daughter calls my parents (her grandparents) Grammy and Papa, but we pronounce Papa more like "Pup-pa" (short u sound, not short a or short o. Amy came up with the pronunciation at age 1, and we had to figure out how to spell it. We experimented with other spellings, but finally just settled on Papa, even though that's not exactly how we say it. Hope some of that helped! Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 00:26:17 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Xylo Xenopho Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The room NASA astronautes are trained to become accustomed to zero-g (within earth's athmosphere) is the cargo room of an airplane crashing to earth. Well, there is no real crash, of course - just the part about dropping from the sky until just before smashing into the ground. So what is zero-g anyway ? there is no way to get a true zero gravity chamber, since we can not turn off gravity. That means that any body experiences earth's gravity and this force will make the body move towards earth unless there is a counter force. However there is a difference between a force applied and the way we experience (and measure) that force, since we need a reference system. Consider this: you are at a train station and from the platform you watch a train leaving. You have no doubt that you are staying where you are and the train is leaving. Now remember the last time you traveled by train and left the station - so slowly accelerating that you did not notice the force. Didn't you ever thought - just for a split-second - that somehow the station was moving away from you - with you staying put ? In the first case your reference system was the train station, and the train left. In the second case, the reference was with the train, and thus the station left. But much more important: both you yourself and the train as your local reference system got accelerated by the very same acceleration, and thus you did not notice any difference in motion between you and the train. Now earth applies a force via it's gravity to you - that makes you come back down to earth rather than floating up into space never to return ever again after a soft jump into the air. This gravity force leads to an acceleration towards earth of 1 g = 9.81 m/s^2 just like the force unleashed by you hitting the gas pedal (accelerator) of your car makes the wheels apply a force to the ground and thus making your car moving forward to change its speed. Now a change of speed is called an acceleration. (and a negative number for acceleration means slowing down) A body does only change its motion when a force is applied to it. If there is no force, then there is no change in motion. (For example, a space probe roughly gets one kick by the rocket launching it and then moves on forever. Actually there is much more to it, since there is still earth's and sun's gravity, swing by maneuvers and such - but if we did not have to take them into account, it just would like move on forever.) So: no force -> same speed, same direction. back to the train: consider the train still in the train station, you are aboard.. You place a a ball on the ground of your cabin. Now the train starts moving. You do not notice any force. But as soon as the train starts moving, the ball also starts moving, and to be precise, right into the other direction the train moves. So why is this ? But you can't 'see' any force beeing applied to the ball. Why do you - moving with the train - don't feel a force, but the ball, which is not rigidly connected to the train does (there must be a force be applied to the ball because you see it change its speed) Ah, that is the point. You are connected to the train, because you sat down. And thus the acceleration of the train also inludes you. The ball however is free to roll anywhere and the train just slips away from under the ball with the ball staying put. (So that is the reason why we grasp for support whenever the bus/metro... accelerates again after a stop when we did not get a seat) But the ball moves, you might say. Well, that depends upon the reference system. first case: reference is station. train and you move. ball and station stay put. second case: reference is train: station and ball move. you and train stay put. so zero g does not mean that there is no gravity - just that we can not tell if there is a force applied or not. So if a body ( a sky jumper for example) is free falling meaning it is only subject to earth's gravity it will clearly fall down back to ground - as seen from the ground reference system. But what would we experience if the reference system ( for example a video camera) is moving just exactly like the sky-jumper ? that means more exactly what would happen if the reference system and the body would experience exactly the same acceleration ? >From the ground: both camera and sky jumper race to the ground: from the camera: well, we all have seen some clips about sky jumpers filmed by a fellow sky jumper: on these frames the sky jumper stays put. and if an object stays put then there can not be any kind of force be applied to it - more exactly: there is no force in respect to the reference system by which we happen to measure motion. So if we want to make an astronaut feel weightless, we have to accelerate the reference system in the very same way earth accelerates the astronaut. We could do this by giving the astronaut a tender nudge on the back and make him a sky jumper - but that experience would hardly help him train to drink a weightless bubble of water or get any difficult work done. It is much more comfortable to have a cabin going down with him. Again, we could invite the astronaut to a skyscraper and there put him into an elevator cabin just below the roof and then - just cut the rope. On the way down the astronaut would be able to train those space man things - but just for the few seconds it takes to drop from a sky scraper. (actually this is a way used to do experiments in micro-gravity without launching something into space - some university in germany (Bremen if i recall) had a tower built for that purpose) So we need to go up. way up. Thus make the elevator cabin an aircraft which accelerates in some kind of controled crash to earth and you have got some couple of minutes to play around. (nice picture: http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/kjenks/kc-135.htm) Oops. I got carried away. Anyway - I hope you don't mind. take care, Xenophon links: NASA Zero-Gravity Research Facility http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/facility/zero.htm http://www.newton.org.uk/ Welcome to newton.org.uk - the virtual museum of Sir Isaac Newton and the history of science. Gravity Faq: by Edgar Roman http://www.sfu.ca/~cly/programming/docs/gravity.htm The information contained in this document will allow you to realistically simulate jumping and interstellar maneuvers - for computer games. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 17:37:32 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: <3A8C6599.62F4FE79@gmx.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Wow! It wasn't even my question for a fanfic, but I sure learned a lot!! Irene --- Xylo Xenopho wrote: > The room NASA astronautes are trained to become > accustomed to > zero-g (within earth's athmosphere) is the cargo > room of an airplane > crashing to earth. Well, there is no real crash, of > course - just the > part > about dropping from the sky until just before > smashing into the ground. > > So what is zero-g anyway ? > > there is no way to get a true zero gravity chamber, > since we > can not turn off gravity. That means that any body > experiences > earth's gravity and this force will make the body > move towards > earth unless there is a counter force. > > However there is a difference between a force > applied and > the way we experience (and measure) that force, > since we need > a reference system. > > Consider this: you are at a train station and from > the platform > you watch a train leaving. You have no doubt that > you are staying > where you are and the train is leaving. > > Now remember the last time you traveled by train and > left > the station - so slowly accelerating that you did > not notice > the force. Didn't you ever thought - just for a > split-second - > that somehow the station was moving away from > you - with you staying put ? > > In the first case your reference system was the > train station, > and the train left. In the second case, the > reference was with > the train, and thus the station left. But much more > important: > both you yourself and the train as your local > reference system > got accelerated by the very same acceleration, and > thus you > did not notice any difference in motion between you > and the > train. > > Now earth applies a force via it's gravity to you - > that makes > you come back down to earth rather than floating up > into space > never to return ever again after a soft jump into > the air. > > This gravity force leads to an acceleration towards > earth of > 1 g = 9.81 m/s^2 just like the force unleashed by > you > hitting the gas pedal (accelerator) of your car > makes the > wheels apply a force to the ground and thus making > your > car moving forward to change its speed. > > Now a change of speed is called an acceleration. > (and a negative number for acceleration means > slowing down) > > A body does only change its motion when a force > is applied to it. If there is no force, then there > is > no change in motion. (For example, a space probe > roughly gets one kick by the rocket launching it and > then moves on forever. Actually there is much > more to it, since there is still earth's and sun's > gravity, swing by maneuvers and such - but > if we did not have to take them into account, > it just would like move on forever.) > > So: no force -> same speed, same direction. > > back to the train: > consider the train still in the train station, you > are aboard.. > You place a a ball on the ground of your cabin. > Now the train starts moving. You do not notice > any force. But as soon as the train starts moving, > the ball also starts moving, and to be precise, > right into the other direction the train moves. > > So why is this ? > > But you can't 'see' any force beeing applied to > the ball. Why do you - moving with the train - > don't feel a force, but the ball, which is not > rigidly > connected to the train does (there must be a force > be applied to the ball because you see it change its > speed) > > Ah, that is the point. You are connected to the > train, > because you sat down. And thus the acceleration of > the train also inludes you. The ball however is free > to roll anywhere and the train just slips away from > under the ball with the ball staying put. > > (So that is the reason why we grasp for support > whenever the bus/metro... accelerates again > after a stop when we did not get a seat) > > But the ball moves, you might say. > Well, that depends upon the reference system. > > first case: reference is station. > train and you move. ball and station stay put. > > second case: reference is train: > station and ball move. you and train stay put. > > so zero g does not mean that there is no gravity - > just that we can not tell if there is a force > applied > or not. > > So if a body ( a sky jumper for example) is free > falling meaning it is only subject to earth's > gravity > it will clearly fall down back to ground - as seen > from > the ground reference system. > > But what would we experience if the reference > system ( for example a video camera) is moving > just exactly like the sky-jumper ? > that means more exactly what would happen > if the reference system and the body would > experience exactly the same acceleration ? > > From the ground: > both camera and sky jumper race to the ground: > > from the camera: well, we all have seen some clips > about sky jumpers filmed by a fellow sky jumper: > on these frames the sky jumper stays put. and if > an object stays put then there can not be any kind > of force be applied to it - more exactly: there is > no > force in respect to the reference system by which we > happen to measure motion. > > So if we want to make an astronaut feel weightless, > we have to accelerate the reference system in the > very > same way earth accelerates the astronaut. > > We could do this by giving the astronaut a tender > nudge > on the back and make him a sky jumper - but that > experience would hardly help him train to drink a > weightless > bubble of water or get any difficult work done. > > It is much more comfortable to have a cabin going > down > with him. Again, we could invite the astronaut to a > skyscraper > and there put him into an elevator cabin just below > the roof and > then - just cut the rope. On the way down the > astronaut > would be able to train those space man things - but > just for > the few seconds it takes to drop from a sky scraper. > > (actually this is a way used to do experiments in > micro-gravity > without launching something into space - some > university in > germany (Bremen if i recall) had a tower built for > that purpose) > > So we need to go up. way up. Thus make the elevator > cabin an aircraft which accelerates in some kind of > controled > crash to earth and you have got some couple of > minutes > to play around. > > (nice picture: > http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/kjenks/kc-135.htm) > > Oops. I got carried away. > Anyway - I hope you don't mind. > > take care, > Xenophon > > links: > > NASA Zero-Gravity Research Facility > http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/facility/zero.htm > > > http://www.newton.org.uk/ > Welcome to newton.org.uk - > the virtual museum of Sir Isaac Newton > and the history of science. > > Gravity Faq: by Edgar Roman > http://www.sfu.ca/~cly/programming/docs/gravity.htm > The information contained in this document will > allow you > to realistically simulate jumping and interstellar > maneuvers - > for computer games. ===== www.originalequestrianmusic.bigstep.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 19:47:18 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Liz Berard Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't know about a room, but I know they use a plane that they, for a few moments turn off the engine so that it free falls. This gives about, I think, 30 seconds of weightless. I think bouyance (sp) is the reason things are lighter in water. If I remember correctly, the water is supporting some of the weight. Hope this helps. Liz Bethy Em wrote: > > Okay, I have two questions for a fic. I need techno babble here, so don't > worry about giving too much info and boring me. Replies welcome either on > the list or to me directly at jextra42@hotmail.com > > 1. I seem to remember hearing that NASA had some sort of room where they > could simulate zero-g, or turn the gravity off, or something, so astronauts > could practice before going into space. Does anyone know anything about > that? And if so, do you know anything about how they create the effect? > > 2. On a similar note, I know that people seem lighter (or maybe *are* > lighter) in water -- for example, I can pick up my six foot brother with > hardly any effort when we're in a pool. And this is why a lot of physical > therapy is done in pools. But, I'm at a loss as to *why* water has this > effect. I remember learning it in high school, but can't remember what it > was I learned! > > Thanks, > > Bethy > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:49:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Debby Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:06 PM 02/15/2001 -0500, Bethy Em asked and Marilyn wrote: >I know this one! My hubby retired from NASA last year. > >They don't have a room, but they do have a plane, lovingly called the "Vomit >Comet" where they can create zero-G effects. This is where the astronauts >train. As a bit of trivia, parts of "Apollo 13" were filmed in the Vomit >Comet! Here is a link to give you probably more info than you wanted to >know! > >http://zeta.lerc.nasa.gov/kjenks/kc-135.htm > >Marilyn >AKA Supermom Further Marilyn... It's a KC-135 aircraft with its interior largely cleaned out to make room (it does have chairs into which one can be strapped for testing). It goes up and down something like 44 times in a row, and at the peak/top curve, gravity is lost for around a minute. If you get sick at first with the rollercoaster-type ride... too bad, they aren't going to stop and let you off (thus, the Vomit Comet). I know an amazing woman (would put Lois to shame) who was working on her 3rd doctorate by testing physiological responses to weightlessness, so she traveled a lot in the KC-135. We (my workplace) typed her thesis. Lots of great pictures of her floating around. She also talked to a lot of astronauts. Debby huitziln@cais.net (for now) still on line... don't know what's happening with my apartment complex corporate management and my ISP ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:50:59 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Debby Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: <3A8C6599.62F4FE79@gmx.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:26 AM 02/16/2001 +0100, you wrote: [snip fascinating explanation] >Oops. I got carried away. >Anyway - I hope you don't mind. > >take care, >Xenophon You got some funny bright light shined in your eyes unexpectedly, didn't you? ) Debby huitziln@cais.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:34:25 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: OT: KathyB email down *again* Hi everyone, Sorry to do this through the list, but it's the only way I have to reach everyone. Yes, my mail server is down *again*. It had come back up last week, but now is back down. I *think* I can send out, but I can't receive mail in. So if you've been having trouble reaching me, that's the problem. All upload assignments for this weekend have been made, but I have no idea whether they've actually gone out or are just floating around in limbo. The "send" looked like it went through, but, of course, if it bounced, I have no way of knowing. :P There were three stories assigned; authors and GEs should have received their confirmations as well. I am still receiving email at my destinyy.com account, so if anyone needs to reach me, please feel free to use it. I can also reply via this listserv, since I use the website interface to read and post. If Lauren, or any of the authors/editors who had stories sent for upload this week want to let me know if they actually received the email, I would appreciate it. :) kathyb@destinyy.com BTW, my lcfanfic address is a forward to my @home account, so that one's not working either. Destinyy is your best bet to reach me! (Gee, to think I was going to get rid of it because all I get there is spam. Now I think I'll be keeping it for these kinds of emergencies!) Gee, no email in the last 48 hours ... I feel so cut off from the world. Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 12:22:17 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Farah Chisham Subject: OT: Technical List info As your technical wizzard here on the listserv, I have some information for you: I'm going on tour with the Navy Band in New England from March 1-March 28. Please tell your friends that if they want to subscribe I have temporarily set the subscription option to "open". This means that anyone who wants to subscribe can do so without any intervention on my part. Basically, this means that you'll be subscribed automatically if you send a request to the listserv. If anyone has any technical questions pertaining to this, please email me privately at farah@chisham.com or fchisham@cs.indiana.edu Thanks, Farah Chisham ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 09:25:54 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Judith Williams Subject: Re: More questions for story MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks, Amparo, for the Spanish language help. It's been a long time since my high school Spanish classes. Thanks to Gerry, Ann Kathy, and Dia for the advice on Mama and Papa. That's pretty much where I was coming down, but wanted to confirm. And special thanks, Kathy, for your very complete rundown on ski apparel. What I had written fits right in. I'm still chuckling over the visual of Mindy Church at a ski resort--sort of an athletically-challenged Sonja Henie (sp?) look. :) Jude ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Brown" To: Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 2:39 PM Subject: Re: More questions for story > On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 09:55:48 -0800, Judith Williams < > judithwilliams@PRODIGY.NET> wrote: > > >1. What is the current fashionable ensemble for alpine skiing? > > For what age and gender character? Serious skiers, or those who just want to > "see and be seen" on the slopes? > > Kids today dress more casually; I believe the "snowboard grunge" look is > still in, but of course it's also "how much money can I spend on an outfit > that looks like I got it from a Thrift Store?" But this depends a lot on > how much money the kids have, what their peer group does, etc. People still > ski in jeans, though they tend to be the casual skiiers who don't want to > spend a lot of money on an outfit they won't wear much. > > A basic outfit for a serious or semi-serious skier would consist of water- > proof, lined/insulated snow-pants (either bib-style or regular waistband), > and a nice ski jacket. The pants might match the jacket, or they might be > black. Jackets are often in bright, rich colors, either solid or mixed with > complementary colors -- a bright color or two and black is always a sharp > mix. Women can also find tighter legging-type snowpants that look "sexier" > than the bulkier ones men would use. > > Underneath, a skiier would dress in layers if it's cold -- long underwear, a > cotton turtle-neck, maybe a sweater or fleece pull-over. If it's a warm day, > you might find someone skiing in just their waterproof ski-pants and a fleece > jacket, pull-over, or vest. > > Accessories would match the colors of the pants/jacket, and would include > good quality mittens or gloves (mittens are warmer, but gloves are more > stylish), a ski-hat or headband (covers the ears but not the top of the > head), and a scarf or neck-gaitor (a tube of fabric that goes around the > neck; it doesn't "wrap" like a scarf.) Fleece is very popular now -- you > don't see hats/scarfs/gaitors made out of cotton or wool much anymore. > Goggles are also a must for serious skiiers, but many people still just wear > the more fashionable sun-glasses. > > Boots and skis themselves could also match the colors in the outfit, if the > skiier wanted to make this a priority. > > For the "see and be seen" socialite, you could either go with a really > expensive professional-skier type outfit (for someone who never actually hits > the slopes but wants to look like they do) or as an alternative, think "Mindy > Church goes skiing" , all fur and fluff. > > > >3. 'Mama and Papa' look fine, but I'm > >concerned over what would be a very inappropriate sound for the character. > > I don't have the aversion to Momma and Poppa like some who have posted seem > to, but I agree that you wouldn't go wrong by using Mama and Papa -- I would > read them the same way, though I am in the US. > > Sometimes it's hard to get the exact spelling to match the pronunciation of > words like that. My daughter calls my parents (her grandparents) Grammy and > Papa, but we pronounce Papa more like "Pup-pa" (short u sound, not short a or > short o. Amy came up with the pronunciation at age 1, and we had to figure > out how to spell it. We experimented with other spellings, but finally > just settled on Papa, even though that's not exactly how we say it. > > Hope some of that helped! > > Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 23:05:22 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: OT: KathyB email down *again* Well, it looks like @home is back up ... I received several messages today, dated both yesterday and today. So apparently @home at least saved the messages that came in, instead of bouncing them! If you haven't received a reply to an email you've sent me in the last couple of days, you may want to resend your message, just in case. :) Thanks for your patience, Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:40:39 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: btinternetmail Subject: Re: Message Board Index Update through February 10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maria I loved Remember Me and Broken Angel (even though it was very sad in parts) and I love this. I really hope you get Angel to confide in Buffy about his time in Hell. Can't wait to read the next part. Regards Eileen ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:17:48 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Lab Rat Subject: Re: Message Board Index Update through February 10 On Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:40:39 -0000, btinternetmail wrote: >Maria > >I loved Remember Me and Broken Angel (even though it was very sad in parts) >and I love this. I really hope you get Angel to confide in Buffy about his >time in Hell. > >Can't wait to read the next part. > >Regards >Eileen Okay, thought I'd unsub from the list and resub in an attempt to get rid of that eddress glitch that occurs whenever I post. (And what a palaver *that* turned out to be. Suddenly Yahoo Groups don't seem so bad at all. :P) Finally think I've got it to agree I'm subbed again, so thought I'd test that out with a reply to this. Okay...so what am I missing here? Did I miss another post that explains this one? I've checked the archive and can't find anything obvious. LabRat aka Puzzled of Cumbernauld :) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:52:22 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Message Board Index Update through February 10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 02/17/2001 1:28:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, labrat@BLUEYONDER.CO.UK writes: << Okay...so what am I missing here? Did I miss another post that explains this one? >> Hey, it works Labby!! Look at that--this reply goes to the list instead of just to you. BTW, I thought I was kinda lost about that post, too. --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 19:25:52 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Thanks to Nan, Merilyn (that website was very informative and interesting, too), James, Carol, Xenophon (carried away is no problem -- and no I don't mind! I was thrilled with the examples you gave), Liz, and Debby for all your helpful information. Unfortunately, though the Vomit Comet is fascinating, it means I have to rework some of the theories in my story. :-( Is it even conceivable that someday there would be some sort of technology that could exert a force within a contained area to 'counteract' the force of gravity (like if you have two hands pushing against each other, neither goes anywhere because there is no excess force? Gravity would fight this force and allow the people in that area to experience weightlessness)? Even if it isn't conceivable, I think I'm gonna use it anyway! :-þ It's basically vital to my premise. Oh well, I'll just warn the 'correct science obsessed' away from this story. Thanks again, Bethy _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 20:05:08 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Message Board Index Update through February 10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey, well what do you know? Was worth all the hassle to do it then! Thanks, Laurie! > Hey, it works Labby!! Look at that--this reply goes to the list instead of > just to you. > BTW, I thought I was kinda lost about that post, too. > > --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 14:09:38 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Personally - I say go ahead - because how much of the stuff from LC is really possible anyway? I mean come on - light thingies that transfer all the knowledge in the world to you as long your're holding a pen, space stations (well, maybe that one's not so far fetched), gun things that make molecules disintingrate, time travel with HG Wells, the list goes on and you can't forget the whole alien/superhero disguised as a mild mannered reporter thing - I mean who's going to believe all that? I think your room will be fine! *VBG* CM ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 12:26:15 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: lcfic Subject: Message Board Index Update through February 16 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi FoLCs! Hope you enjoy our Valentine's Week edition with lots of new stories begun and quite a few vignettes, a new story part, and a couple of completed stories all this week on Zoom's message board! Links at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Meteor/7378/lnc.html Thanks to Jo, authors, and others who did a few TOC's this week! New stories this week: BE MY KAL-ENTINE COMPLETE VIGNETTE RAGGIEMOM (AKA MISSY GALLANT) CATSPAW (REVISED EDITION): TARA SMITH (AKA STARKITTY) FIRST NIGHT: CAROL MONCADO THE HAND THAT ROCKS: PINTOFOLC LOIS AND CLARK AND THE IRS: CAROL MONCADO LOIS AND CLARK AND VALENTINE'S DAY I COMPLETE VIGNETTE CAROL MONCADO LOIS AND CLARK AND VALENTINE'S DAY II COMPLETE VIGNETTE CAROL MONCADO TEMPTATION OR OPPORTUNITY: BRENDA A VALENTINE VIGNETTE COMPLETE VIGNETTE NAN SMITH VALENTINE'S DAY RULES COMPLETE VIGNETTE GERRY ANKLEWICZ New part(s) posted: THE LONG WAY HOME: CHRISH PURITY: YVONNE CONNELL Completed stories this week: TOC: THE DEVIL'S BARGAIN COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS FUGUE: SHAYNE TERRY New TOC's TOC: ABDICATION OF RESPONSIBILTY COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: ARE YOU LONESOME TONIGHT...? COMPLETE LABRAT TOC: CAPED FEAR COMPLETE LABRAT TOC: A CONSCIOUS CHOICE – THE MORNING AFTER COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: DANCE OF THE SEVEN CAPES COMPLETE KAETHEL TOC: DEAR LOIS COMPLETE SHAYNE TERRY TOC: THE DEVIL'S BARGAIN COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: THE EXODUS I COMPLETE THANATOS TOC: FATE WORSE THAN DEATH COMPLETE PAM JERNIGAN TOC: FAUX PAS COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: FOR THE GREATER GOOD COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: GALE FORCE WINDS COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: THE HEALING TIME COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: HEARTACHE TONIGHT COMPLETE THE GERMAN RR GROUP (VARIOUS) TOC: HEARTS AND DIAMONDS COMPLETE SHAYNE TERRY TOC: HIDE IN PLANE SIGHT COMPLETE IRC RR TEAM (VARIOUS) TOC: HIDING IN THE SHADOWS COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: HOW I SPENT MY SUMMER VACATION COMPLETE CINDY LEUCH TOC: IN ANY UNIVERSE COMPLETE PAM JERNIGAN TOC: JUST ANOTHER UNDERCOVER ASSIGNMENT COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: JUST LIKE THAT/BEING LOIS LANE COMPLETE PAM JERNIGAN TOC: KNOCKING ON HEAVEN'S DOOR COMPLETE NICOLE WOLFE (AKA CKGROUPIE) TOC: THE LONG WAY HOME SERIALISED IN 11 PARTS INCOMPLETE CHRISH TOC: NAKED TRUTH COMPLETE KAETHEL TOC: NEAR WILD HEAVEN: HALF A WORLD AWAY COMPLETE KAETHEL TOC: THE PENFRIEND COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: PERSONAL LOYALTIES COMPLETE CINDY LEUCH TOC: PHEROMONE MY LOVELY – OH, BOY & SEQUEL COMPLETE TANK WILSON AND JANE DOE (AKA WENDY RICHARDS) TOC: PROFESSIONAL LOYALTIES COMPLETE CINDY LEUCH TOC: REDEMPTION COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: SHATTERED ILLUSIONS COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: THE SPYING GAME COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: SO STRONG A FOUNDATION COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS TOC: SOLAR ECLIPSE COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: STARFIRE AND SUNSTORM COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: STRANGE VISITOR REVISITED COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK AND WENDY RICHARDS TOC: TALES OUT OF CHURCH COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: TRADING PLACES COMPLETE IRENE DUTCHAK TOC: WHEN FRIENDS BECOME LOVERS COMPLETE KATHY BROWN AND DEMI TOC: WHEN LIGHTNING STRIKES TWICE COMPLETE WENDY RICHARDS Added to the Archive this week: Trial by Empress by Phil Atcliffe Enjoy! Dawn & the Index Crew __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 15:51:15 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit << Personally - I say go ahead - because how much of the stuff from LC is really possible anyway? >> I'm definitely with Carol on this one! Obviously viewers/readers have to suspend their disbelief since men can't fly and Superman (unfortunately) doesn't exist. Some of the most interesting fanfics I've read have been based on impossible circumstances (I'm thinking of Zoomway's Counter Clarkwise). << I mean come on - light thingies that transfer all the knowledge in the world to you as long your're holding a pen, space stations (well, maybe that one's not so far fetched), gun things that make molecules disintingrate, time travel with HG Wells, the list goes on >> Lately I've been rewatching the series, from beginning to end, an episode every few days, and I've actually been a little surprised at all the fake/bad science that's been used as plot devices. Now, I know sometimes it's necessary to bend reality for the sake of the plot, but I wonder whether the writers could ever have just researched *real* science and used *real* scientific issues to construct their plots. Oh, well, I guess if I want real science I should stick to PBS and the Discover Channel... Christy (rushing to get her Kerth nominees in before tomorrow's deadline!) attalanta@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:06:04 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: JaT Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: <2d.7979eb3.27c03e43@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Besides, you could come up with your own 'Real' science... NASA's new anti-gravity room, based on Dr. Benard Klein's studies of Superman's interaction with his environment, was finally ready for testing... See, it doesn't take much to make your own 'real' science. James ===== World's Wisdom (a bumper sticker): He who dies with the most toys wins. God's Wisdom (Luke 12:15b): Be careful and guard against all kinds of greed. Life is not measured by how much one owns. NCV 7 Days of Superman-Finished!http://www.geocities.com/mr_d8a/7dos.htm WIP for Elisabeth: Story of a Lifetime-TOC http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003563.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:08:03 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: JaT Subject: FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname In-Reply-To: <2d.7979eb3.27c03e43@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I know that the New York is called the Big Apple. I vaguely remember a referance in Comic Bookdom to Metropolis nickname. Does anybody know what it is? James ===== World's Wisdom (a bumper sticker): He who dies with the most toys wins. God's Wisdom (Luke 12:15b): Be careful and guard against all kinds of greed. Life is not measured by how much one owns. NCV 7 Days of Superman-Finished!http://www.geocities.com/mr_d8a/7dos.htm WIP for Elisabeth: Story of a Lifetime-TOC http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003563.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:11:08 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nancy Smith Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bethy, I used the idea in my "Home" stories. The idea of anti-gravity and artificial gravity is all over science fiction, so I don't see any reason you can't use it. Nan Bethy Em wrote: > Thanks to Nan, Merilyn (that website was very informative and interesting, > too), James, Carol, Xenophon (carried away is no problem -- and no I don't > mind! I was thrilled with the examples you gave), Liz, and Debby for all > your helpful information. > > Unfortunately, though the Vomit Comet is fascinating, it means I have to > rework some of the theories in my story. :-( Is it even conceivable that > someday there would be some sort of technology that could exert a force > within a contained area to 'counteract' the force of gravity (like if you > have two hands pushing against each other, neither goes anywhere because > there is no excess force? Gravity would fight this force and allow the > people in that area to experience weightlessness)? > > Even if it isn't conceivable, I think I'm gonna use it anyway! :-þ It's > basically vital to my premise. Oh well, I'll just warn the 'correct science > obsessed' away from this story. > > Thanks again, > > Bethy > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 14:59:30 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Debby Subject: Re: FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname In-Reply-To: <20010217210803.86326.qmail@web12103.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:08 PM 02/17/2001 -0800, you wrote: >I know that the New York is called the Big Apple. > I vaguely remember a referance in Comic Bookdom >to Metropolis nickname. > >Does anybody know what it is? > >James The city that really *needs* a Superman...? Villains--stay away ? Debby huitziln@cais.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 09:24:20 +1100 Reply-To: "jenerator@ozemail.com.au" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jen Stosser Subject: Re: FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's called the Big Apricot in the comics, tho' I think that sounds incredibly dorky! Jen jenerator@ozemail.com.au -*-This message is umop ap!sdn (Jenerator or Some1Else on IRC) -*- JenerEight on AIM -Photos of David (8) and Megan (5) on the Stosser Family HomePage http//www.geocities.com/j_stosser Please sign our guestbook! -----Original Message----- From: JaT [SMTP:mr_d8a@YAHOO.COM] Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 8:08 AM To: LOISCLA-GENERAL-L@LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU Subject: [LOISCLA-GENERAL-L] FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname I know that the New York is called the Big Apple. I vaguely remember a referance in Comic Bookdom to Metropolis nickname. Does anybody know what it is? James ===== World's Wisdom (a bumper sticker): He who dies with the most toys wins. God's Wisdom (Luke 12:15b): Be careful and guard against all kinds of greed. Life is not measured by how much one owns. NCV 7 Days of Superman-Finished!http://www.geocities.com/mr_d8a/7dos.htm WIP for Elisabeth: Story of a Lifetime-TOC http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003563.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 10:20:42 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: btinternetmail Subject: Re: FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I remember in the Supergirl film, it was referred to as The Big Apricot, but I don't remember any other nickname being used anywhere. Regards EileenB ----- Original Message ----- From: "JaT" To: Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 9:08 PM Subject: FanFic Question - Metropolis' nickname > I know that the New York is called the Big Apple. > I vaguely remember a referance in Comic Bookdom > to Metropolis nickname. > > Does anybody know what it is? > > James > > > ===== > World's Wisdom (a bumper sticker): He who dies with the most toys wins. > God's Wisdom (Luke 12:15b): Be careful and guard against all kinds of greed. Life is not measured by how much one owns. NCV > > 7 Days of Superman-Finished!http://www.geocities.com/mr_d8a/7dos.htm > WIP for Elisabeth: Story of a Lifetime-TOC http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003563.html > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 > a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 15:36:01 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Debby Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable At 07:25 PM 02/17/2001 +0000, you wrote: >...Is it even conceivable that >someday there would be some sort of technology that could exert a force >within a contained area to 'counteract' the force of gravity (like if you >have two hands pushing against each other, neither goes anywhere because >there is no excess force? Gravity would fight this force and allow the >people in that area to experience weightlessness)? We're talking about a man who can fly. Whatever you (and, say, Dr. Klein and any mad scientist and sidekick?) come up with is okay with us! >Even if it isn't conceivable, I think I'm gonna use it anyway! :-=FE It's >basically vital to my premise. Oh well, I'll just warn the 'correct= science >obsessed' away from this story. Just write it as though it were correct, and we'll all fall for it :) >Thanks again, > >Bethy Debby huitziln@cais.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 16:46:29 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Hazel Subject: Writing challenge, anyone? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed A writing list from a different genre recently posted the following challenge: Write a ficlet of exactly 150 words that begins with one of the following two sentences: 1. Wind roared past his ears as he plummeted at breakneck speed toward the pavement. 2. The window exploded in a shower of glass. The challenge stipulated that the characters in the ficlet could be anyone in the DC Universe. Three guesses which two characters I chose. :) Actually, I was amused to see how well these two sentences can fit into FoLC fanfic. So I am throwing the challenge to everyone on this list. It can't take much of your time, anyway -- hey, do you think *Wendy* could manage a story that is exactly150 words long? Her stories are often 1,000 times that length! ;) Anyway, here's my version, tentatively titled "Routine." Enjoy! *** The window exploded in a shower of glass. Again. Lois Lane rolled her eyes as a spandex-clad figure rolled to its feet. "Mwa-ha-ha!" it began, adopting a menacing posture. "Prepare -" Lois interrupted, her voice long-suffering. "Are you the new villain of the week?" The figure paused, uncertain. It hadn't expected this reaction. "And you owe me sixty-seven fifty for the window," she added. "What?" "The window," Lois repeated. "I've had people crash through it so often that I already know exactly how much it costs to replace. Will that be cash or check?" The figure stood there, mouth agape. Then, deciding that were easier people to threaten, it quickly mumbled an apology and dived back out the window. Clark Kent looked up from his newspaper and grinned. "It's a good thing you're not a superhero, honey. The rest of us would be out of a job in a week." *** Next...? :) _______ "Lots of little Bigwigs, Hazel! Think of that, and tremble!" ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 11:59:31 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Kerth Deadline Today! Nominate now! Just a quick reminder to everyone that Erin is accepting nominations for the 2001 Kerth Awards ballot for the rest of the day today -- Sunday, February 18 -- and no later! If you haven't nominated your favorite stories for next month's Kerth Awards, fire up your email program now. The top nomination-getters will be placed on the ballot, and voting will begin soon. To nominate your favorite stories, check out Erin's Kerth page at: http://www.ida.net/users/davek/kerths.html Scroll down to the bottom to find the links, and click on "Nominating Stories" to get to the FAQ. Then send Erin an email at with the subject line "Kerth Nomination". Do it today! :) Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 10:09:28 -0700 Reply-To: erink@ida.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Erin Klingler Subject: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Title: The Marriage Pact By: Erin Klingler Rated: PG Feedback: Any and all would be great, public or private. :) Author's note: This story takes place very early first season, after "Strange Visitor" but before "Honeymoon in Metropolis." It's all fluff; no A-plot, villains or intense drama. Just a fun little story I got inspired to write Friday afternoon. I hope you like it. :) ********** "I swear, I'm never going out on another date as long as I live!" Lois angrily informed Clark the second he answered her impatient pounding on his apartment door, then pushed her way past him into his apartment without even waiting for an invitation. "Hello to you, too," Clark answered pointedly, though inwardly he knew he wasn't as irritated by her dramatic, theatrical entrance as he made himself sound. He slowly closed the door and followed her down the steps to the living room. "Lois, do you have any idea what time it is?" "Late. I don't know," Lois grumbled as she tore her coat off and threw it onto the closest chair where it barely clung to the armrest. Then she continued to storm her way through his apartment, heading for the kitchen. Without thinking twice, she jerked open the fridge and quickly rummaged through its contents until she found a can of soda and pulled it from the shelf. Clark grinned. "Help yourself, Lois," he teased, watching as she popped the top and took a long drink. He perched on the arm of the chair that was now doubling as Lois' own personal coat rack and watched her angry movements with amusement. He loved watching her tirades. She was famous for them. They scared most everyone who'd ever been unlucky enough to be around when something set her off, but Clark...well, to him, it was just part of what made her the spontaneous, fiery, determined woman that he loved. Even if she didn't know about his true feelings for her. Just then Lois set the soda can down on the counter hard, causing some of the sugary liquid to splash out of the top and dribble across her hand. She then muttered a curse word under her breath and turned to the sink to wash it off. Clark's grin widened. She was really on a rampage tonight. He stood up and made his way across the room toward her. "I take it your date with what's-his-name didn't go so well." "Jeff," Lois spat out, turning on the waterspout with an angry twist of her hand. "His name's Jeff. And if you must know, no, it *didn't* go well." "Dare I ask what happened?" If possible, Lois' anger seemed to grow even more as she finished running her hand under the water and turned off the stream. She snatched a nearby dishtowel from the counter and was silent for a moment as she dried her hands with quick, vicious movements. "Oh, let me tell you," she finally answered, sarcasm oozing with every word. "The evening started off fine. You know, dinner in a candlelit restaurant, mood music, the whole nine yards. But by the time dessert came, he started in on me. 'Had I ever thought of settling down, getting married, having kids?' He even went as far as to suggest that one day I should think about giving up my career as a journalist so I could stay home with the kids, since it was the man's job to provide for the family!" Clark grimaced. This Jeff guy didn't know her very well, did he? Not that there was anything wrong with quitting one's job to stay home to raise children, but with Lois...well, he could never see her doing that. She just wasn't the domestic type. 'And how suicidal of Jeff to suggest it,' he thought with a self-satisfied smile. He wanted to ask, but almost hated to. Finally, though, his curiosity won out. "So what did you do to him?" The corner of Lois' mouth twitched. It was the first hint of a smile he'd seen from her since she'd arrived. Very slowly, as if savoring the words to come, she announced, "I stood up, grabbed my glass of wine, poured it over his head and then left." Clark couldn't help it. He started to laugh. He knew he should've felt sorry for the guy, but he honestly couldn't help it. If he'd learned anything from being around Lois, it was that she didn't stand for chauvinism. Or for being told what to do, for that matter. He didn't know whether to reprimand her or to hug her. When he was finally able to stop laughing, he wiped a tear from his cheek. "Oh, Lois, you didn't! What did he do?" This time Lois' smile was genuine. "He turned as red as his tie and looked like he wanted to disappear off the face of the Earth." "I don't blame him." "Neither do I," Lois admitted, visually relaxing in Clark's friendly presence. "But I don't think I'll have to worry about him suggesting such a thing ever again." "Or asking you out, for that matter," Clark pointed out. "Precisely." Lois's grin broadened as she looked at Clark. But then the realization of the disastrous night seemed to take over, and her expression turned sad. She heaved a heavy sigh and pushed past him on her way to his couch, where she slumped down dejectedly and let her head fall back against the cushions as she stared up at the ceiling. Clark cautiously traced her steps and sat down beside her. "You okay?" he asked sincerely. "Oh, Clark," she replied with another heavy sigh. "Isn't there a single decent man in this world? Someone who's not chauvinistic, self-centered, and controlling?" 'I'm not like that!' he wanted to shout. 'We'd be perfect together if you'd just give us a chance.' But he knew he couldn't tell her that. Not yet, anyway. She wasn't ready to accept it. But still, he thought with a devious smile, it couldn't hurt to give himself a little plug. "Not all men are like that, Lois," he told her truthfully. "*I'm* not like that." Surprised by his proclamation, Lois pulled her head up from off the back of the couch and turned to look at him thoughtfully. She seemed to be mulling over his announcement in her mind for a long time, staring at him and studying his face and features intently. "No, I guess you aren't like that, Clark," she admitted. "You have kind of an old-fashioned charm that could actually be attractive to a girl." "Gee, thanks, Lois," Clark responded dryly, though he was secretively thrilled at her compliment. "No, I didn't mean that," Lois hurried to explain. "It's just...you're different from the guys I've gone out with. Maybe that's why we get along so well. You don't tell me what to do, and I let you live," she finished with a teasing grin. "Well, you see, I learned those survival skills early," he joked back, a smile spreading across his face and brightening his features. "People always said I was a quick study. And now I can see that that was a good thing." She started to laugh, and he joined in. A moment later, their laughter faded, and Lois let her head fall onto Clark's shoulder. In response, he slid his arm around her shoulders and fingered the silky fabric of her short-sleeved dress. Feeling totally relaxed and much happier, she closed her eyes and sighed contentedly. "Mmmm, this is so nice," she murmured dreamily. "Why can't life always feel like this, Clark? I always feel so happy around you, so at ease. You know, now that I think about it, I don't think I've ever felt this comfortable around anybody my entire life. Why is that?" Clark opened his mouth to respond, but nothing came out. What *could* he say? That some force in the universe was trying to tell her how much they were meant to be together, that he loved her, that their strengths and weaknesses complimented the other's so perfectly, and that she'd be crazy not to marry him and live happily ever after? But on the other hand, hearing her say such a thing was a good sign, wasn't it? That maybe it meant she was starting to see him for more than just a partner and a friend? That maybe there was hope for them to be together someday after all? But before he could think of how to respond to her somewhat rhetorical question, the seriousness in her expression melted into one of light-hearted casualness. "I have an idea," she stated decisively as she pushed herself off his shoulder and sat upright, clearly about to enlighten him with her suggestion. "What do you say that we make a marriage pact?" Clark looked confused. "A marriage pact?" "Yeah, you know...if neither of us are married by the time we're forty, we marry each other." Clark's jaw dropped. Did she just say what he thought she'd said? 'A marriage pact,' she'd called it. Was she serious? Finally, he was able to force his jaw shut and he cleared his throat. "What--um, Lois, are you serious?" he stammered, not sure how to interpret this latest idea of hers. Granted, she'd come up with some doozies before, but this one hit close to his heart. How was he supposed to interpret her suggestion? "Yes, I'm serious." Seeing that he wasn't immediately enraptured with the idea and in need of convincing, she hurried on. "I mean, look at the facts." She started to count off each example on her fingers as she listed them. "One, we're good friends. Two, we get along surprisingly well. Three, you already know I have a violent temper and am prone to sudden outbursts and impulsive, illegal schemes, and you still like me." She grinned at him, and he couldn't help grinning back. "And four, well, you're a pretty handsome guy, and I'm an attractive woman. On paper, we're perfect for each other." He laughed. "How can I argue with that? But you realize, Lois, that people don't usually get married because their relationship 'looks good on paper.'" "Well, I know that," Lois quipped sarcastically. "But you have to admit, if we're forty and still single, we could do a lot worse than marrying each other." Just as he was about to start reprimanding her about not understanding the sanctity of marriage and explain that intimate relationships were based on love and respect, not some ridiculous if-we're-desperate-enough-we'll-just-marry-each-other pact, he suddenly stopped. A moment later, a devious smile started to cross his face. Hmmm. Maybe, just maybe, he could play this conversation to his advantage. Choosing his words carefully, he began, "I have to admit, you've got a point there," he told her, playing along. "But get married? That's such a big step, Lois, even if it's twelve years down the road. And besides, how can you talk about marriage? We haven't even...." Lois waited for him to finish, but when he didn't, she urged impatiently, "We haven't what?" "You know...kissed...or anything." Lois snorted. "Yes, we have! What about that time before Trask threw us out of that airplane?" Clark rolled his eyes. "That was a sham, Lois. A ruse. It didn't mean anything. I mean there has to be a real kiss. Something not done under false pretenses. Something that means something." Lois burst out laughing. "What are you talking about? We don't have to kiss first before we make a marriage pact!" "And how do you know?" he challenged, straightening up in his seat and looking her squarely in the eye. "Have you ever made a marriage pact before?" "Well, no...." "Ah-ha!" he declared triumphantly. "Then how do you know?" Realizing he had the upper hand, she rolled her eyes indignantly and sputtered, "What's the difference? Why is it so important to you that we have to kiss first?" "Because I'm not going to do something as important as entering into a marriage pact with someone I might be marrying in twelve years if we haven't even kissed, or know whether or not we're going to be sexually compatible." "*Sexually compatible!*" Lois yelled, jumping to her feet. "For crying out loud, Clark, we don't need to find out if we're sexually compatible for a marriage that may or may not happen in twelve years!" Clark wanted to laugh at her indignant outburst, but he bit his tongue to stop himself. Standing up next to her, he then forged on. "Lois, I'm just saying, if we're going to commit to potentially being married in twelve years, we should know if we're sexually compatible. Do you know how many relationships--not to mention marriages!--fail because the couple isn't sexually compatible? When I get married, it's going to be forever. My parents' marriage is forever, and they're still very much in love after all these years, and that's the way I want *my* marriage to be. So I'm just saying, I think it's important--" "Okay, Clark, okay!" Lois cut him off impatiently, waving her hand at him in an effort to silence him. "Fine, you win! Just stop babbling already. I mean, geez, you're worse than I am." She paused to take a couple of deep breaths. "So..." she began, eying him warily. "How exactly do you propose we find out if we're--" she tried to say the words again, but suddenly the air around her was heavy, her breathing felt shallow and shaky, and her hands felt clammy. She decided to just skip over the words completely, and continued on without saying it at all since it seemed to be having a strange effect on her. "Are we supposed to--" She stopped again, making a feeble gesture at the bedroom behind her. Clark noticed that her face had paled, and she looked more nervous than he'd ever seen her before. He started to chuckle. "No, Lois, of course not," he told her, putting her mind at ease. "Though the terror in your eyes at the idea of sleeping with me is certainly a huge boost for my ego." Lois' eyes widened, and she hurried to smooth over her reaction, stumbling over her words along the way. "Oh, Clark, I didn't mean that! I just meant that I hadn't thought about...doing...that...with you. I didn't mean to imply that you wouldn't be good...maybe even great...in bed...." Her face flushed bright with color at her own words as she saw the rather amused look on Clark's face, and she quickly stopped before she could embarrass herself even further. "Oh, never mind!" she spat out, flustered and irritated at her own reaction to the thought of intimacy with her partner and friend. She hurried on, eager to change the subject. "Well, if you want to kiss first before making the marriage pact to determine if we'd be 'sexually compatible'," she rolled her eyes at the words, "then fine. Let's get it over with." He looked at her standing there, with her hands on her hips and an indignant look on her face, and he started to laugh. "Oh, that's enthusiastic, Lois." "Well, what did you expect me to do, fall into your arms like some heroine from some disgusting romance novel?" "No, but the kiss has to be a real test, not some quick peck and a 'there-we-did-it' declaration," Clark told her. "How would we even know what a real kiss would be like if we don't honestly put some effort into it?" Lois softened, but didn't let her cool, indifferent composure down completely. "Fine," she agreed, letting her hands fall off her hips and hang lightly at her side. "So...do we just...." "Kiss?" Lois flinched. "Yeah." "Well, I guess so," Clark responded, suddenly overcome by a case of nerves. 'Great. Now she's got *me* going,' he grumbled to himself. They stood there staring at each other awkwardly for several moments until Clark couldn't stand it any longer. "Umm, maybe we should--" He made a nervous gesture toward her side, as if he was about to slip his arm around her, but then stopped. Lois noticed his reach, and awkwardly took a step closer to him. "Yeah, I guess we should be a little...closer...." Making a point not to look him in the eye, and wondering why she suddenly felt so uncomfortable with her partner and friend, she lifted her hand and placed it tentatively on his chest, jerked it back, then anxiously placed it back down again. Clark's heart nearly leapt out of his chest at her touch as it sent a shower of fiery sparks shooting through him, but he steeled himself and tried to force the rapid beating of his heart to slow. He took a deep breath and let it out slowly. 'Come on, Clark, calm down. This was your idea. Just kiss her, for cryin' out loud. Stop standing there looking like some ten-year-old boy ready to kiss a girl for his very first time. You're an adult. You're allowed to do this.' Listening to the voice, he lifted his arm from his side a second time and tentatively slid it around her waist. He took a half step closer to her until they were only a breath apart, and he wondered if she could hear his heart thudding furiously in his chest. He nervously slid his other arm around her waist, pressing his palms into the small of her back. Suddenly he realized she was shaking. Or maybe he was. It was hard to tell at this distance. All he knew was that this gorgeous, vivacious, spirited woman had such a devastating effect on him, and as he looked down at her, he was suddenly overcome by the beautiful sensation of her in his arms. It was all he could do not to declare his undying love and devotion to her right then and there. As if sensing his gaze, she suddenly raised her eyes to his, and he was surprised by the myriad of emotions he saw playing there: nervousness, anxiety, bashfulness, and yes, even a little eager anticipation. He paused. Did he really see that last one there, or was he just imagining it? He studied her eyes intently, and she finally held steady beneath his intense gaze. His pulse started to race. Yes, it was definitely there. She was actually as excited as he was at the prospect of their first real kiss. Giving in to the intense desire to kiss her, to show her rather than tell her how he felt about her, he slowly lowered his head to hers, closed his eyes in anticipation, and touched his lips lightly to hers. Suddenly the world around him seemed to disappear as they became one in the moment, and all that mattered to him was the feel of the woman in his arms, suddenly yielding, open, and most surprisingly, responsive. When the initial shock of what was happening wore off, Clark found her kiss heady, inviting, intoxicating. It was unlike anything he'd ever experienced before, and he knew in that instant, it wasn't enough. He wanted more. Tightening his arms around her, he pulled her even closer and let his instincts take over. Softening his lips against hers, he let them play over hers, nibbling, tasting, caressing. He couldn't get enough of the feel of her lips on his, gentle, supple and firm. As their kiss deepened, he heard her quick intake of breath, as if she was surprised by the intensity of the moment. He half expected her to pull away from him. But she surprised him by letting her body melt against him, yielding to his every touch. She moaned into his mouth, and his heart rate quickly doubled. Spurred on by her little sounds of pleasure, his tongue found its way between her parted lips and began to explore the tiny crevices of her mouth, before finally entwining his tongue with her own. When they finally pulled apart, Clark tried to figure out who had broken the kiss first, but through his heady daze, he was at a loss to remember. He gazed down lovingly into the brown eyes staring back into his, and was surprised to see that they were just as clouded by passion as his own. In that instant, he could see that their kiss had meant as much to her as it had to him. He took in her flushed cheeks and kiss-reddened lips, and he knew he would move heaven and earth to be with this woman who had captured his heart for the rest of eternity. All too soon, Lois broke the moment by stepping back, and in a flash, the open, yielding, accepting look in Lois' eyes was replaced by a shroud of emotions, none of which had been there moments before. The old Lois was back, and she was struggling for composure. "Well," she breathed, reaching down to smooth her rumpled dress and making a point of avoiding eye contact at all cost. "That was enlightening." She concentrated on her dress and pushing her hair back into place. When she finally regained her composure, she looked up into Clark's eyes. "So what's the verdict? Can we make that little marriage pact or what?" Clark couldn't find his voice for several seconds, then finally cleared his throat in an attempt to bring it back. "Um, yeah--" he stammered, trying to regain his own composure. "I think we can make the deal. You've convinced me." He flashed her a grin, trying to sound more casual than he felt after the earth-shattering moment he'd just experienced. Lois smiled in response, then forced a confidence she clearly didn't feel. Reaching out, she gave his chest a quick pat. "Don't look so stunned, farmboy," she purred, though it came out sounding entirely too nervous to achieve the desired effect. "I can tell the girls in Kansas must not kiss quite like that." Clark grinned. What could he say? He certainly wasn't about to deny it. "Well, I guess I should be going," Lois said with false casualness. Then, without a backward glance, she abruptly turned and started up the stairs to the front door, but then quickly stopped. "Oh, my coat," she mumbled, turning quickly to survey the room distractedly, looking for the article of clothing. When she spotted it, she hurried over to it, gave it a quick yank, which nearly sent the chair over backwards. She reached out a hand to steady the chair, then turned back to the stairs and caught the toe of her shoe on the top step. Clark was beside her in an instant, reaching for her elbow to prevent her from falling and steadying her as she regained her balance. As soon as she was steady on her feet, she hastily pulled her arm out of his hand and murmured an embarrassed 'goodnight' before opening the door and quickly closing it behind her. Clark laughed softly as he watched her leave. 'So much for her trying to play down the moment,' he thought. With a smile, he watched through the glass on the door and she hurried down the steps, climbed into her Jeep and sped away. Seeing that she was on her way home safely, Clark flicked the lock on his door, turned around and leaned heavily against it. Wow. He closed his eyes, mentally replaying every second of their kiss and savoring the moment. It was definitely a kiss he wouldn't soon forget. Apparently, neither would Lois. Clark opened his eyes and shook his head. Twelve years. Not that something drastic couldn't happen between them that could move things along between now and then. Stranger things had happened. But if not.... His mind again flashed back to the wonderful kiss he'd just shared with the woman of his dreams, the woman he loved more than life itself, the woman he'd just kissed with such intensity that he'd been surprised he'd even been able to keep his feet on the ground. He sighed deeply and pushed off from the door, heading for the bathroom. He needed a cold shower. If anything, it was going to be a very loooong twelve years. ~~The end. :) Erin :) __________________ erink@ida.net Visit my LNC/Kerth Website: www.ida.net/users/davek ***** "It's not the years that count, it's the moments...right now, as they happen." __________________ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 12:43:41 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: The Rupps Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Comments: cc: erink@ida.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Erin - That was wonderful! I haven't had the chance to read much fanfic in recent months - I'm glad a caught this one. It reminds me why I enjoyed the show so much. Amy rupp@netsync.net "Read, every day, something no one else is reading. Think, every day, something no one else is thinking. Do, every day, something no one else would be silly enough to do. It is bad for the mind to continually be part of unanimity." -Christopher Morley ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 13:07:51 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Erin, you posted this already!! I told people on IRC last night that they had a treat in store, and they certainly do. I loved this - a terrific blend of humour and mild angst and WAFFiness. Very funny, and a great read. So... do we all want to know now what happens in twelve years' time... or would twelve hours' time be more likely, after that kiss? Wendy --------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 13:20:39 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Fanfic Recommendations Today is a real treat, as far as new stories on the Archive are concerned. Those who are already hooked on Raconteur's Lifeflight will need no urging to read the excellent final part, so I'll say no more! Irene Dutchak's next-gen series is augmented by her wonderful, haunting Beyond a Shadow of a Doubt. This, and its sequel - yet to come - are among Irene's best stories yet, in my humble opinion. Get over there and read it! And then we also have a lovely story from ChrisH, Till There Was You. This is a very different, fascinating elseworld which I loved. The Lois and Clark we know well are essentially the same in character, but each has had very different experiences to the Lois and Clark we know from the series, and Chris handles these differences really well. So what are you waiting for?! Wendy ---------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 14:00:17 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Gerry Anklewicz Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Comments: To: erink@ida.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Wow! What a great little story Erin. I loved the humour and Clark's come back lines.Clark is so not a whimp: it was wonderful. I did wish that he would have said, "And how suicidal of Jeff to suggest it" out loud. I think Lois would have gotten a kick out of that one. Clark's reactions to the marriage pact were priceless. Thanks for a good read, Gerry ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 11:05:01 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Judith Williams Subject: Re: The Marriage Pact MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Erin: What a great story to start my day with! Well done. M-m-m-m. an incredible kiss. Gotta go find my hubby. ;) Jude ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 14:52:01 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kate Crane Subject: Re: Fanfic Recommendations MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks, Wendy! Tomorrow is a holiday here in the States and I am looking forward to a late morning in bed with some great fics. Kate ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 13:47:58 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: The Marriage Pact MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Erin - I loved it! I also want to know what happens - 12 years, 12 days, 12 hours! What?! CM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 14:09:16 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: Writing challenge, anyone? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Man, 150 words even! Who can write a story in a 150 words? Well, I tried. Here goes! ***** Wind roared past his ears as he plummeted at breakneck speed toward the pavement. Just before he reached the ground he turned, started back upwards - in his arms, a screaming woman. "Shh. Lois, it's okay. You're going to be all right." She cried. "What happened." "Lex. It was Lex. He. . .he. . ." "Honey, you know we saw him die." "Clark, he pushed me and I was falling and then you saved me. Again." "I'll always save you. You know that. This is the third time this week you've had this dream." "I know." "I wonder why." "Clark, I know why." Lois rubbed her stomach. "I'm scared about what my life could've been like, without you. And this child. And how glad I am to be married to you, instead of Luthor." They smiled. He held her, one hand on her stomach, as they went back to sleep. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 16:07:36 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oh, that's delightful, Erin!! Loved the kiss ;) And the ending line is terrific Thanks for posting it! -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ In America only the successful writer is important, in France all writers are important, in England no writer is important, in Australia you have to explain what a writer is. -- Geoffrey Cotterell ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 22:23:54 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Chiara P Subject: The weak point 1/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I hope you'll like this fic, but before I start posting, I have to thank a lot of people!!!! Ray, first (as every King of fdk deserves), Elena, Helene, Labby (you are always so patient with me!!!), and my new BRs Missy and Kylie!!!! Thanks guys!!! I would be really lost without you!!! And I also thanks all the people who made me wonderful cooment on Zoom's Message board!!!! Really they were great!!!!!! Then a little WARNING: in this story, Lois is badly hurt (physically), but I hope I didn't write it too crudely. Ok... let me know what you think. // indicate the thoughts /*/ indicate flashbacks and dreams The Weak Point "Clark... I'mmmm... I'mmmm... freeezzz....zzzing. It... it's... so... so.... cooooold!" "I know, honey, I know... " Clark had to make a real effort to move again; he had spent the last of his energy getting Lois to a safe place. Luckily this area was full of caves, but the problem was that they were all quite cold and damp. He tried to light a fire, but his heat vision, along with his other powers, had still not returned. Kryptonite exposure affected him differently each time it seemed. Sometimes the effects vanished very quickly, but this was not going to be one of those times. The contact he'd had this time had been quite intense. He knew it would be hours... perhaps days before they might return, but he knew that they would return to him. He had saved Lois, again, but this time he'd really risked everything. They had wanted to kill Superman, as usual, and kidnapping Lois was the easiest method to guarantee that he would come to them. She had been missing for three days... that could easily explain her condition. Who knew what they had put her through. "I'm so sleepy... let me sleep... just a little..." "Please, Lois... don't... you have to stay awake... Please!!!! Speak to me!!" "You always say I talk too much!" "I never said that!" "You've thought that..." Clark smiled in spite of his fears. *His* Lois was never going to change. "Lois... how about you tell me about your first article for the Planet?" //Please Lois...stay awake...// "No... now I just want to sleep!!!" God! She seemed as helpless as a baby... //Keep her safe... make it so she'll be able to keep going... at least until I'm able to get her back home... please...please.// Clark tried his heat vision again, this time he was able to emit a small burst of heat, but it wasn't enough. "Lois... you have to get out of these wet clothes!" "I can't... do it..." Lois made an enormous effort to speak more but she was unable to keep her bloodless lips from trembling. "Believe me... I don't want to do this... but you can't stay like this..." "I know..." Clark forced her to a sitting position, and he started to slip off the little jacket of her outfit. It came off quite easily, she helped him as much as she could. Next came her shoes, then he came to her skirt. The task started to become more arduous for him. It, too, slipped off quite easily considering how wet it was. Now Clark's hands started to tremble, but it was not from the cold. Swallowing became an effort as he started to unbutton her blouse... one button after the other. Slowly, trying not to think too much about the feeling of his body suggests an image of him lying on top of her, he continued with his task. "Lois... are you awake?" "I think so... I'm not going to die of frostbite, am I? I don't wanna die..." "Lois, I won't let that happen!" Lois smiled. "You've said that already... you remember? When the Prankster... threatened me...at your place... do you remember?" "It's true..." He held her in his arms as he slipped the blouse off her shoulders. "It's good to be in your arms... you know? I've always liked it..." "Lois..." How many times had Clark longed to hear these words from her, but now, they almost physically hurt him. "Lois..." "And I love the way you say my name..." "Stop it..." "I want to tell you these things," she whispered, trying to fight the uncontrollable shivers that were making her shake violently. "If I don't wake up tomorrow, I want you to know... " "Tomorrow you'll be better..." "Clark... my slip... it's too wet..." "Are you sure?" She nodded, trying to stay awake, it would be so easy to fall asleep... Clark took a deep breath as he started to slip the spaghetti straps of her slip off her shoulders. He knelt near her, slowly removing the undergarment from her body. Clark held her, noticing for the first time the marks she had all over her body. Abrasions and bruises covered the greater part of her body, especially around her wrists and ankles. He wondered what sort of tortures she had been suffering these last three days. "I never thought it would happen this way..." "What are you talking about?!" "I thought so many times... about being undressed by you... but I never thought it would be like this." Her voice was shaking from the sobs that now came from her. Clark held her tightly, in order to protect and comfort her, caressing her hair. "You're all wet, Clark" Clark laughed. "You have that right..." "You've got to undress yourself too, Clark, you're going to catch pneumonia..." Well, he knew that was not really possible, but until his body temperature was back to normal he wouldn't be able to warm Lois. He quickly slipped out of his shirt and trousers. His 'Suit' he had already removed before going to rescue Lois. He couldn't risk both their lives if somehow someone found out his other identity. They held each other. Clark tried every few minutes to warm her with his heat vision and every time it seemed he had a bit more intensity to the bursts he used. Almost without realizing it, both of them soon fell asleep. *** Clark woke after a couple of hours, it was still dark outside. Lois was still in his arms and he held her a little tighter in order to make her feel his presence. "Oh, my god, Lois!" Her body was burning up! She had to be running a very high fever. He called to her a few more times, he grabbed his shirt, which was still damp, and wiped it over Lois' face, trying to reduce her temperature. He blew on a small creating ice that he wrapped in his shirt, passing it over the body of the woman he loved. "Please, honey...Wake up...wake up... let me know that you're OK!" Clark stayed seated, holding her in his arms. He felt so helpless, he was the most powerful man in the world... and now he was unable to do anything. 'Please... let my powers come back...Please!!!!' Almost without realizing it, Clark started to rock back and forth, almost as if he were cradling her. Lois opened her eyes, almost without seeing him. "You know... I was brave... I didn't say anything... nothing..." "What do you mean?" "They... wanted to know... who Superman is... how I could contact him... they wanted me to call him so they could kill him... I didn't say anything..." Clark felt a deep pain in his heart: she got into all of this just to save her hero. He was responsible for what happened to her. What kind of people could do this to someone else! They tortured Lois and she didn't call Superman. "You were very brave... " he whispered "I didn't say it... I couldn't do it... I couldn't tell them that you are the only man in the world able to find him... one day you have to tell me how you do it..." Clark almost forgot to breath from shock. Lois had gone through this for *HIM* not for Superman! For Clark! Why? And how she was able to resist? Instinctively, Clark held her more tightly, as tight as he could without hurting her. Her body was so badly injured. But Lois was still talking "... and someday... I also want a house... and some babies..." Clark realized at that moment that she was raving because of the fever. "And I want a dog... and I want my son to have your eyes... and your smile... I love your smile... Oh, Clark..." "I'm here...I'm right here..." he reassured her, holding her tightly against himself. Lois felt the contact with his bare skin against her face. She turned her head and her mouth started looking for his. She explored his body, trying to reach his neck and mouth. She found his nipples and her tongue started to play with them. Her breath was hot on his skin. "Lois..." Clark's voice was husky and extraordinarily sexy, and in her confused state Lois was only able to feel the pleasure that contact with this male body made her feel. The salt taste that still covered their bodies made her crazy. Clark stopped her, raising her face until he was able to look into her eyes. They stared at each other for a long time, slowly their mouths moved closer until their lips brushed each other. At the beginning, it was a very light kiss, as if they wanted to be sure that they were safe and were no longer going to be hurt; then there was a second one, more passionate, sweet and furious at the same time. 'I have to stop her... I have to stop myself!' Clark's mind was screaming, but his body started moving of its own accord. They found each other, Lois by way of delirium and Clark by way of passion. And in that moment all the fear they had felt for each other in the last three days exploded. Both of them had been terrified they would never again see the person they loved. Dark, deep fears that now were been dissolving into their passionate kisses, and caresses and wonderful emotion. "I love you Clark... I love you so much..." Clark seemed to start at these words. He stopped in order to stare at her. "I love you too, Lois...more than anything in the world!" Lois started kissing him again, the heat rising from her body was intoxicating. When Clark's excitement became more than evident, he pulled himself away suddenly. "Clark Jerome Kent! What kind of man are you?" he cried out loud "You say that you love this woman more than life itself and then you take advantage of her this way! You are a rat!" Clark almost cried to him self, then he turned to Lois. "I'm going to get you out of here... I still don't know how yet... but I'm going to take you away from here... I promise!!!!" Lois just kept whispering his name and other words he was unable to understand. He got up suddenly. "Think Clark... think... OK! I've got to get her covered!!! Her clothes, try to dry her clothes." Clark started to order himself aloud, as though speaking in this way, helped distract him from the lure of Lois' naked body. He grabbed them and, again using his heat vision, they were dry in a few moments. After drying his clothes in the same way, he quickly slipped his on, then approached Lois. Putting her clothes on was strangely easier, he tried to concentrate on what he had to do and not on the way her body reacted to his touch. Next he tried to float and he found he was able to do it with no problems. Metropolis wasn't that far, he would take her there then... no... he couldn't take her home. He was quite sure that Bureau 39's men would be lying in wait for them, watching both of their apartments. There was one place in the world... far from here, but safe, where he could take her. *** He held her in his embrace, Lois was completely senseless and her fever seemed to be climbing higher and higher. It was very painful for him to see her like this, but she would be safe in a few more minutes. A new day was already starting. The sun hadn't begun to rise when he'd left the cave, but he'd still been very prudent. He didn't have the Suit, he didn't want to risk leaving her alone while he went to get it, but he knew that the closer he came to Kansas, the safer they both were, no one was going to be waiting for them and it was still quite dark there. He opened the door a bit too roughly and it surrendered to his strength, barely remaining on its hinges. It was still night at the farm and his frightened parents hurried downstairs. In the doorway was Clark, pale from worry, with Lois in his arms. "She's hurt, very hurt... help me!" "Bring her to our bedroom... quickly! " Martha directed, and so he did. Martha sized up the situation and told Jonathan to get a basin of cold water and some towels. "Honey, why don't you go to sleep for a while? We'll call you if she wakes up. You seem to be going to pieces!" "It was the Kryptonite. I'll be better soon, don't worry. I'm not going to leave her..." "Then why don't you take a shower? While you're doing that, I'll get Lois undressed and try to get her fever down. Meanwhile your father will call the doctor." "I guess that's a good idea..." A few minutes later, Clark was back, clean and dressed. He stopped for a moment in front of his parents' door before he knocked. "Come in..." "I brought her a T-shirt, it's one of mine... she'll be more comfortable in it ." Martha smiled. "Good thinking. " Clark set it on the bed, turning his back in order to let his mother dress Lois without him seeing, though God only knew how much he wanted to. "Clark? I'm a little embarrassed asking you, but... would you give me a hand?" His eyes widened. "And don't look at me that way! This poor baby is full of bruises and who knows what else. I think I already hurt her enough undressing her..." "It's OK. I mean, I've done it before... I mean she was soaked... I had to undress her... it was too cold to let her stay dressed in the wet clothes and..." "Clark, you're babbling! You don't have to justify your actions... I'm more than sure you acted in the best way possible, now shut up and give me a hand!" Clark sat on the bed near Lois, slipping his arms around her. Martha kept the sheet firmly against Lois' body as Clark felt a drop of sweat rolling down his temple. Lois was completely and gorgeously naked under the sheet. Martha tried to hold back her smile, noticing her son's expression, while she made Lois' wear Clark's shirt. Instead of making her lie down again, Clark held her in his arms for a couple of minutes. From the moment they left the cave, Lois had not regained consciousness. Clark was quiet, listening to her heartbeat race because of the fever. Martha caressed his head and kissed him on the forehead. "I'll go make some coffee! I think we'll need some, Doc doesn't like being woken up in the middle of the night." They smiled at each other, then she left. It was almost half an hour later when the doctor arrived. Martha was still downstairs in the kitchen and ran towards his car as it pulled up. "Thanks for coming Doc, I'm sorry, but Lois seems to be very ill; and she has a high fever..." "Martha, if you give me hot coffee... well, I guess I can forgive you for getting me up so early!" "I'll take you upstairs and then I'll go get it for you!" Martha led the way, followed by the doctor and Jonathan. Just inside the door she stopped suddenly, tipping her head to one side as she exclaimed, "Aren't they cute?? They seem made for each other!!" The two men cautiously stretched their heads into the room. Lois and Clark were asleep, each embracing the other. Clark had fallen asleep on the blanket with his arms holding her to his chest. Lois' arms were above the sheet, one arm holding him around the waist and the other resting on the arm that was affectionately encircling her. The doctor looked at them. "Are they ever going to get together?" "If by tomorrow they aren't a couple... it'll mean that I don't understand anything about young people... It's very clear that they adore each other!" Martha caressed her son's shoulder. "Clark? Sweetie... the doctor is here... wake up." Clark opened his eyes and smiled at the woman he was holding, then he realized the situation and he moved, a bit embarrassed, from the bed. "I fell asleep..." "I can see that! Come on, we have to let Doc do his job." Jonathan almost had to push his son from the bedroom. *** Clark waited downstairs with his father without too much patience. The wait seemed endless. Eventually the doctor appeared on the stairs. "Relax, Clark, your *friend* is going to be fine. She just needs to rest awhile, and you too for that matter; you look pale. I gave your mother a prescription... your friend will feel a bit woozy when she wakes up. She's very bruised...looks like she's been kicked by a bull. Care to tell me what happened?" "It's a long story Doc..." "I have a lot of time!" "There are some people... who don't like Superman... unlike most people. Since he appeared they want him dead. They thought Lois knew how to contact Superman, or at least that they'd be able to lure him into a trap by making her call for help. I haven't a clue as to how they tried to persuade her... I... she was in their hands for three days..." " Okay, son, don't worry... she'll be fine. In a few hours she'll wake up and then she'll start behaving like that runaway locomotive we all remember." To be continued ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 22:26:58 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Chiara P Subject: The weak point 2/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Since I'm not sure I'll able to post tomorrow... this is the second part ^_^ Chiara ^_^ REMEMBER: // indicate the thoughts /*/ indicate flashbacks and dreams In the first part: "It's a long story Doc..." "I have a lot of time!" "There are some people... who don't like Superman... unlike most people. Since he appeared they want him dead. They thought Lois knew how to contact Superman, or at least that they'd be able to lure him into a trap by making her call for help. I haven't a clue as to how they tried to persuade her... I... she was in their hands for three days..." " Okay, son, don't worry... she'll be fine. In a few hours she'll wake up and then she'll start behaving like that runaway locomotive we all remember." 2nd part: Clark went back to his beloved Lois as soon as possible. Beyond his fear, he felt very guilty for what had happened to her. It was almost evening when Lois started to move with a moan. Clark looked at her and held her hand. "Hi." "Hi... how are you?" "I feel as if a truck ran me over." She paused a moment, looking around ."Where are we?" "Smallville." "How did we get here?" "It's a safe place." This seemed to be enough for her. Lois closed her eyes, breathing deeply with a moan, then suddenly she opened her eyes wide, staring at him. "You shouldn't have come looking for me... it was too dangerous!" "I didn't care, Lois... I could never leave you in the hands of those animals!" "I was so scared... " "I know, honey... " "Clark... " She stopped herself, looking into his eyes, then she dropped her gaze, biting her lip as she added without looking at him "Please... would you hold me?" Clark didn't make her repeat her request as he took her into his arms, holding her gently. Her body still smelled of the ocean. Trying to cuddle herself deeper into his arms. She was unable to hold back a moan of pain. Instinctively, Clark loosened his grip. "No..." came her answer, it was a moan, a prayer and a barely audible whisper. "Am I hurting you?" She shook her head, no. "I..." she said, hiding her head between his neck and shoulder. "I'd like to stay like this forever." "Lois...." "I know you don't feel anything for me... but..." she took a deep breath and continued, "I love you so much..." and then her mouth started to cover his neck with little, light kisses. Clark moved her back a couple of inches until he was able to look into her eyes. They stared at each other, silent for long moments, then without speaking, their mouths joined for a hot, passionate kiss. They moved back a bit in order to catch their breath then they moved forward to kiss again and again...and again. Their hands started to explore each other, tenderly, and their bodies, even separated by the uncomfortable blanket, strained to become closer. It was so extraordinarily different being in each other's arms. Different from any other they had met in their lives, excited and relaxed at the same time, both aware that it was possible to not be afraid of the other, both aware of how easy this was and how right it was to love each other. Their hands started to explore each other, tenderly, and their bodies, even separated by the uncomfortable blanket, strained to become closer. It was so extraordinarily different being in each other's arms. Different from anything and anyone they had met in their lives, excited and relaxed at the same time, both aware that it was possible to not be afraid of the other, both aware of how easy this was and how right it was to love the person they were holding . Suddenly Lois felt Clark stiffen and she looked at him. "What... did I do something...?" Clark stared at her for a moment and Lois was never so unsure of herself. "No!! My parents... they're coming up the stairs..." "How do you know?" At that same moment, the voices of the Kents became audible to her ears also. Lois just sighed, "Why now?!" She stopped and her eyes shone. "I like the way you taste, Kent. I guess I'll have to rewrite my three famous rules... Martha, Jonathan!" "Hi, Sweetheart... It's good to see you awake... how do you feel?" "Well, I can say that I feel better when I try not to breathe..." she answered, keeping hold of Clark's hand as if she were loathe to let him get away. Martha smiled at this gesture. "If you have the strength to joke, it means you're feeling better." "I'm fine, Martha, but I need a shower. It's been... how long was I held captive?" "I'd guess three days." "Three days?! I have to be in a pitiful state!" "You look wonderful!" Clark answered. "And you aren't very objective," she added, smiling. Martha stared at them; she could see the sparks darting between them. It was clear to her, the way Lois was looking at him, that she had reconciled her feelings for Clark. That first visit to Smallville, after Clark had almost died, she had looked at him differently for most of that afternoon, but she didn't have this look in her eyes then. She looked tired, that was very evident, but there was a new light shining in her eyes also. "Lois, sweetheart, I can give you some clean underwear, but I don't think my dresses would fit you. You'll have to be satisfied with some of Clark's things. They are a lot bigger and with the bandages and all the rest... you'll surely be more comfortable." "Thanks, Martha... " "Are you able to get to the bathroom?" "I think so... " She got up slowly, smiling in order to disguise the pain she felt throughout her body. Clark's shirt was too big for her, so it left her leg naked to midway down her thigh. "You see... you don't have to worry..." Then, suddenly everything went dark around her and she staggered violently as her legs collapsed under her. Clark took her in his arms and tried to take her back to bed. "Can you help me to the shower?" "Are you sure?" She nodded. "Martha... could you stay with me? I mean... if you aren't busy... " "Of course, Sweetie, everything else can wait!" "Thanks... " "You are welcome." Clark kept looking at her; Lois barely had the strength to open her eyes. "Listen, I'll put you in the bathtub... this way you won't need to stand, you can wash and dry yourself and then I'll take you right back to bed!" She smiled at him, nodding. "And I think your temperature is rising again." Martha approached her, kissing her on the forehead in order to check her temperature. "Yeah, maybe a little, but she'll feel better after a bath!" Clark set her in the bathtub and his mother followed them. Lois thanked him and in answer Clark gave her a light kiss on her lips. "I'll wait outside" She nodded and at that same time her stomach rumbled noisily. An embarrassed smile appeared on Lois' face "I guess I'm a bit hungry too..." she apologized. "Lois, when was the last time you ate?" "Mmm, let me think... Tuesday dinner... " "What?! Well, how about this, you have your bath and I'll go make something for you..." "Clark, if she hasn't eaten in so long, you have to make something light..." "I'll make the best chicken soup you've ever had in your life!" he said as he was going out the door. Lois smiled while Martha helped her to slip off the T-shirt and the bandages that the doctor had administered. Her ribs and back were almost scary, she had lots of livid marks on the area and some cuts besides. "You poor dear, what did they do to you...?" the older woman whispered. "Is the water OK?" "It's perfect, thanks. It's over, right? I mean Superman is safe, *Clark* is save" Martha stared at her awhile in order to try to understand why Lois had joined those two statements. "I was so worried for him, I mean for Clark, you have no idea how scared I was when I saw him on the bluff. I haven't a clue how he found us... Oh, God... I said horrible things about him. That thug and his men were there and they wanted to force me to call Superman, they were armed, and I had the precipice behind me, then suddenly I saw Clark and one of those crazy men had a rifle pointed at his back. They asked if he knew how to contact Superman... Clark looked at me... I felt as if I had died. It was like they had asked him to choose between me and his best friend... no, in fact that is what they did... I couldn't let him live with this guilt... I turned toward their leader and I started to laugh. He approached me and forced me closer to the edge of the precipice..." /*/ "What's so funny, b****?" "You want to know where *Superman* is and you ask a stupid farm boy? Look at him... he came here alone and unarmed... he's an imbecile!" /*/ "...I swear to you Martha, I never thought that about Clark... it was only in order to protect him... to make that man mad... He's a good reporter... he has great instincts... and he's so sweet... It was only to protect him!" "I know, Lois, and Clark knows it too, do you want to tell me what happened next?" "I kept laughing, saying the joke was on them, until he got angry and I fell down..." /*/ "You're very good at laughing... lets see if you're that good at crying!" the leader said as he turned toward his men. "Get the rifles with the Kryptonite rounds ready!" Then he turned to Lois. " Are you sure you don't want to tell us how to call that filthy alien?" Lois turned toward Clark with a horrified gaze, but then she smiled at him, and with a challenging gaze turned toward her captor. She knew she would be unable to bear new tortures, it was too big a risk. She turned towards Clark, lifting a hand in a small gesture of farewell, and then she simply stepped back over the precipice. /*/ "...One moment later Clark was there, he had thrown himself over too... " the tears started to roll down her cheeks uncontrollably, "...and then he was holding me tightly, and I felt so good... I was sure I was going to die... but I felt so good just being in his arms... then there was the impact with the water... it wasn't as violent as I expected... I guess Clark softened it for me with his body... but I haven't a clue how it could happen... then everything became confused... I can't remember what really happened, and what I dreamt... I can't remember..." "Honey, you had a fall from a great height and then you went into the ocean during this season when no one would think of going swimming. You were wet and tired and, judging by your stomach, very hungry..." Lois laughed, her stomach was making itself known again. "Everything will be all right... do you want me to wash your hair too?" "Yeah..." it was almost a prayer. "I feel like a salt statue!" When she felt the warm water flowing over her hair she moaned with pleasure. "I'm starting to feel... human again." *** Downstairs, Clark put the chicken in the broth to cook. He paid all his attention to it, even helping to bring the water to a boil with his heat vision. When this was ready, he put some spaghetti in with it. It had been quite some time since he had left Lois in the bathroom. He ran upstairs and walked into the bedroom. He heard the water running for a while and then it stopped. He didn't listen in, he refused to eavesdrop on whatever Lois and his mother had shared. He was planning to wait patiently for them when he realized that no one had thought about clothes for her. At that same time Martha opened the door. "Perfect, you're already here. Can you take her back to bed?" He walked slowly into the bathroom, Lois was trying to tie her robe firmly around her but every time she did this she winced from pain. Clark approached her, trying not to look where the robe had opened, letting him have a glimpse of her breast, almost completely bared to his gaze. Lois blushed, feeling herself lifted into his arms once again and she hid her face in his shoulder. How had she been able to fight these feelings for so long? At that moment, cradled in his arms, she felt like she was in paradise. "Your fever is rising again... you're hot! Now I'll get your dinner and then you're going back to sleep!!!" "Yes, Dad!!!" She stopped suddenly. "PERRY!... we have to call him! He'll be worried to death!!!" "We sent him an email... early this morning... it wasn't safe to phone." "When is this story going to end?" "You'll see... it'll end soon..." He made her lie down on the mattress. "I'd hoped it had ended with Trask's death..." Clark caressed her head. "I'll be back with Italian chicken soup..." and he was gone. She hadn't realized how quickly Clark could move. A couple of moments later he was back with a tray full of steaming soup, a large piece of bread, crackers, a carafe of water and a glass, some pieces of fruit and a slice of cake. Lois didn't eat very much, but it was enough to give her a bit more energy. She turned toward Martha and saw her yawn. "I'm sorry, I've stolen your bed... I can't stay here... you were both woken up very early and now..." "Lois, calm down... there is plenty of time before we have to sleep... and we'll manage what..." "I'll put her in my room, problem solved!" "No, Clark. You need sleep as much as I do!" "Lo-is..." "It's true!" "I'm going to sleep on the couch... don't worry... It's not a problem!" "Are you sure?" Clark rolled his eyes. "You know, I almost preferred it when you treated me bad!" he said, giving her a quick kiss on her lips. He slipped his hands under her and lifted her carefully in order to move her to his room. "Wow," she whispered. "What?!" "I find amazing the way you are able to lift me... I mean... you're not seeming to make any effort..." "Well, you aren't that heavy... and I am pretty strong!" "I didn't know you were also so... modest..." "You know... that's my best quality!" They both laughed as Clark's hand opened his bedroom door. "You are really very different when you are here in Smallville... like that last time... you were so... so relaxed." "I'm home... " Lois smiled, shivering. Clark took notice of this and saw that the robe she was wearing was a bit damp. He set her on the bed and got out a T-shirt and a pair of sleep shorts. Lois smiled, a little embarrassed. "Thanks... " "I'll wait outside while you dress... " Lois watched him leave the room. For the whole time, since she had left the bathroom, Clark had made every effort to avoid looking at her body where the robe parted and left her bare to his gaze, until she had stopped feeling embarrassed about it. But she realized it anyway and she dressed quickly. Her head was starting to spin a bit, but she tried not to think about it. When she was finished, Lois called to Clark. Clark made her lie down, almost forcing her to sleep. He watched her for almost an hour, then he silently went downstairs , switched on the PC and started to search the Internet looking for any information possible on the men who had done this to Lois. This time he had very few clues to start with. He was so worried for Lois. He didn't want her taking any more risks. He worked a couple of hours and then decided it was time get some sleep too. *** /*/ Lois had her notes in her hand while she waited for a cab outside the Planet that evening. She had worked at this article for the better part of the day. She had eaten a sandwich earlier and now she was starving. She decided she was going to order a pizza. Well, maybe a whole pizza was too much, but she could always save a slice or two for breakfast. Of course if Clark were with her she'd be even happier. It has been just a few days into his absence and she already realized just how important Clark was becoming in her life. He had been away almost a week, only two more days and he'd be back again. Good. Of course she was never going to admit that to him, but she felt so happy to be writing as a team, happier than she had felt her whole life. She asked herself how, that first day in Perry's office, she had been able to avoid noticing him. One thing was for sure, since she had looked into his chocolate-colored eyes her life hadn't been the same. Lois felt, rather than saw, the two men behind her, but as soon as she realized that, one of them had already caught her and the other was covering her mouth with a cloth. The strong smell emanating from the cloth made her feel suddenly tired. In a few seconds her eyes closed, her papers slipped from her hands, scattering on the ground. The men easily carried her to a waiting van that was parked quite close. Lois woke up some hours later, she was lying on the floor, her wrists tied behind her back while her ankles were tied with ropes. She started to wake up before she was able to open her eyes. She remembered that she hadn't come here and this was somewhere she had never been, the noises around her didn't seem familiar, or from any of the places she had ever been. She was able to hear a voice, a really threatening voice, that scared her more than she was ready to admit. "We have the reporter, we'll find some way to make her talk, you'll see... she's not so tough... scare her with some well placed blows and you'll see, she will tell us where we can find the alien..." Her brain came to full attention instantly. They wanted SUPERMAN!!! "I'd say by tomorrow we'll find him... and kill him. NO mercy..." Lois felt her heart explode. NO!!!, they wanted to kill her hero, her ideal man, the gentlest man on the planet. WHY?!?!?! She heard steps approaching. "Oh, our guest has woken up... we'll talk later!" Lois felt a man's grip on her arms and she was forced to get up. She stared at him and saw him laugh. "Don't look at me with that defiant look, baby... you still don't know who you're dealing with!" Lois didn't let her gaze drop. "We know you have quite a relationship with that alien, tell us where he is!" "The only thing I know that was alien was that sandwich I had for lunch!" The man slapped her in the face so hard that she fell to the ground, then, as before, he pulled her to her feet. "Tell us where the alien is! Or we are going to have to convince you!" "Superman is certainly more human than you!" Another blow, this time to her stomach. "People a lot stronger than you have tried to resist... none have been able to do it." "It's useless! I've never been able to contact Superman!" "Trask thought you were probably the only one who was able to contact him!" "Trask was a madman! He threw me out of a plane!" Another blow. "Just answer the question! If you are able to tell me how you contact Superman it means that his theory wasn't wrong." Lois wanted so much to call Superman, to be able to get away from this awful place, but the only thing that this man offered as help was the memory of Jason Trask. She turned to look around the room; spread around she saw many areas lighted by a sickly green glow. It could be only one thing: Kryptonite! Lois told herself that she had to avoid calling Superman at all costs. The world needed him a lot more than it needed her. In that moment she made the hardest decision of her life. to be continued ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 15:40:48 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: The weak point 2/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chiara - I love it! Can't wait for more! CM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 14:28:20 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Melisma Subject: Happy Birthday Nan and Wendy!!! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hey, we have some birthday authors today! I want to wish both of you a very happy day. And enjoy your noms - you deserve them :) Melisma (baking cakes under her Rock) Visit my rock at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 17:31:56 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Annette Ciotola Subject: New Showcase - 02/18/01 Comments: To: lcnfanfic@egroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Gang! No new fanfic this week (Let's go authors ;), but as the Kerth Nominations close this week and we get ready for voting, we'll continue with this year's possible Best New Author hopefulls. So head on over and check out the new Showcase at: http://www.annesplace.net/showcase/showcase.html Anne ;) Visit the Lois & Clark Nfic Archive www.annesplace.net "If something looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and talks like a duck ... chances are pretty good it is a duck." - Lois Lane; Strange Visitor From Another Planet "...Grab a bottle, hunker down and pray for daylight!" - Karen Walker; Guess Who's Not Coming to Dinner ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 15:17:07 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nancy Smith Subject: Re: Happy Birthday Nan and Wendy!!! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks, Mel. In a little while Chuck and I are off to celebrate at the Acapulco Mexican Restaurant. Love those traditional birthday Margaritas. . Nan Melisma wrote: > Hey, we have some birthday authors today! I want to wish both of you a very > happy day. And enjoy your noms - you deserve them :) > > Melisma (baking cakes under her Rock) > > Visit my rock at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 20:18:27 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Marilyn Puett Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Oh Erin! I just loved this. I always love when Lois runs to Clark after one of her bad dates (or interviews as Lucy likes to put it). This time you've put a particularly interesting spin on things. I do think you owe it to your faithful readers to follow up. And I don't mean in 12 years! We need to know NOW what happens between those two. Thanks for sharing! Marilyn >From: Erin Klingler >Reply-To: erink@ida.net >To: LOISCLA-GENERAL-L@LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU >Subject: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact >Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 10:09:28 -0700 > >Title: The Marriage Pact >By: Erin Klingler >Rated: PG >Feedback: Any and all would be great, public or private. :) > > >Author's note: This story takes place very early first season, after >"Strange >Visitor" but before "Honeymoon in Metropolis." It's all fluff; no A-plot, >villains or intense drama. Just a fun little story I got inspired to >write Friday afternoon. I hope you like it. :) > >********** > >"I swear, I'm never going out on another date as long as I live!" Lois >angrily >informed Clark the second he answered her impatient pounding on his >apartment >door, then pushed her way past him into his apartment without even waiting >for >an invitation. > >"Hello to you, too," Clark answered pointedly, though inwardly he knew he >wasn't as irritated by her dramatic, theatrical entrance as he made himself >sound. He slowly closed the door and followed her down the steps to the >living room. "Lois, do you have any idea what time it is?" > >"Late. I don't know," Lois grumbled as she tore her coat off and threw it >onto the closest chair where it barely clung to the armrest. Then she >continued to storm her way through his apartment, heading for the kitchen. >Without thinking twice, she jerked open the fridge and quickly rummaged >through its contents until she found a can of soda and pulled it from the >shelf. > >Clark grinned. "Help yourself, Lois," he teased, watching as she popped >the >top and took a long drink. > >He perched on the arm of the chair that was now doubling as Lois' own >personal >coat rack and watched her angry movements with amusement. He loved >watching >her tirades. She was famous for them. They scared most everyone who'd >ever >been unlucky enough to be around when something set her off, but >Clark...well, >to him, it was just part of what made her the spontaneous, fiery, >determined >woman that he loved. Even if she didn't know about his true feelings for >her. > >Just then Lois set the soda can down on the counter hard, causing some of >the >sugary liquid to splash out of the top and dribble across her hand. She >then >muttered a curse word under her breath and turned to the sink to wash it >off. > >Clark's grin widened. She was really on a rampage tonight. He stood up >and >made his way across the room toward her. "I take it your date with >what's-his-name didn't go so well." > >"Jeff," Lois spat out, turning on the waterspout with an angry twist of her >hand. "His name's Jeff. And if you must know, no, it *didn't* go well." > >"Dare I ask what happened?" > >If possible, Lois' anger seemed to grow even more as she finished running >her >hand under the water and turned off the stream. She snatched a nearby >dishtowel from the counter and was silent for a moment as she dried her >hands >with quick, vicious movements. > >"Oh, let me tell you," she finally answered, sarcasm oozing with every >word. >"The evening started off fine. You know, dinner in a candlelit restaurant, >mood music, the whole nine yards. But by the time dessert came, he started >in >on me. 'Had I ever thought of settling down, getting married, having >kids?' >He even went as far as to suggest that one day I should think about giving >up >my career as a journalist so I could stay home with the kids, since it was >the >man's job to provide for the family!" > >Clark grimaced. This Jeff guy didn't know her very well, did he? Not that >there was anything wrong with quitting one's job to stay home to raise >children, but with Lois...well, he could never see her doing that. She >just >wasn't the domestic type. 'And how suicidal of Jeff to suggest it,' he >thought with a self-satisfied smile. > >He wanted to ask, but almost hated to. Finally, though, his curiosity won >out. "So what did you do to him?" > >The corner of Lois' mouth twitched. It was the first hint of a smile he'd >seen >from her since she'd arrived. Very slowly, as if savoring the words to >come, >she announced, "I stood up, grabbed my glass of wine, poured it over his >head >and then left." > >Clark couldn't help it. He started to laugh. He knew he should've felt >sorry >for the guy, but he honestly couldn't help it. If he'd learned anything >from >being around Lois, it was that she didn't stand for chauvinism. Or for >being >told what to do, for that matter. He didn't know whether to reprimand her >or >to hug her. > >When he was finally able to stop laughing, he wiped a tear from his cheek. >"Oh, Lois, you didn't! What did he do?" > >This time Lois' smile was genuine. "He turned as red as his tie and looked >like he wanted to disappear off the face of the Earth." > >"I don't blame him." > >"Neither do I," Lois admitted, visually relaxing in Clark's friendly >presence. >"But I don't think I'll have to worry about him suggesting such a thing >ever >again." > >"Or asking you out, for that matter," Clark pointed out. > >"Precisely." Lois's grin broadened as she looked at Clark. But then the >realization of the disastrous night seemed to take over, and her expression >turned sad. She heaved a heavy sigh and pushed past him on her way to his >couch, where she slumped down dejectedly and let her head fall back against >the cushions as she stared up at the ceiling. > >Clark cautiously traced her steps and sat down beside her. "You okay?" he >asked sincerely. > >"Oh, Clark," she replied with another heavy sigh. "Isn't there a single >decent man in this world? Someone who's not chauvinistic, self-centered, >and >controlling?" > >'I'm not like that!' he wanted to shout. 'We'd be perfect together if >you'd >just give us a chance.' But he knew he couldn't tell her that. Not yet, >anyway. She wasn't ready to accept it. But still, he thought with a >devious >smile, it couldn't hurt to give himself a little plug. > >"Not all men are like that, Lois," he told her truthfully. "*I'm* not like >that." > >Surprised by his proclamation, Lois pulled her head up from off the back of >the couch and turned to look at him thoughtfully. She seemed to be mulling >over his announcement in her mind for a long time, staring at him and >studying >his face and features intently. > >"No, I guess you aren't like that, Clark," she admitted. "You have kind of >an >old-fashioned charm that could actually be attractive to a girl." > >"Gee, thanks, Lois," Clark responded dryly, though he was secretively >thrilled >at her compliment. > >"No, I didn't mean that," Lois hurried to explain. "It's just...you're >different from the guys I've gone out with. Maybe that's why we get along >so >well. You don't tell me what to do, and I let you live," she finished with >a >teasing grin. > >"Well, you see, I learned those survival skills early," he joked back, a >smile >spreading across his face and brightening his features. "People always >said I >was a quick study. And now I can see that that was a good thing." > >She started to laugh, and he joined in. A moment later, their laughter >faded, >and Lois let her head fall onto Clark's shoulder. In response, he slid his >arm around her shoulders and fingered the silky fabric of her short-sleeved >dress. Feeling totally relaxed and much happier, she closed her eyes and >sighed contentedly. > >"Mmmm, this is so nice," she murmured dreamily. "Why can't life always >feel >like this, Clark? I always feel so happy around you, so at ease. You >know, >now that I think about it, I don't think I've ever felt this comfortable >around anybody my entire life. Why is that?" > >Clark opened his mouth to respond, but nothing came out. What *could* he >say? >That some force in the universe was trying to tell her how much they were >meant to be together, that he loved her, that their strengths and >weaknesses >complimented the other's so perfectly, and that she'd be crazy not to marry >him and live happily ever after? > >But on the other hand, hearing her say such a thing was a good sign, wasn't >it? That maybe it meant she was starting to see him for more than just a >partner and a friend? That maybe there was hope for them to be together >someday after all? > >But before he could think of how to respond to her somewhat rhetorical >question, the seriousness in her expression melted into one of >light-hearted >casualness. > >"I have an idea," she stated decisively as she pushed herself off his >shoulder >and sat upright, clearly about to enlighten him with her suggestion. "What >do >you say that we make a marriage pact?" > >Clark looked confused. "A marriage pact?" > >"Yeah, you know...if neither of us are married by the time we're forty, we >marry each other." > >Clark's jaw dropped. Did she just say what he thought she'd said? 'A >marriage pact,' she'd called it. Was she serious? Finally, he was able to >force his jaw shut and he cleared his throat. > >"What--um, Lois, are you serious?" he stammered, not sure how to interpret >this latest idea of hers. Granted, she'd come up with some doozies before, >but this one hit close to his heart. How was he supposed to interpret her >suggestion? > >"Yes, I'm serious." Seeing that he wasn't immediately enraptured with the >idea and in need of convincing, she hurried on. "I mean, look at the >facts." >She started to count off each example on her fingers as she listed them. >"One, we're good friends. Two, we get along surprisingly well. Three, you >already know I have a violent temper and am prone to sudden outbursts and >impulsive, illegal schemes, and you still like me." She grinned at him, >and >he couldn't help grinning back. "And four, well, you're a pretty handsome >guy, and I'm an attractive woman. On paper, we're perfect for each other." > >He laughed. "How can I argue with that? But you realize, Lois, that >people >don't usually get married because their relationship 'looks good on >paper.'" > >"Well, I know that," Lois quipped sarcastically. "But you have to admit, >if >we're forty and still single, we could do a lot worse than marrying each >other." > >Just as he was about to start reprimanding her about not understanding the >sanctity of marriage and explain that intimate relationships were based on >love and respect, not some ridiculous >if-we're-desperate-enough-we'll-just-marry-each-other pact, he suddenly >stopped. A moment later, a devious smile started to cross his face. Hmmm. >Maybe, just maybe, he could play this conversation to his advantage. > >Choosing his words carefully, he began, "I have to admit, you've got a >point >there," he told her, playing along. "But get married? That's such a big >step, Lois, even if it's twelve years down the road. And besides, how can >you >talk about marriage? We haven't even...." > >Lois waited for him to finish, but when he didn't, she urged impatiently, >"We >haven't what?" > >"You know...kissed...or anything." > >Lois snorted. "Yes, we have! What about that time before Trask threw us >out >of that airplane?" > >Clark rolled his eyes. "That was a sham, Lois. A ruse. It didn't mean >anything. I mean there has to be a real kiss. Something not done under >false >pretenses. Something that means something." > >Lois burst out laughing. "What are you talking about? We don't have to >kiss >first before we make a marriage pact!" > >"And how do you know?" he challenged, straightening up in his seat and >looking >her squarely in the eye. "Have you ever made a marriage pact before?" > >"Well, no...." > >"Ah-ha!" he declared triumphantly. "Then how do you know?" > >Realizing he had the upper hand, she rolled her eyes indignantly and >sputtered, "What's the difference? Why is it so important to you that we >have >to kiss first?" > >"Because I'm not going to do something as important as entering into a >marriage pact with someone I might be marrying in twelve years if we >haven't >even kissed, or know whether or not we're going to be sexually compatible." > >"*Sexually compatible!*" Lois yelled, jumping to her feet. "For crying out >loud, Clark, we don't need to find out if we're sexually compatible for a >marriage that may or may not happen in twelve years!" > >Clark wanted to laugh at her indignant outburst, but he bit his tongue to >stop >himself. Standing up next to her, he then forged on. "Lois, I'm just >saying, >if we're going to commit to potentially being married in twelve years, we >should know if we're sexually compatible. Do you know how many >relationships--not to mention marriages!--fail because the couple isn't >sexually compatible? When I get married, it's going to be forever. My >parents' marriage is forever, and they're still very much in love after all >these years, and that's the way I want *my* marriage to be. So I'm just >saying, I think it's important--" > >"Okay, Clark, okay!" Lois cut him off impatiently, waving her hand at him >in >an effort to silence him. "Fine, you win! Just stop babbling already. I >mean, geez, you're worse than I am." > >She paused to take a couple of deep breaths. "So..." she began, eying him >warily. "How exactly do you propose we find out if we're--" she tried to >say >the words again, but suddenly the air around her was heavy, her breathing >felt >shallow and shaky, and her hands felt clammy. She decided to just skip >over >the words completely, and continued on without saying it at all since it >seemed to be having a strange effect on her. > >"Are we supposed to--" She stopped again, making a feeble gesture at the >bedroom behind her. > >Clark noticed that her face had paled, and she looked more nervous than >he'd >ever seen her before. He started to chuckle. "No, Lois, of course not," >he >told her, putting her mind at ease. "Though the terror in your eyes at the >idea of sleeping with me is certainly a huge boost for my ego." > >Lois' eyes widened, and she hurried to smooth over her reaction, stumbling >over her words along the way. "Oh, Clark, I didn't mean that! I just >meant >that I hadn't thought about...doing...that...with you. I didn't mean to >imply >that you wouldn't be good...maybe even great...in bed...." Her face >flushed >bright with color at her own words as she saw the rather amused look on >Clark's face, and she quickly stopped before she could embarrass herself >even >further. > >"Oh, never mind!" she spat out, flustered and irritated at her own reaction >to >the thought of intimacy with her partner and friend. She hurried on, eager >to >change the subject. "Well, if you want to kiss first before making the >marriage pact to determine if we'd be 'sexually compatible'," she rolled >her >eyes at the words, "then fine. Let's get it over with." > >He looked at her standing there, with her hands on her hips and an >indignant >look on her face, and he started to laugh. "Oh, that's enthusiastic, >Lois." > >"Well, what did you expect me to do, fall into your arms like some heroine >from some disgusting romance novel?" > >"No, but the kiss has to be a real test, not some quick peck and a >'there-we-did-it' declaration," Clark told her. "How would we even know >what >a real kiss would be like if we don't honestly put some effort into it?" > >Lois softened, but didn't let her cool, indifferent composure down >completely. >"Fine," she agreed, letting her hands fall off her hips and hang lightly at >her side. "So...do we just...." > >"Kiss?" > >Lois flinched. "Yeah." > >"Well, I guess so," Clark responded, suddenly overcome by a case of nerves. >'Great. Now she's got *me* going,' he grumbled to himself. > >They stood there staring at each other awkwardly for several moments until >Clark couldn't stand it any longer. "Umm, maybe we should--" He made a >nervous gesture toward her side, as if he was about to slip his arm around >her, but then stopped. > >Lois noticed his reach, and awkwardly took a step closer to him. "Yeah, I >guess we should be a little...closer...." Making a point not to look him >in >the eye, and wondering why she suddenly felt so uncomfortable with her >partner >and friend, she lifted her hand and placed it tentatively on his chest, >jerked >it back, then anxiously placed it back down again. > >Clark's heart nearly leapt out of his chest at her touch as it sent a >shower >of fiery sparks shooting through him, but he steeled himself and tried to >force the rapid beating of his heart to slow. He took a deep breath and >let >it out slowly. > >'Come on, Clark, calm down. This was your idea. Just kiss her, for cryin' >out loud. Stop standing there looking like some ten-year-old boy ready to >kiss a girl for his very first time. You're an adult. You're allowed to >do >this.' > >Listening to the voice, he lifted his arm from his side a second time and >tentatively slid it around her waist. He took a half step closer to her >until >they were only a breath apart, and he wondered if she could hear his heart >thudding furiously in his chest. He nervously slid his other arm around >her >waist, pressing his palms into the small of her back. Suddenly he realized >she was shaking. Or maybe he was. It was hard to tell at this distance. >All >he knew was that this gorgeous, vivacious, spirited woman had such a >devastating effect on him, and as he looked down at her, he was suddenly >overcome by the beautiful sensation of her in his arms. It was all he >could >do not to declare his undying love and devotion to her right then and >there. > >As if sensing his gaze, she suddenly raised her eyes to his, and he was >surprised by the myriad of emotions he saw playing there: nervousness, >anxiety, bashfulness, and yes, even a little eager anticipation. He >paused. >Did he really see that last one there, or was he just imagining it? He >studied her eyes intently, and she finally held steady beneath his intense >gaze. His pulse started to race. Yes, it was definitely there. She was >actually as excited as he was at the prospect of their first real kiss. > >Giving in to the intense desire to kiss her, to show her rather than tell >her >how he felt about her, he slowly lowered his head to hers, closed his eyes >in >anticipation, and touched his lips lightly to hers. > >Suddenly the world around him seemed to disappear as they became one in the >moment, and all that mattered to him was the feel of the woman in his arms, >suddenly yielding, open, and most surprisingly, responsive. When the >initial >shock of what was happening wore off, Clark found her kiss heady, inviting, >intoxicating. It was unlike anything he'd ever experienced before, and he >knew in that instant, it wasn't enough. He wanted more. > >Tightening his arms around her, he pulled her even closer and let his >instincts take over. Softening his lips against hers, he let them play >over >hers, nibbling, tasting, caressing. He couldn't get enough of the feel of >her >lips on his, gentle, supple and firm. As their kiss deepened, he heard her >quick intake of breath, as if she was surprised by the intensity of the >moment. He half expected her to pull away from him. But she surprised him >by >letting her body melt against him, yielding to his every touch. She moaned >into his mouth, and his heart rate quickly doubled. Spurred on by her >little >sounds of pleasure, his tongue found its way between her parted lips and >began >to explore the tiny crevices of her mouth, before finally entwining his >tongue >with her own. > >When they finally pulled apart, Clark tried to figure out who had broken >the >kiss first, but through his heady daze, he was at a loss to remember. He >gazed down lovingly into the brown eyes staring back into his, and was >surprised to see that they were just as clouded by passion as his own. In >that instant, he could see that their kiss had meant as much to her as it >had >to him. He took in her flushed cheeks and kiss-reddened lips, and he knew >he >would move heaven and earth to be with this woman who had captured his >heart >for the rest of eternity. > >All too soon, Lois broke the moment by stepping back, and in a flash, the >open, yielding, accepting look in Lois' eyes was replaced by a shroud of >emotions, none of which had been there moments before. The old Lois was >back, >and she was struggling for composure. > >"Well," she breathed, reaching down to smooth her rumpled dress and making >a >point of avoiding eye contact at all cost. "That was enlightening." She >concentrated on her dress and pushing her hair back into place. When she >finally regained her composure, she looked up into Clark's eyes. "So >what's >the verdict? Can we make that little marriage pact or what?" > >Clark couldn't find his voice for several seconds, then finally cleared his >throat in an attempt to bring it back. "Um, yeah--" he stammered, trying >to >regain his own composure. "I think we can make the deal. You've convinced >me." He flashed her a grin, trying to sound more casual than he felt after >the earth-shattering moment he'd just experienced. > >Lois smiled in response, then forced a confidence she clearly didn't feel. >Reaching out, she gave his chest a quick pat. "Don't look so stunned, >farmboy," she purred, though it came out sounding entirely too nervous to >achieve the desired effect. "I can tell the girls in Kansas must not kiss >quite like that." > >Clark grinned. What could he say? He certainly wasn't about to deny it. > >"Well, I guess I should be going," Lois said with false casualness. Then, >without a backward glance, she abruptly turned and started up the stairs to >the front door, but then quickly stopped. "Oh, my coat," she mumbled, >turning >quickly to survey the room distractedly, looking for the article of >clothing. >When she spotted it, she hurried over to it, gave it a quick yank, which >nearly sent the chair over backwards. She reached out a hand to steady the >chair, then turned back to the stairs and caught the toe of her shoe on the >top step. > >Clark was beside her in an instant, reaching for her elbow to prevent her >from >falling and steadying her as she regained her balance. As soon as she was >steady on her feet, she hastily pulled her arm out of his hand and murmured >an >embarrassed 'goodnight' before opening the door and quickly closing it >behind >her. > >Clark laughed softly as he watched her leave. 'So much for her trying to >play >down the moment,' he thought. With a smile, he watched through the glass >on >the door and she hurried down the steps, climbed into her Jeep and sped >away. >Seeing that she was on her way home safely, Clark flicked the lock on his >door, turned around and leaned heavily against it. > >Wow. > >He closed his eyes, mentally replaying every second of their kiss and >savoring >the moment. It was definitely a kiss he wouldn't soon forget. Apparently, >neither would Lois. > >Clark opened his eyes and shook his head. Twelve years. Not that >something >drastic couldn't happen between them that could move things along between >now >and then. Stranger things had happened. But if not.... > >His mind again flashed back to the wonderful kiss he'd just shared with the >woman of his dreams, the woman he loved more than life itself, the woman >he'd >just kissed with such intensity that he'd been surprised he'd even been >able >to keep his feet on the ground. > >He sighed deeply and pushed off from the door, heading for the bathroom. >He >needed a cold shower. If anything, it was going to be a very loooong >twelve >years. > > > >~~The end. :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Erin :) >__________________ >erink@ida.net >Visit my LNC/Kerth Website: www.ida.net/users/davek > ***** >"It's not the years that count, it's the moments...right now, as they >happen." >__________________ _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 22:32:18 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact LOL, Erin, here I've been feeling all sorry for you this week, picturing you buried in Kerth nominations ... and you've been writing magic like this! Great story ... very cute, very fun. Nicely done!! I loved how they both were completely shell-shocked over the kiss, but tried to pretend they weren't. I'd love to hear Lois's internal monolog on the trip home! LOL! Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 23:01:57 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Marilyn L. Puett" Subject: Re: New Showcase - 02/18/01 I know this is going to come across as horribly egotistical, but, golly, it was just SO exciting seeing my name on that Writer's Showcase page! And then to see it there alongside the names of FoLCS that I admire and respect just made it all the more special. Thanks Anne and all the others who help for the great site! Marilyn AKA Supermom ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 22:31:24 -0600 Reply-To: truitt22@flash.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: timothy truitt Organization: tnt technical services Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Comments: To: erink@ida.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Erin, I loved you story. Keep up the great writing. merry ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 23:29:47 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Margaret Brignell Subject: OT: LnC Cult TV??? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I was reading an interesting article in the local paper about old Canadian TV shows that now have cult status around the world. The paragraph that jumped out of the page at me said: > With a cult series, says Laurin, your work is no longer your own. It is > appropriated by the fans, he says, pointing to the phenomenon of "fan fiction" > or fanfic. When a show reaches a certain cult status -- usually after its gone > out of production -- Web sites spring up that are entirely devoted to sharing > fan-written stories based on the characters and themes of the shows. This sounded awfully familiar I seem to remember that the writers of LnC made a similar statement;) Elsewhere in the article it said that the cult viewer, or fan: > " is so fanatical that I just don't > have any communication with them. They know all kinds of stuff about the > show that I don't. They ran a trivia contest on the site a few years ago. You > know, Glenn and I wrote essentially every word of every episode on that > show, and I scored 50 per cent on their trivia contest." Since FoLC have pretty much always known more about the show than the writers ever seemed to, and "the volume of fanfic is way higher than the volume of produced show" does this mean that "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman" would now be considered cult TV? I hadn't really ever thought of it that way. If you want to read the whole article, it's entitled, "Cult TV: A Canadian arts export -- Shows forgotten at home spawn worldwide passion" and can be found at: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/entertainment/010217/5074216.html Margaret ****************************** Margaret Brignell brignell@sympatico.ca Ottawa, Canada %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% My fanfic now available at: http://www3.sympatico.ca/brignell/ ****************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 11:07:50 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Liz Stalker Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact Erin, I enjoyed your short story and just had to chuckle when Clark decided that before they make the pact, they should kiss to make sure about sexual compatibility! I was just sorry to see the story end. Thanks! Liz S. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 11:39:15 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: OT: LnC Cult TV??? On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 23:29:47 -0500, Margaret Brignell wrote: >Since FoLC have pretty much always known more about the show than the >writers ever seemed to, and "the volume of fanfic is way higher than the >volume of produced show" does this mean that "Lois and Clark: The New >Adventures of Superman" would now be considered cult TV? LOL! Thanks for the quotes from the article ... I'd definitely say that L&C has a cult following, especially since we have fans around the world and new ones continue to show up. :) Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 12:59:42 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kate Crane Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Erin, Love the marriage pact story.....let me join in with the others in clamouring for a sequel to this delightful fic! Kate ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 15:16:44 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Fanfic question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry - if this gets sent twice - computer problems! Working on yet another sequel to First Night. Okay, if one were to want to make a hut on a deserted island, complete with a homemade bed, how would one go about it? Well, actually, the hut isn't the issue, but can't a person (namely Supes) make a bed out of something that would be really even more comfortable than a mattress? I have heard of Indians in Canada and other places making beds out of pine boughs and of course on Gilligan's Island the skipper and Gilligan had hammocks, but the others had beds of some sort. Any ideas? Thanks! CM ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:01:03 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: ChiaraPrato Subject: The weak point 3/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit WARNING: Please be advised - there is physical violence in this section. // indicate the thoughts This is the sequel of flashback ^_^ *** Her chest, her back, her face, every part of her body was hurting. It had been going on for hours. Lois didn't care about the tears that she was sometimes unable to stop. Her only thought was not to cry out, in order to avoid having Superman hear her. The man in front of her started to become tired. Then suddenly he stopped her questioning and left. Her exhausted gaze followed him. He wasn't an ugly man. If only he had a better character. He was young and violent. She saw him joined by another man who had been spying on them through a one way mirror. It was darker than where Lois was but she knew someone else was there, She had seen the glow of his cigarettes during all her interrogation. And she was also able to hear the young man's angry voice, but it was too hard for her to concentrate on what they were speaking about. She was too tired. Lois felt as if she were going to faint, but she was tied so firmly that there was little chance that she would fall. She was unable to hear what was being said by the two men. She could see that the guy who was questioning her was quite angry. The other man had to be his superior. Both of them seemed to be a strange mix between a between gravediggers and FBI agents. Lois needed to suppress her fear so she tried to imagine them with funny ties on their dark clothes. Maybe ties with big pink pigs with blue jackets on them. Even Clark would refuse to wear such ties. And this thought made her smile. He had such strange taste in ties. She told herself that if she survived she would have to ask her friend why his choices were so bizzare... Who knew, maybe he was color blind. //Clark, I don't want it to end this way between us!!! Not this way!!! But I'm sure you'll understand!! Superman is your best friend! You'd do the same thing, wouldn't you?!// Lois didn't realize that she had fainted until a bucketful of ice water brought her suddenly to her senses. "Now, again. Where is Superman?" "I don't know!! I never knew that!! I've never been able to contact him!!!" "And who has saved you, up until now?" "It was just luck! HE came at the right moment..." "Ohhh, Really? And how do you think that happened?" "He told me once that he had really good hearing..." "Stop saying that b$%&*!" Lois took a deep breath without answering. The pain she was feeling helped her to make it, and she started to cough. "I want to know how to find him!" "I don't know!" "All right, if you don't know, then who does know?!" //Clark... no... I can't betray him!!!// But the fear in her eyes betrayed her thoughts. "Well then, you tell me who he is and we'll invite him to this fun little party! Tell us who he is and we'll let you go." "I don't know anyone able to contact Superman!!!!" Lois had a few seconds of not being able to draw a breath. The man had hit her with such force she thought her body wasn't going to be able to resist. She wondered how much more of this she could take. The man threw another bucket of ice water on her. All this water. She almost groaned when she felt all the water rolling down her body. It was a double torture. Cold and thirst. She was tempted to beg the man in front of her to let her drink. But it would be useless and this would put her in a worse situation. She knew this man would use this need against her. But now the cold was becoming even worse that the thirst. Trying to avoid shivering was impossible, and her wet clothes and the ropes were affecting her more then the water itself. Lois had the temptation to suck the water from her jacket, but the way she was tied impeded that. "You know, for a while there I believed you! Instead, now I'm starting to think you are covering for someone! And it's not only the Alien!" "But what has he done to you?" "He's an invader! He's the advance guard... but the others are going to arrive!" "His race is extinct!" "That's what he says!" "He's never lied!" "Really? Then where is he hiding?" "I don't know!" "Then he lied to you." "NO!" "Then you know where he is?" "No... but... " "If you don't know where the alien is then that means he's not honest with you... so he lied to you!" "He would never hurt us!" The man hit her once again "Sucker!" "You don't know him!! He's so HUMAN!! He loves this planet!" Another blow, this time it was so violent that it made her faint. *** Lois awoke hours later. She noticed that the light in her room had changed. She was cold and hungry. She eventually realized that she was alone and tried to free herself, but the more she tried to loosen the ropes, the tighter they became around her wrists. She heard the door open with a bang. "Oh, our guest is awake! Did you sleep well?!" Lois shot him a glance full of hate. "You'd better be careful with that look; you could kill someone!" he said mockingly. "If only I could do it!" She saw the man approach the column she was tied against. He was now in front of her, with a knife in his hands. "Do you want to do this the hard way?" There was no response from Lois. OK, as you prefer." Lois felt the cold of the blade against the skin of her neck, then felt the knife tip slide along her chest above her clothes, She held her breath when the cold blade touched her skin at the end of her shirt. She felt its iced tip run over her belly. The man now made it move under her clothes. Lois wasn't wasn't able to avoid trembling. Then the last button of her shirt flew away under the pressure of the knife. The man's hand was raising her shirt. He had a funny smile on his face. The blade's touch became harder and she felt the pain that the tip made on her abdomen where it scratched her. That man wasn't stabbing her, he was trying to scare her, to make her talk. Lois moaned but she did not speak. The man in front of her turned to look at someone she was unable to see from her position. Angry, he brought the knife up near her throat again. "If you don't talk... I swear I'll really hurt you... so much that you can't even imagine!" Lois heard the sound of footsteps approaching. He must be the same man that she'd seen before, the one who had been hidden in the darkness. He, again, had a cigarette between his lips. "You have to understand Miss Lane, that we are just trying to save the Earth. This alien has to be eliminated!" "This *alien* is the only positive thing that has happened to our planet!" "And what if he, for some unknown reason, became crazy? If he became power hungry, who could stop him?" "It won't happen. He doesn't want the power!" "You are so naïve!" "I'm a realist! You two are the crazy ones!" "Miss Lane, it's not safe to talk like that, our friend could become angry." "This one isn't a friend of mine!" "You are quite strong , Miss Lane, and a good reporter too, but you can play around too much!" "You're as crazy as Trask was before you." "A real pity to lose Jason in that way..." "Well... I didn't cry very much! He wanted to kill a friend of mine! In fact, he wanted to kill his whole family!" "Maybe Trask was a bit overzealous!" "Why don't you kill me now and we can stop this stupid fooling around? I'd never tell you how to contact Superman, even if I did know it!" "For me, it's enough that you can cry ,Miss Lane... and then your friend will come anyway." Lois couldn't avoid staring at him. Her head was firmly tied to the column. The man made a gesture toward the younger one, who after a minute, returned with a bucket. he pulled from the bucket what looked like a leather strip, very similar to a wide belt, then he looked at Lois with an amused expression he picked up the bucket and slowly poured the ice water over Lois' head. Lois held her breath at the sudden freezing contact. She was able to feel the ice cubes rolling down her body. "It certainly seems a pity to waste all this water, doesn't it?" Lois almost cried seeing all the water create a puddle under her feet. Ironic, she was completely wet and her mouth was almost completely dry. Well then, Miss Lane, would you kindly call Superman?" "No, even if it was the last thing in the world I could do!" She said firmly, without moving her eyes. At the older man's gesture, the younger one approached Lois and the leather strip was tied tightly around her head. It was so cold, as if it wasn't enough that the water already made her feel cold. After he finished tightening it around her head he tied a rope around her head, to prevent any other movement. Lois could feel the iced water drip on her face. "We'll see... do you know what's happening to you? In a while, you'll think you've gone crazy. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about... Well if you decide to collaborate with us in order to save the world, all you have to do is call us, or at least call your friend." Lois couldn't move her head. She was scared like she had never been in all her life. She knew these men were not joking. She heard the door slam as they went out. She was trembling, as much from the cold as from fear. She could hear the noise of her teeth chattering, but she was unable to stop herself. It was so cold! She wondered again, how much more of this she could resist. She wondered how she was going to resist if she was hit as much tomorrow as she had been that day. She wondered if she was going to die soon. She wondered how much longer she could survive without putting Superman in danger, or worse, Clark. *** Something about the taut feel of the belt against her skin prickled at her mind, the vague notion that she was in trouble, that something bad was on its way, but she couldn't focus on it, couldn't bring it close. It was too cold. She was too tired and she hurt too much. Everything seemed so calm. Time passed and her dress was drying. If only that leather strip wasn't tied around her head. It was still wet, it started to annoy her. Something about the taut feel of the belt against her skin prickled at her mind, the vague notion that she was in trouble, that something bad was on its way, but she couldn't focus on it, couldn't bring it close. It was too cold. She was too tired and she hurt too much. *** Time passed very slowly. God. How much tighter was this damn strip going to get! She tried to push against the column in order to make it slip away, but it was useless. Her mind started to wander. Strange thoughts were overlapping in her mind. She couldn't avoid thinking about Superman, but she also couldn't avoid thinking about Clark. Clark's gaze when she was under the spell of Miranda's perfume and Superman's when he was under the same effect and he declared his love for her. Clark's hug when that assassin tried to kill her in her apartment, the way Superman had rescued her from the vault where the invisible robber had trapped her. And then Clark's laugh and the austere distance Superman sometimes tried to keep from her. God, what a headache!!! Why was it hurting so much? The door opened suddenly, making her jump. "Well then, have you decided to call your friend? Oh, the strip is still not tight enough?" Lois was unable to figure out how they could know how tight it was. The man approached her and touched the leather. Lois was unable to suppress a shudder. "Well maybe... it's still too wet to hurt, you know? The more it dries, the tighter it will get around your little head; you'll think your head is going to explode. And then it will hurt more and more... and then more... always more; so why don't you avoid all this pain and tell us where we can find him?" "I don't know how to contact Superman! I've never known how to do it and I don't know anyone able to do it!" The man punched Lois in the stomach once again. Lois wondered if she even still had one. "We'll see how you'll think in a couple of hours." "I don't know how to find him; I can't put myself in contact with him. I don't know anybody able to do it." "Then why don't you ask for help? I'd guess one 'Help Superman!' would be enough." Lois closed her eyes, trying to take a deep breath. The man gave her another blow with his hand in the same place where he had hurt her with the knife. Lois closed her eyes tight, trying not to feel the growing pain she felt in most parts of her body. The man went away without seeing the two big tears rolling down her face. She had to slip the leather strip off her head somehow. It was now her only thought as it tightened more and more. She tried to exert leverage on the rope that was holding her against the column. She felt the rough plaster scratch her back, but it was nothing compared to the pain she felt from the strip. She had taken more than an hour to make it move a couple of millimeters, but she was already able to feel relief. The leather was now almost completely dry, but to her good fortune, it was also more rigid, so it was easier to move. She could only move a few millimeters, the ropes were so tight around her. She spent what seemed like endless hours before she was able to slip the strip from her head. In this way, the rope holding her to the column also grew loose, not a lot, just millimeters, but it was enough it allowed her to breathe a bit easier. Then, exhausted from the effort, she fell asleep, or maybe she fainted, she would never be able to say which it was. to be continued ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 17:34:01 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wanda McCants Subject: Re: The weak point 2/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chiara, Enjoyed the first two chapters, great writing. Wanda " What happens to a dream deferred? / Does it dry up like a raisin in the sun?" ......Langston Hughes Wanda ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 19:28:47 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: List Mom Request for "Fanfic Questions" I'm thrilled that so many people are asking questions related to their works in progress. Unfortunately, it gets very confusing when everyone uses the same subject line for their posts. I've lost count of how many versions of "A fanfic question" we've had in the last several weeks! In the interest of clarifying topic threads, I would ask that everyone please make their subject lines a bit more specific. The NASA/Gravity subject line is a good example of what I'm looking for -- tell us *what* the question is about in your subject line. Don't make us open it with no idea whether it's a new thread, or just an extension of an old one. Thanks for your cooperation. :) Kathy List Mom ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 01:31:15 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Xylo Xenophon Subject: Re: Fanfic question on NASA and gravity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit dear bethy, you are totally right that you can create a counter force to gravity (to be precise: to create a force to counter gravity) - the most simple way is to put something onto a support - for example when you place your cup of tea onto a desk. The surface of the table will dent just a little bit downwards and and in reaction to that it will create a counter force (upwards) to the force downwards applied by the cup (this force is called the weight of the cup and results from gravity acting downwards on the cup's mass - actually downwards is the direction to the center of the cup - earth's system center of mass - which happens to be just a tid bit upwards from earth's own center of mass- just a bit upwards because earth has so much more mass than the cup. and yes: the center of mass of two bodies of the same mass is exactly between each of the bodie's center of mass) I guess you want an explanation for someone 'floating' other than hanging from strings like Dean Cain when filming the flying scenes. That means we do not want some kind of visible connection from the floating body to some exterior support. We have some more options to create a counter force to the weight of an object. -electrical force -magnetic force -gravitational force: gravity -magnetic force: Magnetic levitation you could put magnets on the floor with one pole (for example: the north pole) up and also put on the lower side of the body magnets with the north pole down. ground: south:north <-> north:south object both equivalent poles will reject each other and thus will create a counter force to the weight of the object. This force will decrease with the distance of the magnets from each other, and at the distance where gravity equals this magnetic force the object will float. (this actually is a way used by so called maglev trains - on of which is in disneyland, another is in japan in operation, there is another prototype installed in germany - if i recall correctly) http://faculty.washington.edu/~jbs/itrans/maglevq.htm however there is a problem: you must ensure that the magnet on the levitating object can't flip around (along with the object), because if the south pole (at the object) faces the north pole (from the ground) the resulting magnetic and gravitational forces both will be downwards - and thus the object will no longer float ;) http://www.sirius.com/~alshinn/other-stuff.html http://davidfiedler.com/levitation.htm gravity: at the center of mass there are equal gravitational forces to all directions - that means that there is no resulting force - and thus you will have no weight there. We can't go to earth's center of mass - but you could think of digging a tunnel to the center of the moon. electrical force: you could put an electrical charge on the floating object and put it between charged condensator plates: ------------- (+) (+) ++++++++ however two floating objects would not like to interact closely because both are charged with equivalent charge (+) and therefore will repell each other. I think the best way to go would be this: you create a chamber within a huge magnet (for example one of those super conducting electrical magnets used for containment of solar fusion experiments - or for magnetic resonance imaging) which creates a pulsing magnetic field of some (about 7-20) Tesla (that's some thousand times stronger than earth's own magnetic field). within a changing magnetic field an electrical current will be induced to an inductivity (for example a spool of wire) Since every moved charge will create a magnetic field of it's own this induced current itself will create a magnetic field. Now according to Lenz's rule this induced magnetic field will counter act the external magnetic field. To cut the explanation: Given some very sophisticated equipment (and the necessary computational power :) you might be able to control the pulsing external magnetic field in a way that the induced field makes the object (coated with some kind of super conducting material) float. (this is actually the well known Meissner effect and is the most easy way to test an material for super-conductivity: (you cool it to the specified temperature when it gains it super conducting abilities - that temperature actually is very cold: more than minus 200 centigrades below the freezing temperature of water). Then you drop it over a magnet. If it is a super conducting material, then it will float. http://www.richmond.infi.net/~rhull/highenergy025.htm ) So you might do something like this: Get the chamber surrounded by the most powerful super conducting magnet (and that one will consume the output of a major power plant), give Bernie some computer power and hand a suit coated with (that new, stunning high-temperature) super conducting material (which Bernie just invented) to a fearless test pilot and have your fun with them :) (for proof of design: some professional guinea pig or lab rat - hi labby ;) please note that those objects will float, but they won't act like objects in zero-g unless the induced force does act on every molecule and not just on the surface of the suit someone wears - but on the other hand you won't fry your test pilot by some hundred ampere going through his body - won't you ? (The pilot would be protected by the suit because it is a Faraday's cage: http://www.mos.org/sln/toe/cage.html a closed cage made of conducting material will protect you from an external electrical field: that is the reason why you are safe from a lightning within your car) take care, Xenophon ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 20:07:17 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Diyan Subject: Re: Fanfic question try sand :) I read a book once where the guy got rid of his bed and brought in a box and filled it with sand, and covered it with nice sheets (cheap sheets would let the sand through). His roommates teased him about his "kitty litter box," but he insisted it was the most comfortable bed he'd ever slept on. -Dia ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 18:37:54 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: Fanfic Recommendations In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Wendy, Thank you so much for your recommendation of my fic. Hearing such praise makes me very proud! Also, please allow me to add my recommendation to your for both Raconteur's final segment of Lifeflight and Chris H.'s 'Till There Was You.' These are both favourites of mine already! Thanks again, Irene --- Wendy Richards wrote: > Today is a real treat, as far as new stories on the > Archive are concerned. > Those who are already hooked on Raconteur's > Lifeflight will need no urging > to read the excellent final part, so I'll say no > more! > > Irene Dutchak's next-gen series is augmented by her > wonderful, haunting > Beyond a Shadow of a Doubt. This, and its sequel - > yet to come - are among > Irene's best stories yet, in my humble opinion. Get > over there and read it! > > And then we also have a lovely story from ChrisH, > Till There Was You. This > is a very different, fascinating elseworld which I > loved. The Lois and > Clark we know well are essentially the same in > character, but each has had > very different experiences to the Lois and Clark we > know from the series, > and Chris handles these differences really well. > > So what are you waiting for?! > > > Wendy > ---------- > Wendy Richards > wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ===== www.originalequestrianmusic.bigstep.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 20:32:40 -0700 Reply-To: erink@ida.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Erin Klingler Subject: Re: NEW STORY: The Marriage Pact In-Reply-To: <9f.1169248c.27c2b90e@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone :) I feel just terrible! I posted 'The Marriage Pact,' not expecting to get much feedback since it was so short and not anything earth shattering, but I've just been flooded with wonderful feedback emails, both public and private, about it! I can't tell you how much your emails made my day! :) I've always made it a point to reply personally to each and every person who comments on a story I've written, and I hope to be able to do the same with this one very soon. But I've been positively swamped these last couple of days with Kerth noms closing and all that tallying that I haven't found time to reply to everyone yet! So in the meantime, I wanted to send a big, public 'THANK YOU!!!' to everyone who commented on my story. Your emails really lit up my day! Back to tallying...and tallying...and tallying... Erin :) __________________ erink@ida.net Visit my LNC/Kerth Website: www.ida.net/users/davek ***** "It's not the years that count, it's the moments...right now, as they happen." __________________ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 20:45:56 -0700 Reply-To: erink@ida.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Erin Klingler Subject: Kerth Nominations Update! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, Now that Kerth nominations are closed, I just had to tell you how thrilled I am by the tremendous turnout we had for the nominations process this year! When all was said and done, I received 61 emails, which is even more than we had last year, if I remember correctly. I'm amazed at how much reading you guys crammed into such a short amount of time. And I can't thank you all enough for participating in this year's nominations process! The Kerths wouldn't happen without your support. As for the list of nominees: Yikes!! Pam and Kathy can back me up here, since I just sent them a dizzying list of all the wonderful stories that were nominated. This year's tally sheet was jammed full of so many wonderful stories, it's making our head spin! I have no idea how I can expect you guys to just pick one story from each category when the voting time comes--even though that's what you'll have to do. :) I think this calls for a *huge* round of applause for all of you authors out there who've done *such* a marvelous job of keeping our favorite characters and show alive. We've got a tremendous about of talent here in FoLCdom, and I'm so proud of that. Just FYI: the final list of nominees will be posted here on this list, on my Kerths page, and on Zoom's message boards next Monday, so watch for it! So thanks again, everyone, and keep on writing! You make our fandom look awfully good. :) Erin __________________ erink@ida.net Visit my LNC/Kerth Website: www.ida.net/users/davek ***** "It's not the years that count, it's the moments...right now, as they happen." __________________ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:39:02 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Genevieve Subject: Former Kerth Nominees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In this quiet week between nominating Kerth stories, and voting on the winners, I'm going to be updating my web pages listing all the nominated stories for 1998, 1999, and 2000. I'd like to ask any authors who were previously nominated to check out the pages, and let me know if their personal web pages have changed, or if they have written any sequels to the nominated stories that should also be mentioned. I try to keep up with things, but it gets difficult. The address is Thanks in advance. -- -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Genevieve The World Wide Web has made it possible for anyone to find in five hours what a competent librarian can find in five minutes. :-) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 18:43:39 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Hazel Subject: Pushing the Envelope? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Let me preface this post by stating that I am not referring to any specific author or fic, but rather to the general trend. Please don't assume that I am targeting *you* -- or anyone else, for that matter. This is a question for discussion, not an accusation, and I am not attempting to claim the title of arbiter. I assure you I don't qualify. :) Over the past year, an increasing number of fics have edged closer and closer to the PG-13 limit -- and beyond. At first this was an isolated fic or two, but their numbers are increasing. We all have our personal limits, of course, but there have been a great many fics that I have stopped reading because they went over mine. Obviously, the stories in question qualfied for inclusion in the archive, which means they met the archive's standards; but they were definitely pushing the envelope. My question is: why? Why are so many authors pushing the envelope of gfic? Has the perception of "PG-13" changed over the last two years? Is it because of the happy trend of many authors gficcing their nfics, with the envelope-pushing as an inevitable result? (I don't think that's the case, actually, but I offer it as a theory anyway.) LnC fic is one of the few genres on the internet that still takes the trouble to separate gfic from nfic, and I, for one, am extremely grateful for it. Yet it seems to me that the separation is beginning to blur. Authors are including scenes that, two years ago, would have automatically been skipped (or at least glossed). Obviously, there can be reasons for an author choosing to include a borderline scene in a gfic; I'm not trying to dictate how others write. As an example, I wrote FDK to one author about a story that got my vote for Best Overall Fic, and included a remark that I had "closed my eyes" while reading the final scene in the story. She replied that she knew the scene in question was a bit borderline, but had included it because the dialogue was essential. That's her judgement call, just as it's mine whether or not to read a story; but it seems to me that there are more and more stories that are toeing the line. *Should* the envelope be pushed? Is this something I just don't understand? Do authors *want* to push the envelope? Do they feel constrained by the limitations imposed by the archive? Or is this just the current trend of writing, like the longer length of fics, and will eventually reverse itself? *Should* it be reversed? Am I alone in thinking that fics have changed, and if they have, is it for the better -- or for the worse? I know my answers to those questions; I'd like to hear yours. Hazel _______ "Lots of little Bigwigs, Hazel! Think of that, and tremble!" ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:47:48 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: List Mom Request for "Fanfic Questions" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kathy, *thank you*!! I know you know this, but other listmembers may not: when reading on the Archive web interface, as I do some of the time, it's almost impossible sometimes to work out what you've read and what you haven't. So for the last couple of weeks I've been asking myself 'Have I read this fanfic question and its responses?' And sometimes I've missed a couple where I could even have offered some help. :) Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 07:08:11 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Tank Wilson Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hazel postulated that there has been an upswing in sexual content in L&C fics of late, ie: pushing the envelope of gfic. I have to say that I agree. My curmudgeonly attitude is well documented, I've never felt that the more explicit sexual content is necessary to show the growth of the L&C relationship. I like romance, and I've never felt that 'sex' was a necessary part of that. BUT I would never deny anyone else their desire, or their right to read or write such things. Why has this become more prevalent? I'm not sure, but I think part of it comes from the fact that fanfic in particular is very prone to 'wish fullfillment'. One of the major components of L&C fanfiction is the strong desire on the part of FoLCdom to put Lois and Clark together as a couple. The timeless love story, so to speak, is always begging to be told. It's one of the reasons that, in general, B plots tend to be perferred. The large volume of stories that already exist in L&C fanfiction means that the chaste, 'sealed with a kiss' or waff-filled dialog, relationship ending has been done many times. Perhaps it's a desire (whether conscious or unconscious) to be a little different, or more daring than has been true of the past. Of course, as been pointed out, when several people try to be different, the difference becomes the norm. One consequence of this trend is that it has helped me in my limited time to read the new fics as they come out. A fic with a 'too quick to bed' or heavy sexual content is one that I'll probably skim over at best. Not that they aren't excellant stories, it's just not what I'm interested in reading. As I've said, I like romance, but don't need to have the physical spelled out for me. Tank ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 07:25:40 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "C.C. Malo" Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (long post warning - beware) I'm really torn on this one. Part of me abhors the idea of censorship and then I wind up, in the name of principle, defending a specific action which troubles me. As an editor for the archive I've dealt with/avoided(?) this issue several times. I guess I'm concerned when a sexual encounter is described in explicitly graphic detail when it appears in a story for the archive because of the context in which the archive functions. Should a 14 year old be reading this stuff? (no, of course not -- s/he should be reading Jane Austen or Michael Ondaatje!!) The context is important here -- the archive does potentially reach underage readers. What they will find there is mild compared to what they will find elsewhere. Nevertheless the archive must also set a standard for the community which L&C represents. I don't envy Kathy having to make the final call for the content in this regard. Nevertheless, so much pop culture is sexually explicit that our L & C fic seems very tame. And it rarely (maybe never) crosses the line into misogyny as pop culture often does. Maybe it's not a bad thing for young adolescents to read about a sexual relationship where there is also respect and equality, where sex is about love rather than power. And where a relationship like that can thrive and bring strength in a world in which it seems antithetical. As someone who once wrote an L&C fic with premarital sex in it, although it was so euphemistically written you would have to read it twice to figure out what was happening, I have to admit that I wasn't thinking about readers or archive approval but just recording the story in my head. However, I did hesitate when revising it, and was surprised when the story "made it through". But I also knew I didn't want the scene cut because it portrayed (I hoped) a dimension of the emotional commitment between L & C. A double standard I guess. Perhaps writers are pushing the envelope more on this because of the competition of nfic which I think probably has more readers, judging from the responses on Zoom's mbs to both an nfic posting and a gfic posting of the same story. Hazel asked all these questions: <<*Should* the envelope be pushed?>> Yes, but in a thoughtful way. i.e. be careful about opening it. :) <> But you do, Hazel, in a different way. CPOV pushed the envelope in several ways -- POV, how we look at Lois and Clark, and how we look at Lana. <> I know a couple of people have but they also accepted the archive having those limits. <> Now this is a question worth discussing in a separate thread -- when is longer better; when is it just longer? <> It's to be expected that fics would change, and also that we won't be happy with each of the changes we've spotted. But, having done a reading blitz over the last month and a half, I have no doubt that, on the whole, they're better. In the best fics there's a complex handling of plot, character, and theme that I'm now coming to expect in all the longer stories I read. The sexual relationship may be part of that. Or there's just a brief short story, elegant in its structure or wonderful in its humour. Not to mention a couple of new writers whose prose is just beautiful. Not sure I've answered your questions, Hazel, so much as I've spewed out some random, circuitous thoughts. Carol ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 07:59:12 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Perhaps writers are pushing the envelope more on this because of the > competition of nfic which I think probably has more readers, judging from the > responses on Zoom's mbs to both an nfic posting and a gfic posting of the > same story. Just to quibble with this one point, Carol ... I think there's a large overlap of readers between nfic and gfic, but I don't know of many who *only* read nfic (I know one who used to, but we've converted her to gfic now, too ). And if you look at the stats on the different sections of the message board, you'll see that the gfic section is about 5 times busier than the nfic. There are readers out there though, who will ask for more detail. I find nfic incredibly difficult to write, most of the time, but I have been tempted to try it. I'm not comfortable with putting too much detail on the archive, however -- I've cut more than an archive editor suggested, to suit my personal comfort level. And I wouldn't mind if others employed similar discretion. For the larger question ... I have no answers :) I think Tank might be on to something, though, in his theory that authors are trying to be different; I know I don't like to duplicate scenes that have already been done elsewhere, and as more wonderful stories are written, it gets harder to find uncharted territory. -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ In America only the successful writer is important, in France all writers are important, in England no writer is important, in Australia you have to explain what a writer is. -- Geoffrey Cotterell ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:02:32 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Carol wrote: > > Perhaps writers are pushing the envelope more on this because of the > > competition of nfic which I think probably has more readers, judging from the> > responses on Zoom's mbs to both an nfic posting and a gfic posting of the same story. > > Just to quibble with this one point, Carol ... I think there's a large > overlap of readers between nfic and gfic, but I don't know of many who > *only* read nfic (I know one who used to, but we've converted her to > gfic now, too ). And if you look at the stats on the different > sections of the message board, you'll see that the gfic section is about > 5 times busier than the nfic. > I have to jump in here because this touches on something which has been puzzling me for some time now. I agree that I don't think there are more nfic readers than gfic readers. I've always thought it was the other way about. But I do know what Carol means, Pam, because I and several others have noted it ourselves. I don't think she's referring to actual nfic to gfic reader ratio (Carol, you can correct if if I'm misrepresenting you here ) but to the discrepency in fdk to gfic and conversions on the gifc mbs. Post an nfic to the mbs and you get a very healthy fdk response most times. An average quote on a comments folder is perhaps say 15-20 posts. Gfic that nfic and post it to the gfic mbs and you're lucky to get 3 or 4 fdk posts. At some points the post goes completely unresponded to with zero posts. Which is incredibly disheartening for an author. And most if not all nfic to gfic authors seem to have suffered it. This isn't a phenomenum limited to certain fic or authors. It's pretty much universal right across the board. There are more than a few nfic authors out there wondering if there's any point in struggling with a conversion because few people seem to be reading on the gfic mbs these days. If you trawl back through the mbs and check out some of the nfic to gfic posts in the past, oh say, six months and compare the fdk they got on gfic to purely gfic stories with no nfic counterpart you will see an extremely marked difference in the response they got. Gfic stories seem to get the same healthy response as nfic on the nfic folder. But conversions lag way, way behind. And it's been nagging at my brain for some months now as to why that is. On the face of it it didn't seem to make any sense and I was stumped for an explanation. I wouldn't, I hasten to add, at all expect those who had commented on a nfic over on the nfic mbs to also comment on the gfic post on the gfic side. That wouldn't make sense. But there must, surely, be enough people on the gfic mbs who don't read nfic to produce a similarly healthy fdk as is produced on the nfic mbs when a story segment is posted. Logically, there should be enough nos for there to be no discrepency. Well, that is proved by the healthy response to gfic. Yet there most definitely is and has been. Perhaps Hazel's question answers mine though. I can't say that I've personally noticed any creeping of the limit. But if there is one...that could well explain this phenomenum. I'm not sure that I'd agree with you, Carol, that the reason for any pushing is competition to up the ante, so to speak, as more and more nfic is written. Certainly it definitely hasn't ever occurred to me when writing nfic. Quite the opposite in fact! The only reason I write nfic these days is because it frees me from the restraints of gfic and allows me to explore as fully as I wish adult situations and dialogue. Some banter for example which is beyond pg13 limits. The actual physical act I couldn't care less about. But if there's some banter in there that I don't want to lose...I can't very well cheat the nfic readers by not including the act, since the banter alone puts it beyond pg13. I think I'd be lynched. Personally, though, I wouldn't care if I never wrote the act itself again. These days I put in as little as I can safely get away with. ;) LabRat :) > There are readers out there though, who will ask for more detail. I > find nfic incredibly difficult to write, most of the time, but I have > been tempted to try it. I'm not comfortable with putting too much > detail on the archive, however -- I've cut more than an archive editor > suggested, to suit my personal comfort level. And I wouldn't mind if > others employed similar discretion. > > For the larger question ... I have no answers :) I think Tank might be > on to something, though, in his theory that authors are trying to be > different; I know I don't like to duplicate scenes that have already > been done elsewhere, and as more wonderful stories are written, it gets > harder to find uncharted territory. > -- > > Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net > http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam > http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ > > In America only the successful writer is important, > in France all writers are important, in England > no writer is important, in Australia you have to > explain what a writer is. -- Geoffrey Cotterell ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:30:01 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oooops. In the middle of all that, I completely forgot about the most important point I wanted to address. Doh! Hazel wrote: > > *Should* the envelope be pushed? Is this something I just don't understand? Personally, Hazel, I think the answer to your question is a resounding no. It seems to me to be a non sequitor to answer yes. The entire point, surely, of converting an nfic down to gfic is to let readers who only read gfic read your story. At least, off the top of my head, I can't think of any other reason an author would do it. So, on the face of it, 'pushing the envelope' or steadily increasing the amount of nfic to the point where you alienate those readers and stop them reading the story would be nonsensical. I don't really think authors want to push the envelope - at least not the ones I know anyway. But I can really only speak for myself here and I freely admit that I am an extremely poor judge of what is and isn't acceptable for the pg13 limit. Being fairly liberal myself as to what I find myself unwilling to read it's often difficult for me to judge where others would disagree. Barring the most obvious of course! As you point out yourself, Hazel, what is one man's unacceptable sexual encounter is another's hardly worth blinking over snuggle. ;) That line moves back and forth pretty widely as a matter of personal choice and diversity. So, I've always simply let myself be guided by my GE on this one. Once a story is accepted by the Archive I figure it's safe to be posted at other gfic venues. When I posted the gfic version of Lonesome to the mbs, before sending it to the Archive (first time I've ever done that, if I recall correctly) I passed each gfic segment to another author for double checking prior to posting as I didn't trust my own judgement. More than a few times she told me to restore something I'd edited out. Of course...you're trusting the judgement of other nfic authors/readers here. Whose liberalism in this instance might well be as dodgy as yours simply by default. The irony of the situation is that you should probably give the nfic to a gfic reader, so they can tell you what they don't accept. Except...you can't. Catch 22. Thanks for bringing this to my attention, Hazel. Perhaps the only solution is to simply not convert. Or to only convert stories where you can wholly excise the sexual content scene by scene in their entirety. For me, as I've explained elsewhere in my earlier post, this is usually not possible because the dialogue and situations blur into the act, making the removal of entire scenes result in nothing that makes sense. But perhaps it would work for some other authors. Or...radical plan...perhaps gfic readers wouldn't mind snips instead? I know that these highly irriate me when I read them in other fandom, but if it was generally acceptable it might solve the problem. You know, where the offending line is just taken out with no attempt to make it seamless? Just replacing it with 'censored' or 'snipped' within the text. This makes it difficult for me to immerse myself in a story, but it would mean that the offending parts are excised without removing any of the important connecting narrative links which fall safely within pg13 limits. Anyway....just some vague ramblings that occurred to me on reading your post... LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:54:48 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Or...radical plan...perhaps gfic readers wouldn't mind snips instead? NO! Nononononono. Well, now that I've got my opinion into the open, let me elaborate. ;-) I personally don't read nfic. I feel that there are (multiple) aspects there that I'm not personally ready for. Plus, I also feel that sex is an intensely private act, and often get uncomfortable with the explicity that comes out in nfic. I don't think I'm old enough to handle that! :-þ But, I know that I wouldn't like 'snips.' It would constantly remind me that there is something missing from the story, something *I'm* missing. And that would drive me absolutely crazy (like watching a movie with my mom and having her send me out of the room and fast forward a part...not that she's done that in a long time, but you get the point. Even if *I* also felt that the scene was unnecessary, I still want to see it so that I don't 'miss' anything). I realize that it's difficult for authors to convert their nfic stories, and that the FDK is often much more sparse on the gfic side, but I for one am grateful for the effort. My theory is that there is a group of consistent fdk-ers and when a story is posted on both, the 'regulars' who read nfic post there, leaving less 'regulars' on the gfic side to post. And lurkers aren't necessarily going to come out of the woodwork because the gfic has less posters. As to the original question (:-þ), I don't know. I know that there have been a few stories and/or scenes that I've been uncomfortable with on the gfic versions, but I'm never sure if it's just me. And, I often read them anyway. But, I have noticed that I'm more likely to (as Tank said) skim them, and usually offer less to no fdk as a result. Which may also be a reason that gfic gets less fdk -- some people feel that the envelope *is* pushed too far. All in all, what I'm basically saying is that I don't know. :-þ Bethy>Or...radical plan...perhaps gfic readers wouldn't mind snips instead? NO! Nononononono. Well, now that I've got my opinion into the open, let me elaborate. ;-) I personally don't read nfic. I feel that there are (multiple) aspects there that I'm not personally ready for. Plus, I also feel that sex is an intensely private act, and often get uncomfortable with the explicity that comes out in nfic. I don't think I'm old enough to handle that! :-þ But, I know that I wouldn't like 'snips.' It would constantly remind me that there is something missing from the story, something *I'm* missing. And that would drive me absolutely crazy (like watching a movie with my mom and having her send me out of the room and fast forward a part...not that she's done that in a long time, but you get the point. Even if *I* also felt that the scene was unnecessary, I still want to see it so that I don't 'miss' anything). I realize that it's difficult for authors to convert their nfic stories, and that the FDK is often much more sparse on the gfic side, but I for one am grateful for the effort. My theory is that there is a group of consistent fdk-ers and when a story is posted on both, the 'regulars' who read nfic post there, leaving less 'regulars' on the gfic side to post. And lurkers aren't necessarily going to come out of the woodwork because the gfic has less posters. As to the original question (:-þ), I don't know. I know that there have been a few stories and/or scenes that I've been uncomfortable with on the gfic versions, but I'm never sure if it's just me. And, I often read them anyway. But, I have noticed that I'm more likely to (as Tank said) skim them, and usually offer less to no fdk as a result. Which may also be a reason that gfic gets less fdk -- some people feel that the envelope *is* pushed too far. All in all, what I'm basically saying is that I don't know. :-þ Bethy PS Labby, your e-mail account has once again placed your own e-addy in the 'reply to' spot. I accidentally noticed it when I was about to send. So I guess re-subbing didn't work, after all. I think your account is selfish and doesn't want any replies sent anywhere but to itself! :-) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 15:47:50 +0000 Reply-To: Phillip Atcliffe Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Phillip Atcliffe Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:02:32 -0000 LabRat wrote: > Post an nfic to the mbs and you get a very healthy fdk response most times. An average quote on a comments folder is perhaps say 15-20 posts. Gfic that nfic and post it to the gfic mbs and you're lucky to get 3 or 4 fdk posts. At some points the post goes completely unresponded to with zero posts. > If you trawl back through the mbs and check out some of the nfic to gfic posts in the past, oh say, six months and compare the fdk they got on gfic to purely gfic stories with no nfic counterpart you will see an extremely marked difference in the response they got. Gfic stories seem to get the same healthy response as nfic on the nfic folder. But conversions lag way, way behind. > And it's been nagging at my brain for some months now as to why that is. On the face of it it didn't seem to make any sense and I was stumped for an explanation. I wouldn't, I hasten to add, at all expect those who had commented on a nfic over on the nfic mbs to also comment on the gfic post on the gfic side. That wouldn't make sense. But there must, surely, be enough people on the gfic mbs who don't read nfic to produce a similarly healthy fdk as is produced on the nfic mbs when a story segment is posted. Logically, there should be enough nos for there to be no discrepency. Well, that is proved by the healthy response to gfic. Yet there most definitely is and has been. < Apologies for the lengthy quote, but the Rat raises some good points here and I wanted to have them all there. In regards to the discrepancy in the number of FDK posts that follow a nfic story part vs a gfic conversion, I can't help but wonder if the problem lies in the relatively small number of people who actually post comments. The MB community has how many people registered -- over a thousand? But how many actually _post_, much less do it regularly? Does the number even reach three figures? I suspect not (and, given some of the trolls we get on occasion, that's not altogether a bad thing). That being the case, the reason for the lack of FDK for gfic conversions could be as simple as the fact that almost everyone who had something to say said so on the nfic board! Certainly, the healthy amounts of FDK for non-conversion gfic stories supports that; purely on a gut feeling basis, I suspect that the total amount of FDK that a purely gfic story gets is about the same as for an nfic/gfic double post. Does this mean that authors are wasting their time doing conversions? I don't think so. There are not many stories that are so dependent on the nfic content to not be convertible, and those readers who should not or choose not to read nfic would be deprived of good stories if conversions were not done. However, authors should be prepared to receive most, if not all, of their FDK on one or other of the boards. The only way for this not to happen is for more gfic readers to post, and the situation may well be self-reinforcing in that few people post FDK to gfic conversions, so others are less inclined to because their posts will be isolated. Phil ------------------------------------------------------------ "Sic Transit Gloria Barramundi" (Or, So Long and Thanks for All the Fish!) -- not Douglas Adams, but me: Phil Atcliffe (Phillip.Atcliffe@uwe.ac.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:01:45 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Anne Carlson Subject: Re: Former Kerth Nominees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wow Genevieve, You don't know how much your Kerths Site is appreciated. I remember a few years back before you started this website. It was such a hassle to try and find all of the stories! Now, it so easy. Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, Thank you! Anne ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:37:10 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bethy wrote: > > I realize that it's difficult for authors to convert their nfic stories, and > that the FDK is often much more sparse on the gfic side, but I for one am > grateful for the effort. I must admit that I personally see snips as evidence of a lazy author. It does take more time and thought to try to eliminate the X factor while maintaining the integrity of the story. Aside from which, as I said earlier, it's hard to fix yourself in the world of the story when you keep being propelled out of it again by editorial comments within the narrative. My theory is that there is a group of consistent > fdk-ers and when a story is posted on both, the 'regulars' who read nfic > post there, leaving less 'regulars' on the gfic side to post. And lurkers > aren't necessarily going to come out of the woodwork because the gfic has > less posters. But the evidence over on the gfic boards seems to be in denial of this one, Bethy. There should, on the fact of it, be no discrepency. Unless I'm missing something completely obvious here - which is always possible. Let's take a closer look at the gfic mbs. Story A is pure gfic. Posted on the gfic boards it attracts a fdk response of say 15 posts. Most of those 15 posters will be the same 15 who regularly post fdk to the gfic mbs. You see the same names appearing over and over. The remainder of the readers are lurkers. Eliminating from that 15 those who read and post fdk to a story on both gfic and nfic mbs, still leaves say half that no. who are regular purely gfic posters. Over on the nfic mbs, Story B is posted. It receives a similar response pattern. Now...the crux of the problem... Story C is a conversion posted to the gfic and nfic mbs. It attracts 15 fdk posts over on nfic and four or less or none at all over on gfic. So...by a simple case of pure arthimetic - where are the remainder of the gfic regulars? They should be there. But only a small fraction of them have posted. > PS Labby, your e-mail account has once again placed your own e-addy in the> 'reply to' spot. I accidentally noticed it when I was about to send. So I > guess re-subbing didn't work, after all. I think your account is selfish > and doesn't want any replies sent anywhere but to itself! :-) > [No, it didn't. What it did point up is that if I post from the website instead of my eddress it will put the fanfic list eddress on it. But I'm afraid it'll take me a while to get into that habit, since I'm used to just hitting reply on a post I find in my mailbox. ] LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:16:59 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: Fanfic question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hmm, interesting concept - can you see LC on a mattress of sand? CM On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 20:07:17 -0500 Diyan writes: > try sand :) I read a book once where the guy got rid of his bed and > brought in a box and filled it with sand, and covered it with nice > sheets > (cheap sheets would let the sand through). His roommates teased him > about > his "kitty litter box," but he insisted it was the most comfortable > bed > he'd ever slept on. > > -Dia ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:36:50 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Another long post warning here! Interesting question, Hazel - and I suspect I may be one of the writers you could be referring to. (And don't worry: I am neither feeling 'got at' nor resentful that you've raised this!). I have written stories which have been converted from nfic; I have also introduced some love scenes into PG13 fic, but kept the description at - I hope - a PG13 level. Why do I want to write love scenes? Not because I have any desire to push an envelope, or to be 'different', but because the kind of stories I prefer to write have, as Tank put it, a strong B-plot incorporating Lois and Clark getting together as a couple. Sex often comes into that, though for different reasons. Usually it's as an affirmation of their love, and in that case I suppose I could just close the bedroom door behind them and leave it there, or pick the tale up an hour or so later. But, on the times when I don 't do that, I usually have a reason, and that's often tied up with an aspect of the B-plot which involves insecurities on the part of one or other character, and which need to be resolved in the context of lovemaking. (Of course, on the times when writers do close the bedroom door behind their characters, even in a PG13 story, we get asked for more!) On three occasions I wrote love scenes - or perhaps more properly sex scenes - taking place before Lois and Clark were a couple. One of those stories was PG13 the whole way through, though I did need to tone down one very brief reference. The other two were nfic, one of which I have not, and will not, convert to PG13 - not because it involves sex, but because the sex has serious implications for the remainder of the story and it would be difficult to convey the nature of these clearly enough without the graphic detail. The other story, Faux Pas, I did convert, but I needed to leave in enough information to allow readers to understand the role played by both characters in relation to consent and co-operation. As such, I don't think that the love scene was gratuitous or superfluous to the plot; at least I hope not! Moving from my particular motivation here (and I won't even touch the issue of why I like writing long stories, or maybe that should be why my stories like to make themselves long! ), to address the general question, I have a couple of thoughts. First, stories which tend to involve lovemaking could perhaps be seen as sub-genre almost in the same way as heavily A-plotted stories, crossovers, next-gens and so on are. Not everyone enjoys every type of fanfic; we see that point being made time and again. Some people avoid crossovers or next-gens; I'm sure there are other readers who avoid the heavily B-plotted story which looks as if it has a lot of sensual content. Note: I am *not* trying to suggest that if someone doesn't like love scenes in a story then they shouldn't read them - not at all! I'm merely wondering aloud if this phenomenon might be confined to certain types of story rather than being more widespread. I'm not sure about this, because of course Sheila's stories are heavily A-plotted but also contain love scenes, some very sensual and lengthy indeed. Second, there is the question of what we're trying to achieve with the ratings. I know this has been raised before, but what exactly does a PG13 rating mean? Does it mean that we are eliminating everything which would not be *understood* by someone aged thirteen? Because that's a very different proposition from removing all 'adult' references. I do know that editing love scenes is very difficult; I've just been working on Faux Pas with Jeanne for the Archive, and - while I thought I'd removed everything objectionable - she found a couple of references I admit I should have taken out, and we debated a couple of others. It's a judgement call sometimes, and I wouldn't like to claim that I've always got it right, and I 'd be amazed if any other GE could claim that they have I've tended to take the view, as a writer and also as an Archive GE, that my task is to ensure that there is nothing 'adult' present which could be understood by anyone of 13 or thereabouts. Thus oblique references, as long as they are brief and not tied together with explicit references to body parts, may be okay. Now, I suspect that Hazel's own threshold would be exceeded by some of these oblique references and so on which remain under a PG13 rating. On the other hand, maybe either my understanding of what I should be doing is wrong, or there might be a general consensus that, while my understanding is *correct*, we should move to a different standard, one closer to that Hazel and other adults who don't care to read nfic apply to PG13 love scenes. Maybe this is a debate we should be having. And I very much endorse Carol's comments about the way in which love scenes are generally treated in this fandom, of course as a consequence of the kind of relationship Lois and Clark have. And, actually, a PG13 TV show which can allow its main characters to be filmed lying on the kitchen floor after what was *very* obviously a quickie, and then discuss contraception, does suggest that there is room for some pushing of that envelope. But that 'some' should not go so far as to alienate those PG13 readers who do not like to see too much detail in their (PG13) love scenes, as LabRat argued. Which leads me on to another question - is it length of love scenes, or is it the degree of 'graphicness' in the description? In other words, is it that you skim lightly over a love scene of half a page - assuming that there are no offending *very* explicit references - but find a love scene of four pages or more too much? Could this be part of the problem? Anyway, more questions than answers here! It's been a fascinating discussion so far. Let's hear from more people! Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:42:05 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Darn! Even after proof-reading my post, I missed this obvious error: > Second, there is the question of what we're trying to achieve with the > ratings. I know this has been raised before, but what exactly does a PG13 > rating mean? Does it mean that we are eliminating everything which would not > be *understood* by someone aged thirteen? What I *meant* to say, and the next para makes clear, is that we eliminate anything of an adult nature which *would* be understood by a teenager. Some more oblique references may under such an approach be considered okay because they *wouldn't* be understood by a younger reader, in much the same way as some more adult references in Lois and Clark on TV might not have been understood by young kids. Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:22:45 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay - my two cents. I haven't been around long, you guys know that so I can't say that I have noticed a change. However, I am not sure what the line is. (Does lcfanfic.com do PG13? I don't remember and I have having internet connection problems or I would check.) I don't look at the ratings there before reading a story, probably because I haven't really read anything that I think would be inappropriate (and I am to the M's now!). What bothers me more than a slightly suggestive scene is violence and I tend to skim over that and on to the romance (ie: sorry, don't remember the title, maybe Dear Lois, where Clark/Supes goes to a wartorn area and is shot at with Kryptonite - if you've read it you know what I mean and I don't want to spoil anything for anyone else - the war scenes and such were a bit much for me, but if I remember right there was a warning). I won't watch gratuitous or explicit sex in movies and I don't like violence in movies (History buff that I am, I refuse to watch Gladiator) and I don't like to read it either. As for on the MB or archive, I think there should be (and I am pretty sure there is on the archive) so kind of, well, not warning, but comment "Adult situations, semi-explicit" or something. But, I am still a newbie, so there may be things in place that I don't know. And what about say a graphic birthing scene or something? Where does that fit in (not that I plan on writing one)? I am writing, as I am sure you know, a series (or two*bg*) with a married LC and I don't think I am going "too far" with the scenes, but I don't know what is too much. Of course, I tend to be conservative on what I think is too much,so my opinion may be "wrong" as too what is too much. I tend to be a "Close the door" type, but there is some kissing and sttuff in some of my stories and I don't think that I am doing too much, but what do I know? Oh, goodness, I am starting to sound like Lois. I babble well. I don't know that I said anything new or anything, but opinions really can't be wrong, so I don't have to worry about that, but, oh never mind. I'll shut up now. CM ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:28:15 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Subject: Re: Former Kerth Nominees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I second this -- Genevieve has done a fabulous service for all of us :) And it's always been completely voluntary -- she suggested it herself and we eagerly accepted This is what I love about the Kerths (and FOLCdom) ... people just come up with ideas, and get involved (like the Kerth quizzes) and enrich the process for us all. :) Anne Carlson wrote: > > Wow Genevieve, > > You don't know how much your Kerths Site is appreciated. I remember a few > years back before you started this website. It was such a hassle to try and > find all of the stories! Now, it so easy. > > Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, Thank you! > Anne -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ In America only the successful writer is important, in France all writers are important, in England no writer is important, in Australia you have to explain what a writer is. -- Geoffrey Cotterell ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:39:27 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, it's me again. You'll be delighted to know, Wendy, that you've made me put off the decision to go watch Voyager yet again in favour of getting back into this discussion. > First, stories which tend to involve lovemaking could perhaps be seen as > sub-genre almost in the same way as heavily A-plotted stories, crossovers, > next-gens and so on are. Not everyone enjoys every type of fanfic; we see > that point being made time and again. Some people avoid crossovers or > next-gens; I'm sure there are other readers who avoid the heavily B-plotted > story which looks as if it has a lot of sensual content. Note: I am *not* > trying to suggest that if someone doesn't like love scenes in a story then > they shouldn't read them - not at all! I'm merely wondering aloud if this > phenomenon might be confined to certain types of story rather than being > more widespread. I'm not sure about this, because of course Sheila's stories > are heavily A-plotted but also contain love scenes, some very sensual and > lengthy indeed. As someone who has *always* seen nfic as simply another sub-genre like deathfic or NG or whatever, which people should or should not read according to their own personal tastes, I agree with you here, Wendy. I'm not really sure what you mean by 'love scenes' being 'confined to certain types of story rather than being more widespread' though. By that I mean that I don't understand the suggestion, rather than I disagree with it. Could you expand on this one a little? Are you talking about just love scenes per se - those mild encounters we see in most if not all fic? Gfic included? Because I can't see how you could separate those out. Particularly in LNC fanfic where the relationship is such a core element of the majority of fic. Or by love scenes do you mean sexual content? But that's already separated out into nfic. Or some middling ground perhaps between the two? > > Second, there is the question of what we're trying to achieve with the > ratings. I know this has been raised before, but what exactly does a PG13 > rating mean? Does it mean that we are eliminating everything which would not be *understood* by someone aged thirteen? Because that's a very different > proposition from removing all 'adult' references. > This is a very good point. Part of my trouble with knowing where to cut at times is that the very term pg13 means different things not only to different people at a personal level, but to different cultures too. There are vast differences at times, for instance, in what terms and references are seen as being mild/hardly noticeable in UK terms and which are very taboo in the US. And vice versa. I think most of us know of one US term in particular that would make even a sailor blush in the UK. ;) But which is considered there to be so mild and innoffensive you could use it in front of your maiden aunt with no worries. It was even used in an LNC episode. That fluidity makes life very difficult at times for the poor convertor. [g] > On the other hand, maybe either my understanding of what I should be doing > is wrong, or there might be a general consensus that, while my understanding > is *correct*, we should move to a different standard, one closer to that > Hazel and other adults who don't care to read nfic apply to PG13 love > scenes. Maybe this is a debate we should be having. Yes, I'd like to see a wider debate. I confess to being surprised you didn't post this one to the mbs too, Hazel. I'd be very interested to hear what the consensus would be on this one from the gfic readers there and whether or not they agree there's been a change in recent months about content. LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:33:54 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Former Kerth Nominees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pam wrote: > I second this -- Genevieve has done a fabulous service for all of us :) > And it's always been completely voluntary -- she suggested it herself > and we eagerly accepted Well, I appreciate it very much too! I took a look at the 2000 page again earlier and realised for the first time how much effort has gone into laying out the categories and nominees, *and* including descriptions for each story! In cases where the nominee is a series, Genevieve has done a great job in amalgamating descriptions for each story to give the reader an idea of the coherent whole without too many spoilers. Thank you, Genevieve! Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:37:03 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Marnie Rowe Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > My question is: why? Why are so many authors pushing the envelope of gfic? > Has the perception of "PG-13" changed over the last two years? I think that there is a prevaling trend in lots of things that are making it more difficult to decide what is or is not PG-13. When half the shows on prime time television are getting more and more explict, and other frames of media are as well: things like Advertising and Magazines and R-rated movies that are nothing but soft porn. You get bombarded with enough of it and soon enough you get desensitized, what I heard once was if you hear nothing but swearing, pretty soon they are nothing but words to you. I think that the same phenomenon is happening here in a bit of a lesser form. There are probably other factors as well like other persons on this list have said, like not wanting to do the same as has already been done, then also, more authors are approaching some pretty heavy duty subject matters. Things that happen in real life, and they are taking a realistic view of solving these issues for the most part which can lead to some very adult scenarios. > > > *Should* the envelope be pushed? Is this something I just don't understand? > Do authors *want* to push the envelope? Do they feel constrained by the > limitations imposed by the archive? Or is this just the current trend of > writing, like the longer length of fics, and will eventually reverse > itself? *Should* it be reversed? Am I alone in thinking that fics have > changed, and if they have, is it for the better -- or for the worse? > Well I don't know if its for the better or for the worse, but personally I like to see the more realistic scenarios. With the way that our authors research and find out the facts more often than not its nice to be able to suspend disbelief without getting a cramp in the suspending muscles if you understand me. I must admit that I am not one for explicit descriptions of sex or violence or gore, to write or to read, but I do not mind a well written lovemaking scene as long as it has some refrences to the story. If it doesn't I just gloss over till I get to the meat again...the real story I mean. I don't know if it should be reversed or if they feel constrained by any limitations, I never have a problem with that seeing as I just fade out in that case. But I will agree that fics have changed, and I think that many of our more prolific authors could write fiction for a sidebar even tho that would mean that we would be denied their talents. Cause anything that is published on the web cannot be published by a marketing concern afterwards...which is too bad. I know a few stories could be made into some very nice books for the LnC universe. My two cents worth, Marnie Rowe ~Pobody's Nerfect ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:51:33 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Carol Moncado (as opposed to Carol Malo ) wrote: >What > bothers me more than a slightly suggestive scene is violence and I tend > to skim over that and on to the romance (ie: sorry, don't remember the > title, maybe Dear Lois, where Clark/Supes goes to a wartorn area and is > shot at with Kryptonite - if you've read it you know what I mean and I > don't want to spoil anything for anyone else - the war scenes and such > were a bit much for me, but if I remember right there was a warning). Yes, that's Dear Lois. I edited that for the Archive, and I inserted the warning. I think Dear Lois is an outstanding story, and it's all the more incredible considering that it's Shayne Terry's first story. The warning was definitely necessary, because some of the descriptions were harrowing. Yet I felt that none of it was gratuitous. Shayne did an excellent job of opening our eyes to the reality of life in a war zone, and I admit - and so, I suspect, would he - that it's not for the squeamish. But I didn't feel that overall any of the descriptions went beyond the limits of PG13. I loathe violence myself, but here we weren't talking about a beat-em-up blood-and-gore story. We were reading about the aftermath, for the most part, of violence, and the fear of further violence. If I was editing a 'kick-ass' fic I would no doubt take a different view. Oh, and to answer your question, the Fanfic Archive only takes stories up to PG13. It's part of the job of a Archive editor to ensure that any story submitted fulfills the rating criterion. > And what about say a graphic birthing scene or > something? Where does that fit in (not that I plan on writing one)? LOL!! Well, would you allow your thirteen-year-old daughter to watch it? Personally, I wouldn't want to watch it, so I wouldn't want to read it. But that's not the same as deciding that it's beyond PG13. I honestly don't know whether it is or not. Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:53:24 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: NEW: Not Lonely (1/1) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed WAFF WARNING!!! I'd like to thank Gracie for her suggestions, and Heather, Fi, and Rose for their encouragement. *************************************************** Not Lonely By Bethy Rated G FDK welcome -- publicly or at *************************************************** I am *not* lonely. Honest. I'm not. I'm just a...solitary person. That's it. I like my privacy. And believe me, I know what I'm talking about. I had *just* got my own apartment -- my own! All mine, one I didn't have to share with anyone -- when, lo and behold, my sister needs a place to say. What could I do? Of course, I let her live with me -- on a temporary basis. Temporary...ha! 'Temporary' for two years! And while she was here, she was forever taking my food, my clothes, my space, and most of all, my coveted privacy. So, you see, now that I have it back, I cherish it. And I'm not lonely. I have friends. Honest, I do. It's just that most of my friends are colleagues from work. So, after seeing them day in and day out, I'm not especially eager to spend all my off time with them. I mean, we usually just end up talking shop or something. Perry's great, but...well, he has his own life. His own set of friends. And Alice. Ah, yes, Alice. His 'life-partner,' 'one and only' -- after the Planet of course! And Perry's like a second father to me...or a first if you want to consider my real father's attitude...no. I'm not going to think about that. I'm not lonely. I do spend time with Perry. A lot. As I said, he's like a father to me. I know what you're thinking -- your father isn't really the best choice for a friend. Right? Well, you're wrong. Perry's a great friend. It just...well...he *is* like a father to me...and he does have his own life... But I'm not lonely! No, sirree! There's...um...Jimmy! Yeah, Jimmy's a friend. I mean, we don't exactly spend much time together; he's always off chasing some new intern or delivery girl; and he's kind of immature...but he's a friend! See, two whole friends! I'm doing good. So I'm not lonely. And then there's Superman. He's just so wonderful. I feel like the most important person in the world when he looks me in the eye. Like the whole world could disappear and it wouldn't matter to him, as long as I was still there. Like all he wants to do is sweep me away to some private place and spend the rest of his life loving me. But then the mask reappears and he hides behind that professional facade again. He won't, or *can't* let me in, and so I'm left alone again. And it's gotten worse since I've been seeing Lex... Lex. Now there's a puzzle. At first it was just the interview I was after, but then he offered more. Or less, if you want to be nit-picky and remember that he never *really* gave me the interview. But he makes me feel special. Wanted. Desirable. I get the feeling he would like more from me, but I just feel a little reticent. It's all been so fast, you know? I've only really known him for a short while. And I still feel like I've never seen the *real* him. He always seems to be putting on a show, wearing a mask -- even when we're alone! Funny, even when I'm *with* him, I still feel alone... But I’m not lonely. Wait! There's Clark! Now he's a friend! He's always willing to put in extra hours at work to help out on a story, even at the detriment of his own plans. And he always manages to find some little joke to cheer me up. And we've even done stuff outside of work! Not too much, mind you. We both want to have some semblance of a life outside work and work colleagues...not that I've had much of one, but you didn't hear me say that. But recently, Clark's been backing away. He's got some problem with Lex, but he won't tell me what it is. And so the seams of our friendship are slowly unraveling, as he moves further away and I stand there, clueless as to how to get him back. And I miss him... But I'm not lonely! If only Sup--no. He's made his choice and he's chosen professional courtesy. And Clark--no, he's leaving, too. And Perry and Jimmy seem to be following them. But there's Lex...always Lex. I am so lonely. * * * Four Years Later * * * In her newly acquired resolve to attempt spring-cleaning, Lois reached for the mess of towels that had fallen to the bottom of the linen closet. Marriage sure had changed her. She always thought of spring cleaning as a chore to be avoided at all costs. Something that was only done when the mess had become so large as to be intolerable. But now...Now she wanted to please him. Imagine, Lois Lane cleaning to please a man! She'd never thought the day would come. But it had. And it had come wearing the name of Clark Kent. She smiled that secret little smile known only to women in love. She'd get this closet cleaned out and then maybe, hopefully, finish their bedroom as well before Clark returned. She couldn't wait to see his reaction! She giggled and finished dumping all the disheveled towels into the laundry basket. She'd wash these and work on the bedroom while she waited. But where to start? She'd just re-made their bed, so that wasn't high on the list of things to do. Vacuum. Yup, that was a good idea. And this time, she was going to take the time to do it right. Under the bed *and* the closet floor. When Lois Lane got it into her head to do a project, she went all out. Phhwwthup! What was that? She thought she'd gotten everything out from under the bed! Reaching down, she pulled out what had clogged the vacuum cleaner. Straightening, she stared at the notebook in her hand. Every now and then, she'd seen Clark writing in this when he'd returned late from a rescue. It was always when she'd been asleep. She would half wake up, see him writing, and fall asleep again without anything truly registering. She always figured he didn't know she'd woken, didn't want to disturb her, and so used the notebook as stress relief. She never knew where he kept it, and since she fell back asleep without ever fully gaining consciousness, she didn't often remember to ask him about it in the morning. But now she was curious. Was that really what he did with it? She desperately wanted to read it, but hesitated. After all, this *was* Clark's private notebook. Maybe there were things in it that he didn't want her to know. *But we're married! We're not supposed to have secrets!* She quickly rationalized her actions and opened to the first page, the vacuum cleaner on the floor beside her, silent and forgotten. {Dear Lois,} she read at the top of the first page, dated soon after they had met. *But why would he be writing to me then?* she wondered. With burning curiosity, she quickly read further. {I know I've just met you, and I know you think I'm some dumb hack from "Nowheresville," but I feel this connection to you. I don't know how to explain it; I don't even think I understand it myself. I just know that, the first time I saw you, even before I learned your name, I knew you were the one for me. It's only been three weeks since that day, but that feeling hasn't diminished one iota. In fact, it's actually grown, which I hadn't thought possible. I don't know what it is about you, Lois Lane, but I love you. I've never told anyone I loved them before, and maybe this doesn't count, since I'm telling a piece of paper that will probably never even be read by you, but that doesn’t change my feelings for you. I love you! I want to be your friend. And then, later, I want to be your best friend. And from there (yeah, I know I'm dreaming, but hey, I'm allowed to!), I'd like to become your boyfriend. And then, following the natural order of things, I'd like to marry you. I know, I know, I'm being awfully presumptuous here. I know. But my heart tells me I'm right with these dreams. I can't promise you much. I'm just a lowly junior reporter, fairly low on the totem pole. Heck, you're even *my* senior partner! I have little money, no fame, and even less to offer you in the way of material or social status. But what I can offer you is eternal love. Because that's how I work -- my love is forever because it is. I will be there to comfort you in your pain, to cry with you in your sorrow, to revel in your success. I will stay up with you when you're tired or sick, and work hard with you on all our projects in life. I will honor your personality and individuality, while working with you as part of a team. I will cherish you -- body and soul. And I will not leave you. Ever. I have spent much of my life alone. Not always lonely, but usually alone. And I know how much that aloneness can hurt. How it can gnaw away at you and make you feel worthless, even in the midst of a crowd. And I promise you, that as long as I am able, I will never leave you lonely. You don't have to be lonely anymore. I love you eternally, Clark} Lois felt the moistness on her cheek and it took a moment to realize that it was tears. Such depths of emotion! She had never realized the extent of Clark's love, and definitely had no idea that it was so strong so early in their relationship. So early that it surely would have seemed that he had no chance of ever seeing his devotion returned. *Oh, Clark. What did I do to deserve you?* She skimmed through many of the following letters and realized that they were all love letters -- to her. He had even continued to write them after they were married! And there was one common theme that continually reoccured -- the promise of companionship. He promised that, if she would let him, he would ensure that she never suffered the curse of loneliness again. *And it worked, Clark,* she thought with a smile, *I'm not lonely anymore.* _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:52:16 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript Comments: To: LabRat MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting discussion, Rat :) You postulated: > Story A is pure gfic. Posted on the gfic boards it attracts a fdk response > of say 15 posts. Most of those 15 posters will be the same 15 who regularly > post fdk to the gfic mbs. You see the same names appearing over and over. > The remainder of the readers are lurkers. Eliminating from that 15 those who > read and post fdk to a story on both gfic and nfic mbs, still leaves say > half that no. who are regular purely gfic posters. > > Over on the nfic mbs, Story B is posted. It receives a similar response > pattern. > > Now...the crux of the problem... > > Story C is a conversion posted to the gfic and nfic mbs. It attracts 15 fdk > posts over on nfic and four or less or none at all over on gfic. > > So...by a simple case of pure arthimetic - where are the remainder of the > gfic regulars? They should be there. But only a small fraction of them have > posted. Let me sum up, and see if I've got it right: Story A (gfic): 15 comments Story B (nfic): 15 comments Story C (nfic/gfic conversion): 19 comments (15 nfic + 4 gfic) Maybe you need to tweak your example because by my arithmatic, the conversion got the most comments, even if the majority of them were on one side. Even if no one had commented on the gfic side, it was still on par with the other stories. I agree with you that there's a cadre of regular fdk'rs (we're not all as faithful as Merry Truitt, but we try ), and I know that some of them do not read nfic, but most of us do ... I know when a story is double-posted at once (say, Shayne's Fugue, to pick a recent example), I want to read it on the nfic side so I don't miss any steamy bits and when I read it there, I generally comment there. Plus when a story is posted as written, the nfic segments are sometimes posted first (the way Brenda's doing now) and then edited to gfic and posted on that side a day later ... so I'll first read it on the nfic side, and comment there. I suspect it's not an unusual pattern. Another factor is, there's a reluctance to start a comments thread. Don't know why (unless it's the slight embarrassment of posting yours at the same time someone else starts one), but I know I've felt it. A story was posted recently on the gfic side. I read it, and liked it, but there was no comments folder ready, so I went on to other threads. A few hours later, I saw there was still no comments folder, so I started one -- and within half an hour, two other people had tagged their comments onto mine. Sometimes someone needs to prime the pump, so to speak, which is one of the reasons I wish authors would start their own comment folders, no matter how bashful! I think I had something else in mind, but I'm overdosed on caffeine right now, so I can't remember it Oh yes! The plain fact is, there are tons more gfic stories being posted at a time than there are nfic. Right now, there are two nfic stories in progress ... they're both being cross-posted to gfic, along with 3 other stories, with two just finished and another one about to start (right Shayne??). That's a lot more stories to keep up with and comments to make. I know I don't always read all the gfic stories. But on the nfic side, there's only one or two going, so we gutter crawlers are desperate to encourage authors to produce more Just a few thoughts, and straying entirely off Hazel's original point, sorry... -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ In America only the successful writer is important, in France all writers are important, in England no writer is important, in Australia you have to explain what a writer is. -- Geoffrey Cotterell ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:55:21 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LabRat asked: > Are you talking about just love scenes per se - those mild encounters we see > in most if not all fic? Gfic included? Because I can't see how you could > separate those out. Particularly in LNC fanfic where the relationship is > such a core element of the majority of fic. Or by love scenes do you mean > sexual content? But that's already separated out into nfic. Or some middling > ground perhaps between the two? I mean lovemaking, but not as explicit as nfic. Sure, dramatic and other stories sometimes include lovemaking, but I'm taking about the kind of story which is far more heavily weighted to a relationship plot. Some of these may almost automatically contain more sensual/lovemaking scenes than other stories. Maybe this is associated with the question I asked later in my post: whether it's content or length, or a mixture. Brief allusions in an otherwise dramatic story - such as the very brief indication of lovemaking in Shayne's Dear Lois - may not be a problem unless over-explicit language is used, and authors tend to self-censor there anyway, and if they don't the Archive does it for them. But is a long PG13 love scene, for example those in fics such as When Friends Become Lovers, Are You Lonesome Tonight, Faux Pas and others, offputting for some people merely because of the length? > I think most of us know of one US term in > particular that would make even a sailor blush in the UK. ;) But which is > considered there to be so mild and innoffensive you could use it in front of > your maiden aunt with no worries. It was even used in an LNC episode. Hmmm... /me is baffled here! LabRat, enlighten me; you may do so privately if you prefer! Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:01:15 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Melisma Subject: Re: NEW: Not Lonely (1/1) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:53 PM 20/02/2001 -0000, you wrote: >WAFF WARNING!!! I'd like to thank Gracie for her suggestions, and >Heather, Fi, and Rose for their encouragement. > > >*************************************************** >Not Lonely >By Bethy >Rated G >FDK welcome -- publicly or at >*************************************************** ::::Shiver:::: Bethy, that was... Ooooooh.... Soooo beautiful... Melisma (speechless under her Rock) Visit my rock at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:01:52 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: List Mom Request for "Fanfic Questions" On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:47:48 -0000, Wendy Richards < w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK> wrote: >Kathy, *thank you*!! You're welcome. :) >I know you know this, but other listmembers may not: when reading on the >Archive web interface, as I do some of the time, it's almost impossible >sometimes to work out what you've read and what you haven't. I read on the website, too, though I haven't run into this exact problem too often. It might be settings thing -- my browser (Netscape) colors posts I've read in red, and unread posts in blue. (Though I think all that history goes away if I clear my cache.) So it might be worth seeing if it's something you can set your browser to do, too. But regardless, I agree that it can be very hard to keep on which topic goes to which question when they aren't labeled. I find it easier on the website, because at least all the threads are grouped. But I don't know how those of you set to MAIL manage!! So hopefully clearer subject lines will make us all read a little easier. :) Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:05:01 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Marnie Rowe Subject: Re: NEW: Not Lonely (1/1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > WAFF WARNING!!! > Bethy this was just and well delivered and the above was thankfully noted, I liked that she was lonely in the midst of co-workers and then at the end she had one true support that opened all sorts of doors for her. Marnie Rowe ~Pobody's Nerfect ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:19:36 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Fw: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pam wrote: >>Let me sum up, and see if I've got it right: > > > > Story A (gfic): 15 comments > > Story B (nfic): 15 comments > > Story C (nfic/gfic conversion): 19 comments (15 nfic + 4 gfic) > > > > Maybe you need to tweak your example because by my arithmatic, the conversion got the most comments, even if the majority of them were on one side. Even if no one had commented on the gfic side, it was still on par with the other stories. > > No, that wasn't what I meant, Pam. Nor do I think it was what I said. Or, giving the benefit of the doubt, even if it was what I said, I think my meaning was still clear enough to make my point understandable without confusing the issue. But I think I've explained the problem, the theory and my take on it enough for one day. By this point I seem to be just repeating myself. That it exists is perhaps most firmly shown by the fact that poor fdk for a conversion as opposed to a gfic has not *always* been the case on the mbs. Take a look a little further back and you'll find no or little discrepency, I believe. This phenomenum has only appeared in the last year. > The fact remains, however you do the math, that conversions only get on average 4 posts. And quite often no response at all. > > > LabRat :) > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 19:22:32 +0000 Reply-To: ampaes@etsii.upv.es Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Amparo Palacios Escrig Organization: Universidad Politecnica Subject: Re: NEW: Not Lonely (1/1) I think I need some tissues. Beautiful Bethy, I really love this little vignettes that lighten my day. Thanks for sharing Amparo ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:47:20 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: List Mom Request for "Fanfic Questions" On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:01:52 -0500, Kathy Brown wrote: >>>I read on the website, too, though I haven't run into this exact problem too often. It might be settings thing -- my browser (Netscape) colors posts I've read in red, and unread posts in blue. (Though I think all that history goes away if I clear my cache.) So it might be worth seeing if it's something you can set your browser to do, too.<<< Oh, IE does that too, but it tends to 'forget' sometimes, for example if I've just posted to the list from the web interface or have loaded the site again from my bookmark. Add to that the fact that I also get individual emails at work, which means that I really do sometimes need help knowing which posts I've read and which I haven't! > I find it easier on the website, >because at least all the threads are grouped. But I don't know how those of >you set to MAIL manage!! Easy: I delete an email once I've read it, or once I've responded to the thread if I want to reply. No need to keep individual list posts, because we can always find them again on the website! Wendy -------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:30:32 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Fw: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript Continuing the sub-thread about MB comments on PG conversions as opposed to nfic and other PG fic: Actually, Rat, I was confused by the figures as well, and saw it in much the same light as Pam. Why should we assume, for instance, that a significant number of nfic readers don't also read PG fic? Maybe one or two don't, but - as Pam mentioned - we've recently converted one nfic fan to PG stories too. My own perception was that comments on PG conversions are low because most people comment on the nfic side. You're right; on occasion, PG comments are almost non-existent. However, I noticed with Fugue that some people who have been reading the nfic version seem to comment on either - sometimes the comment appears on the PG side, and in other instalments on the nfic side. Oddly enough, the comments folder for the PG Faux Pas often had as many, if not more, posts as I've got for a couple of solely PG stories (eg WLST). Certainly I got far more posts overall each time for Faux Pas than for most of my other stories. My other hypothesis is that perhaps sometimes the subject-matter of some nfic conversions isn't of interest to non-nfic readers - so, for example, an nfic conversion might be too WAFFy or sensual or B-plot oriented to appeal to a reader whose preference is for more dramatic or A-plotted stories. Just some thoughts... Wendy --------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 20:55:38 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nicole Wolke Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone :-) my thoughts to the very interesting question Hazel brought up: a) As a writer I have to say, that I agree with Labrat. I'm actually very unsure what is allowed and what is not. My last story "Knocking on Heaven's Door" is a good example. I had no idea if I was stepping over some line or not. *I* didn't think so, but since I have no trouble with reading nfiction myself, I don't think I'm a good judge for that. So I had to rely on my editors. b) To the amount of feedback on the MBs, I tend to agree with Pam. I think there's just a very small amount of people who give feedback regularily and I guess most of them read both, g-fic *and* nfic. So if a story is posted as nfic and as g-fic most of the readers prefer the nfic-version comment on the nfic-board and don't bother to comment on the g-fic board as well. I know at least, that that's what I do. I don't just read nfics, I read a lot of other stories, too and comment on them. Actually my most favorite stories are somewhere in the middle, not very descritpive, but very sensual. c) I don't think that there's a wavering in the line between PG13 and nficion, but one point that hasn't been brought up in the discussion is, that there's an increasing number of "angsty" stories being written lately and I think it's in the nature of those stories to have a more sexual context than other stories. So maybe writers don't want to "push the envelope" as you said, Hazel, but more and more authors throw their readers on emotional rollercoasters and those are even more powerful if you throw some sex in the mix. I think we've always had "most popular" genres in fanfiction though. One year it were New Krypton stories, one year it were Next Generation stories and the next we had a large number of Alt-Universe stories. IMO with the angsty and more sexual stories it's probably the same. Maybe next year we'll have comedy year! Who knows? :-) take care Nicole -- AKA CKgroupie on IRC/AIM NKWolke@t-online.de Are you always searching for news about Dean Cain? And you don't have enough time to search? Here's your solution: Go to "The Dean Cain News Page" http://members.tripod.de/CKgroupie/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 20:24:54 -0000 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Fw: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wendy wrote :) > > Actually, Rat, I was confused by the figures as well, and saw it in much > the same light as Pam. Why should we assume, for instance, that a > significant number of nfic readers don't also read PG fic? Maybe one or two > don't, but - as Pam mentioned - we've recently converted one nfic fan to PG > stories too. > My own perception was that comments on PG conversions are low because most> people comment on the nfic side. You're right; on occasion, PG comments are> almost non-existent. However, I noticed with Fugue that some people who> have been reading the nfic version seem to comment on either - sometimes> the comment appears on the PG side, and in other instalments on the nfic> side. Oddly enough, the comments folder for the PG Faux Pas often had as> many, if not more, posts as I've got for a couple of solely PG stories (eg> WLST). Certainly I got far more posts overall each time for Faux Pas than> for most of my other stories. > > My other hypothesis is that perhaps sometimes the subject-matter of some > nfic conversions isn't of interest to non-nfic readers - so, for example, > an nfic conversion might be too WAFFy or sensual or B-plot oriented to > appeal to a reader whose preference is for more dramatic or A-plotted > stories. > > Just some thoughts... > Some thoughts on the subject were precisely what I was looking for Wendy. It's something that's been puzzling me - as you know, because I've discussed it with you in the past. Hazel's question made me wonder if the reason was partly this pushing of the envelope, so I tossed it out hoping for some insight. If I got some figures wrong, fair enough. But I still think that the point of what I was saying in that post was clear, figures not excepting. But as it seems I'm the only one to think there's any difference, that's fine by me. Subject closed. LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:59:35 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: ChiaraPrato Subject: The weak point 4/5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit *** When she woke, up she realized that it was already a new day outside. She saw both of the men standing just in front of her. "Frankly, Miss Lane, I admire you. I would never have that imagined you would be able to slip that strip from your head, and I never bet that you would be able to resist this long. But how long do you think you'll be able to do that? We could torture you. Pull out your finger nails, burn you with hot irons..." Lois' eyes looked terrified. "Or maybe something like this,. but why don't you reflect on that for a little while? I'll give you another couple of hours... then we'll talk with you again. Perhaps you'll have found a little more of your memory of how to contact Superman." The next hours were the longest of Lois' life. Any noise, no matter how small, made her jump. She was also very cold. She had hoped that the sun would warm the room as much as possible, but this was winter. How could the sun be so warm? What she wouldn't give if only Superman would come and take her away. But with all the Kryptonite, Superman would surely be dead before he would be able to take more than a couple of steps toward her. When the door opened, she was ready to face the worst. This time, the younger man entered alone. "So? Have you decided to help us?" Lois looked at him with hate in her eyes but did not speak. "I already told you not to look at me that way!" Lois turned her head away from him and at that same moment regretted it. She realized her little moment of weakness gave him a lot of power, for the first time since she was there she did what he asked. It was a little thing but she realized he noticed that too. "You see, honey, if you want to you can be smart." The man was now in front of her, laughing, his gun pointed at her head. Lois thought that it was going to be the last thing she was going to see in her life. She tried to focus on Clark's image. For some moments Lois was too scared to close her eyes. She was desperately trying to hide her terror. The man made the same request for the umpteenth time, "How can we contact Superman!" Lois again opened her eyes, trying to be calm, and answered "*I* *don't* *know* *how* *to* *contact* *Superman*!" She saw the man move the gun a couple of inches, she heard the bullet move past her ear and penetrate the column behind her. She opened her eyes wide. The man moved the gun back to in front of her face. "Now then, where is he? Please answer me, it would be a real pity to have to blast your pretty face." Lois' voice trembled when she repeated, "I don't know how to contact Superman." "OK, if that's what you want!" Lois could hear the shot explode. She saw all her life run in front of her eyes as if it was a movie, all in a single instant. It seemed an endless amount of time before she was able to once again open her eyes. She saw the barrel pointed at her. The man moved it and his face was barely an inch apart from hers. "The next time, honey, the bullet may be real... are you wondering!?" He turned and walked away. This time Lois was unable to help herself and she started to sob. She cried for a long time, so much that in the end, in that position, she had trouble breathing. She felt like she might suffocate and it was long minutes later before she was able to draw an almost regular breath. By now she had lost all sense of time. She was so tired. The door opened but she didn't have the strength to look up. There were two men, the same two as always, standing directly in front of her. The younger man inserted his arms between her and the column, Lois moaned. The man moved her wrists towards himself and cut the ropes that were holding them. Her arms slipped along her side while she took a deep breath, it turned out to be too deep though and she started to cough. The men looked at each other then the older one made a gesture. The younger one caught Lois' wrists again and tied them as tightly as they had been earlier, but this time they were in front of her. Then he made sure that Lois' right arm was turned so that the inner portion was exposed to them. /*/ Clark was sleeping deeply when a voice invaded his brain, waking him. Lois was singing, not loudly, just a little bit above a whisper. But it was late; why would she be singing at all? He was by her side in a flash. Her fever was again very high and in her delirium she kept singing and talking. "Would you like to swing on a star carry moonbeams home in jar or be better off than you are or would you rather be a mule A mule is an animal with long funny ears he picks up at anything he hears His back is brawny and his brain is weak he's just plain stupid with a stubborn streak and by the way if you hate to go to school You may grow up to be a mule Oh would you like to swing on a star carry moonbeams home in jar or be better off than you are or would you rather be a fish A fish is an animal that swims in a brook He can't write his name or read a book To fool the people is his only thought and though he's slippery he still gets caught but if that's the kind of life that you wish you may grow up to be a fish." "Lois!" /*/ The man approached her with a syringe in his hand. Lois had been tied so long that she could feel her wrists burning. They had also started to bleed, but she preferred not to look at them. "Are you going to tell us where we can find Superman or do we do this the hard way?" //Hard way? They've only been hitting me since I got here!// "I already told you... I DON'T KNOW HOW TO CONTACT SUPERMAN! I've already told you!" Another violent blow caused her to turn her head. How many blows had she already sustained? She had lost count. "We'll see if you know what this is? A long time ago it was very common... but you know, sometimes the old ways are the best ways... it's fans call it truth serum." Lois shivered. How could she fight this one. She had to think very quickly. the only thing she could do would be to keep her mind busy. She felt the needle penetrate her vein. 'God, help me! Help me not to betray Clark! I don't want to put him in danger!' The older man stared at her for the longest time. Then with an icy calm, he approached to within a few inches from her ear and asked ,"What's your name, darling." "Cat-woman!" she answered with disdain. "Try again. What's your name?" "C..." She wasn't able to complete that thought. "Lois" was all she was able to say. "OK, now we try it with another question. Do you know how to contact Superman?" "I already told you;. I know how to do it!" On her face was written panic, this was getting dangerous. What would Perry say to her in this situation? Surely he would tell her one of his Elvis stories... Elvis! HE was the answer!!! "And now? If you want to be alive tomorrow, you'll have to tell me how we can do it." Lois started to sing, not caring that the man in front of her was hitting her badly all over her body. She didn't sing loudly, it was barely a whisper, but she sang in order to keep her mind busy, so that the serum could not make her talk. She sang for an endless time, after she finished with all the Elvis songs she knew, she moved on to other, more silly songs. Would you like to swing on a star carry moonbeams home in jar or be better off than you are or would you rather be a pig A pig is an animal with dirt on his face his shoes are a terrible disgrace He has no manners when he eats his food He's fat and lazy and extremely rude But if you don't care a feather or a fig you may grow up to be a pig And all the monkeys aren't in the zoo everyday you meet quite a few so come on it's all up to you, you could be better than you are you could be swinging on a star, (big finish) YOU COULD BE SWINGING ON A STAR do do do do do do do dooooo /*/ Clark was unable to make her stop. He dipped a towel into cold water and started bathing her face and arms. He held her close to him, trying to calm her down. He went to the bathroom many times for fresh water with which to bathe her fevered body. After a while Martha was woken by the sound of the running water. "I'm sorry, Mom. I didn't mean to wake you, but her fever is high again..." "It's not a problem, Sweetie, you know that. Doc said this could happen. She is very weak and usually a fever rises during the night. I'll go get her medicine. We have to make her take it then she'll be better. By the way, Doc is going to come over here again tomorrow to check on her." Whenthedayislongandthenight, thenightisyoursalone Whenyou'resureyou'vehadenoughof thislife, wellhangon Don'tletyourselfgo, everybodycries andeverybodyhurtssometimes Sometimeseverythingiswrong, nowit'stimetosingalong Whenyourday isnightalone (holdon, holdon) Welleverybodyhurts, sometimes Everybodycries, everybodyhurts, sometimes everybodyhurtssometimessoholdon, holdon, holdon, Holdon, holdon, holdon, holdon, holdon, Everybodyhurts Youarenotalone "You aren't alone, Lois, I'm here with you... for you..." "Oh, Lucy, I miss Clark so much..." "Honey... I'm here...." "Clark.... Clark... NO!" /*/ ...and in that same moment Dillinger's gun roared. Lois saw Clark's expression change in wonder. She had heard about it, when you are shot, the pain doesn't come for a while. She saw him drop and tried to accompany his fall to the ground. Her tears helped her to see him clearly. She kept calling his name, not caring about what was happening around her. A moment later those men were carrying him away without even giving her enough time to tell him she loved him. Not even giving her enough time to hold her dying friend's hand. "Lucy! You don't understand!. I never told him, I never told him how much I loved him!!! And now it's too late...he died... and I couldn't even hold him in my arms when it happened." /*/ "Please! Lois, forgive me. I never meant it... I never wanted you to suffer... If only I could go back..." he said, holding her tightly. He understood that she was reliving his 'death'. Martha and Clark had to force her to take her medicine. Lois, who seemed not to realize what was happening, rebelled with all her strength, almost as if she were being poisoned. She started to sing again and again it was barely a whisper. Clark held her in his arms the same way he had the previous night, cradling her almost like she were a child, whispering to her of his love and telling her of all the wonderful places he would take her. Several hours flew by before the fever broke and her delirium calmed. By the first light of the new day, she seemed normal again. Lois tried to stretch herself and she smiled when, upon opening her eyes, she saw Clark sleeping close to her. She stared at him for a long while. His one arm was around her waist and the other one was buried in her hair. He was so gorgeous, but there was something different about his face. His glasses were twisted, they had probably moved while he was sleeping. She gently slipped them off, taking care not to wake him . She stared at him carefully then and suddenly her mind let her see the truth. "Oh, my God!" she whispered. 'Clark is Superman, Clark is Superman!!' This explained why he was so vague when she asked how they had gotten to Smallville. This also explained how Superman could be always in the right place at the right time and why Clark vanished so often and his lame excuses for his mysterious disappearances. 'Oh my! I really saved his life.' If they had caught him, they wouldn't have needed much time to figure out he was Superman with all that Kryptonite she knew those crazy men had. They wouldn't have had to make too much of an effort to kill him. //And now? What am I going to do now?// Clark breathed deeply for a moment before waking. Lois stared at him with a smile on her face. "Hi. Good morning...." "How are you?" "A lot of better..." "You had a high fever, you rambled all night..." A mischievous light burned in her eyes. "I didn't let you sleep all night, did I? That's a pity; but that is not the way I had in mind to keep you awake, you know?" Clark laughed, kissing her. "I adore you!" "Me too. Even if... I don't know if I like you more with or without the glasses, but I'm sure I love you more with Clark's hat hair than with Superman's hair." "Lois, when did you... I don't have hat hair!" "Just a few minutes ago... and yeah, you have hat hair." "Are you angry?" "No... yes... I don't know... Probably I'm too tired to be angry. But, I know I love you... and oh my! it's so good it's scary..." "What?" "I want to spend the rest of my life with you... and that scares me." "Lois, I've loved you since the moment I saw you. When you burst into Perry's office... I knew you were the one I wanted to spend my life with." "Really?" "Absolutely!" "I have an excellent way to prove it..." Again that mischievous glint was in her eyes. "Lois?!" His voice was half embarrassed, half amused. "Well, it was just a suggestion..." she said, in the tone of a just rebuked child. "I love your suggestions!" They started to kiss, but a moment later she stopped suddenly. "Clark, the article for the Planet!" "I don't think I like your ideas..." "Come on, grab paper and a pen." "Right now?!" "Then we won't have any interruptions - later..." In less than a second Clark was again sitting next to her with a notebook and a pen. "Wow!" He smiled and kissed her again. "I'm a man who is full of surprises..." "Wonderful" This was, to be sure, the most pleasant article they'd ever written in their lives. It was almost a miracle that they managed to finish it. Every statement was punctuated by a kiss or a laugh or a caress. "Clark? There is something I need to know. When you came to the cliff, you weren't wearing the suit... I mean *you* came, not Superman." "I understand. You want to know how I realized it was a trap?" She nodded. "When that man phoned me I heard you moan. I was so worried. I had been looking for you for a day and a half; I'd x-rayed all of Metropolis, but I hadn't thought about the old lighthouse. By the way, I didn't notice how strange that call was until I heard you moan..." /*/ Lois looked at the men again coming toward her. Each step bringing them closer and closer to her. She wondered if he was really walking that slowly or if she were just too tired. //Please, stop!!// "Well, Lois? You still don't want to help us? However you prefer, but you will help us, sooner or later..." Lois saw him pull out his cell phone and dial a number. "One...two..." The man was counting the rings. "Three... Hello? Daily Planet?" Lois heard her heart beat crazily, it seemed ready to explode. "I need your help..." Lois could hear the false worry in his voice. "You are Mr. Kent, aren't you? They've caught Lois Lane! They are sure she can contact Superman!!! I know they are going to kill her! I don't know if you are able to contact Superman, but please do all you can. He's her only hope; and, Mr. Kent, you're the only one I can trust!" Tears were rolling relentlessly down Lois' cheeks. //Leave Clark out of this... leave him out!!// she begged mentally. //I don't want him to feel responsible!// The man was silent for a while, as though he was listening to what Clark was saying. "Tell your friend that she is being held hostage in the old lighthouse keepers' cottage, 30 miles north of Metropolis. I haven't a clue about her current condition, but I do know this, they are unscrupulous people!!" The man was a few inches from Lois and while his voice sounded really worried, he was caressing her hair. Lois tried to draw away but her ropes were too tight to allow much movement. The only sound she was able to mutter was a soft moan. Lois stared at him through her tears. She saw him end the phone call and then he looked at her with a sort of smile. "It would have been easier if you had talked, you would be saving him a lot of pain." /*/ '"I couldn't cry out, They had gagged me, but he was so close... I was so scared! Clark, I didn't want you to feel guilty. Clark, I didn't want them to catch you too, and when I saw you..." Clark held her in his arms when he realized she was unable to continue. "Honey, it's over... it's over! I arrived in a blur. I was going to enter, but I felt the Kryptonite... There was a lot of it, I guess. I saw you through a window and I tried to go in, but I was barely able to fly. I knew it was a trap. If I had come in, they would have killed us both. So I left so I could get my strength back. I needed more than half of an hour in order to recover enough to decrease the effect of that. I barely was able to walk for minutes. I lost completely almost every power. Then I thought that they were waiting for Superman, not Clark, so I slipped off the suit. Then I heard them take you out of the cottage and bring you to that bluff. They said they would make you cry out and that Superman would surely hear you, or that I would find him and he would be there anyway. I wanted to get you away from there a lot earlier, if only I had been able to, but I couldn't fly and..." Lois caressed his cheek. "You saved my life, anyway I never would have survived that fall if you hadn't been there with me. Clark, I guess you haven't a clue how I felt as we were falling down..." then she added in a whisper, "I was so happy to be able to die in your arms." Clark kissed her and held her. "Honey, you need your rest now. All you have to think about now is getting better." ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:02:31 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carolyn Schnall Subject: Re: Be My Kal-entine In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Missy: Even though I am not familiar with the Strangers universe, I really enjoyed reading this story:) Great job:) Carolyn ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:05:34 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kaethel Subject: Re: Fw: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pam wrote: > > > Maybe you need to tweak your example because by my arithmatic, the > conversion got the most comments, even if the majority of them were on one > side. Even if no one had commented on the gfic side, it was still on par > with the other stories. I think you misconstrued LabRat's point, Pam, although personally I thought it was quite clear (but maybe it's because I agree). The example she took showed that it seemed only four people were reading the fanfic on the PG side. And no, not all the regulars do read nfic - it's not been a very long time since I've started reading nfic (not for an age issue, but for a matter of taste in nfic, which I won't develop here). Besides, even if lots of people on this fandom are over 18 and *can* read nfic, there are still a good number of fans who are under that legal age and stay to the PG side. However, they don't seem to post on PGified stories as much as they do post on PG stories. Why is that? Do they think that an nfic has to stand on its own and they'll be reading an uncomplete story if they read a PGified fic? I admit that it would be the case for me if I were to read a story where the nfic parts would have just been snipped out of the story. However, most nfic writers put a lot of effort into PGifying their fic, and most times end up with a PG story which is as complete and understandable as the nfic version. So no, I don't want nfic authors to stop PGifying their stories. It would be a real loss for the fandom. I know that there are authors whose work I'd have never discovered if they hadn't PGified their nfic, so no way I want you guys to stop doing that. Helene :) Kaethel@club-internet.fr ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:08:32 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carolyn Schnall Subject: Re: A Valentine Vignette In-Reply-To: <3A883369.20792B74@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Hi Nan: The bad news: I have not read much of your stuff, though I had hoped to make an effort after meeting you at LAFF. Hence, I did not really understand all of what was happening in the vignette. I didn't realize it was Lori, not Lois, until after I had started reading it. So, I was a little stumped. There now, I confess it... The good news: it was very nicely written and some of the technical items you referred to seemed inspired:) I hope to rectify the other matter before the next LAFF....:) Carolyn ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:38:09 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Melisma Subject: Re: The weak point 4/5 In-Reply-To: <000f01c09b80$088dbe00$7b8e1997@cp810> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ohhhhhhh!!!! Chiara, part 5 NOW!!!!! Melisma (breathless under her Rock) Visit my rock at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 16:40:38 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Fw: Pushing the Envelope?...Postscript On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:05:34 +0100, Kaethel wrote: >I think you misconstrued LabRat's point, Pam, although personally I thought >it was quite clear (but maybe it's because I agree). The example she took >showed that it seemed only four people were reading the fanfic on the PG >side. Yes, and I understood that much, Helene. I thought, from Pam's post, that she did too. But if, say, 15 are commenting on the nfic side at the same time, should this worry an author? Now, okay, if *no-one* commented on the PG side then there would be a case for saying that there's no need to post over there, and simply post the PG version to the fanfic archive in due course. But as long as there are clearly some readers, even if it's few compared to those who would normally post comments on the PG side but are now posting on the nfic board instead, I don't see a reason to feel frustrated. :) Wendy ------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:00:56 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Rose Cookson Subject: Re: NEW: Not Lonely (1/1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lovely story, Bethy. But then, you know I love it. Now, about that OTHER story you were going to write... :) /me feels very sneaky for having let the cat out of the bag about Bethy's next story... Maybe the other people on the list will help encourage (beg) Bethy to write her next story faster.... Rose ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:14:39 -0000 Reply-To: Yvonne Connell Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Yvonne Connell Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fascinating discussion, guys, and many thanks to Hazel for starting it. I think that PG fanfics written in the last year or two *do* exhibit a tendency to contain more love scenes, and the love-making is described in more luxuriant detail than the fics I read when I first discovered L&C fanfic n years ago. I can't explain why that is, except that perhaps the whole story-telling process has matured a lot; stories today are more complex, longer, and are more likely to be well-crafted, well-written pieces than in the early days. That's not to say that there weren't some very, very good stories written back then; there were lots, but I think we're seeing an even bigger proportion of good versus mediocre/poor these days. I, personally, am writing more love-scenes than when I first began. I don't know why - they just seem to come out that way. And, as others have said, it's incredibly difficult to know where the line is when you're converting an nfic story to PG. So often, I have important feelings and dialogue wrapped up in my love-making scenes which I don't want to lose just because I'm converting the story, because if I did, there would be gaps in my character's motivation for the things they say and do. I don't want to push the envelope, but it's very difficult not to. I choose to write nfic because it allows me to write stories which are grittier than the PG format lets me write. It's not just the love-making which I'm referring to, it's the freedom to write the occasional swear word, or have my characters talk frankly about adult issues, which attracts me. It's certainly not a desire to write something different, it's a desire to write something that happens to interest me and gives me a lot of satisfaction - when I finally manage to squeeze the words out of my brain and down onto the keyboard! That was a lot about me and not much about the general discussion. I'd better shut up now! Yvonne (yvonne@yconnell.fsnet.co.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:19:02 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wanda McCants Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/01 11:44:22 AM Eastern Standard Time, w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK writes: > that we eliminate > anything of an adult nature which *would* be understood by a teenager. I just want to say that I share the stories on the archive with my teen who is now 15, and I have been pleased with the effort that most writers have taken to edit out adult material. Most of the stories I have shared have been Wendy's and Lab's and I screen each story for it's content before I let her read. Now since I have read the nfic version of the story it's a little much to read the story again, but that's parenthood. I haven't personally felt that anyone was "pushing the envelope," but that's just my opinion. Wanda "What happens to a dream deferred? / Does it dry up like a raisin in the sun?" ......Langston Hughes Wanda ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 19:48:04 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:19:02 EST, Wanda McCants wrote: [snip] >>>I just want to say that I share the stories on the archive with my teen who is now 15, and I have been pleased with the effort that most writers have taken to edit out adult material. Most of the stories I have shared have been Wendy's and Lab's and I screen each story for it's content before I let her read. Now since I have read the nfic version of the story it's a little much to read the story again, but that's parenthood. I haven't personally felt that anyone was "pushing the envelope," but that's just my opinion.<<< Wanda, I just wanted to tell you that I feel enormously complimented by what you've said here. Not only on my own behalf (and a little bit of reflected glory on behalf of my friend and excellent writer LabRat ), but generally on behalf of FoLCdom. I know those of us who edit down our nfic, and who GE for the Archive, try very hard to stay within the guidelines, and we might not always get it right. But what you just said makes all the hard work worthwhile. Thank you :) Wendy ---------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:55:12 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Liz Stalker Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? I think this is a great discussion, but, one further thought, is it okay to also include this as a discussion on Zoomway's message boards, to get input from those that don't read here? Liz S. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 03:31:24 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: John Debbage <106532.433@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 As usual, I'm coming to this thread a little late and my answers aren't s= o profound as some of the other authors who've responded but this is such a= n interesting question that I would like to forward my thoughts. I'd agree that some of the stories have changed; for one thing they have gotten longer and more complex, but on the point of them crossing the boundaries of PG-13, I'm not sure if this is strictly reserved to the wor= ld of L&C. I believe that in general this standard has laxed and so writers= , perhaps unwittingly, go with the trend. Also, many of the newer fics deal with Lois and Clark as a couple, either= dating or married. There are certain things that married people do and that's why I do include in my stories scenes from the bedroom, However, = I never go further than the part in old movies when the scene would . . . fade to black. This is not because of my moral standing but because I'm = no good at writing 'steamy' scenes.:) Nowadays too, in many cultures it is considered common practise for peop= le dating to have a sexual relationship and so even the 'falling in love' stories often include more explicit scenes. I would think that if a writ= er doesn't go into explicit detail when describing these sexual encounters then a fic still might be considered PG-13. = And that still doesn't touch on the problem of 'adult discussion' or usin= g 'stronger language'. Though I'm fairly sure that most of the fiction on L&C archive is fairly tame considering what some teens watch on movies/videos and talk about between themselves. Now whether all this is good or bad depends on one's own point of view bu= t I do think that it's a case of RL having an effect on how far the writers= believe they can go while still remaining in the bounds of gfic. On the whole I think that Kathy and the archive staff do a difficult job very well and I also think that most of the writers are fairly responsibl= e. posting their stories in the proper forums. Yours Jenni Debbage = ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 04:46:48 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Lab Rat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:19:02 EST, Wanda McCants wrote: >I just want to say that I share the stories on the archive with my teen who >is now 15, and I have been pleased with the effort that most writers have >taken to edit out adult material. Most of the stories I have shared have been>Wendy's and Lab's and I screen each story for it's content before I let her>read. Now since I have read the nfic version of the story it's a little much>to read the story again, but that's parenthood. I haven't personally felt>that anyone was "pushing the envelope," but that's just my opinion. Wanda, I wanted to reiterate my thanks for your thoughtfulness in letting me know this. It certainly does make the long hours of worrying over a single phrase like a Rottweiller with a meatbone worthwhile and it's always reassuring to know that the conversion has been a success for at least one reader. Thank you. :) Wendy: Thank you for the compliment. LabRat ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:05:15 -0000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Fw: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Seems I might have the same problem as LabRat now! She sent this yesterday, intended for the list, and I only received it at my work account this morning: -------------- Wendy wrote: > I mean lovemaking, but not as explicit as nfic. Sure, dramatic and other > stories sometimes include lovemaking, but I'm taking about the kind of story > which is far more heavily weighted to a relationship plot. Some of these may > almost automatically contain more sensual/lovemaking scenes than other > stories. Maybe this is associated with the question I asked later in my > post: whether it's content or length, or a mixture. Brief allusions in an > otherwise dramatic story - such as the very brief indication of lovemaking > in Shayne's Dear Lois - may not be a problem unless over-explicit language > is used, and authors tend to self-censor there anyway, and if they don't the > Archive does it for them. But is a long PG13 love scene, for example those > in fics such as When Friends Become Lovers, Are You Lonesome Tonight, Faux > Pas and others, offputting for some people merely because of the length? Ah, I see. I'm still not sure how these could be contained as some kind of separate sub genre though. Are you suggesting some kind of grading system by theme? [Wendy writes: And, since I have the opportunity, my reply: I wasn't actually proposing anything involving separating such stories out. I just wondered whether the kind of stories which have a *lot* of sensual content tend to be more B-plotted stories in any case, and - just as there are people who view crossovers and next-gens as less favourite types of story - I'm sure there are those who prefer a heavily A-plotted fic to those with no A-plot. I know that I'm usually aware of who is less likely to be reading one of my mainly relationship-plot stories; I sometimes pick up different readers for stories in which I include more of an A-plot] > Hmmm... /me is baffled here! LabRat, enlighten me; you may do so privately > if you prefer! Okay, I'll take the risk, since it is such a completely innocent term in most of the world and although an offensive one in the UK, (and, so far as I know only in the UK) these days most people know that it *is* only the UK and recognise its duality. Besides which, even though it's considered offensive in the UK, it's fallen out of favour and is these days rarely used or thought on and it's impact if used would probably be much less than it used to be in years gone by. By that - somewhat convoluted - reckoning there shouldn't be anyone to offend. I think. [g] I was talking about the infamous 'f***y'. An entirely innocent term in the US and elsewhere, having a completely different and offensive meaning in the UK. It took me a time to stop wincing whenver I saw that one used in US fanfic and back in the days when it was still used widely here in the UK and considered highly offensive I was postively scandalised first time I saw it used in fanfic. LabRat :) (watching the US readers fall over laughing at that one being blanked out. ;) ) [Wendy writes: Some of us finally worked it out on IRC last night, and it was most amusing explaining to the US FoLCs present what a 'fanny pack' might mean over here! ] -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 07:15:03 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 02/21/2001 3:32:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, 106532.433@COMPUSERVE.COM writes: << I'd agree that some of the stories have changed; for one thing they have gotten longer and more complex >> Yes, Jenni, there are certainly more longer stories--much to my delight. :) --Laurie (wondering when Jenni is going to write another [long] Kent family story) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 09:08:48 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Terry S. Horowit" Subject: Fwd: overlord instructions Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" I found this list hilarious, and quite a few of them are applicable to L&C stories and/or episodes. Terry >Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 23:42:17 -0800 >From: Stephanie Vardavas >Subject: overlord instructions > > > From: http://www.angelfire.com/la2/bahumuth/warlord.txt > > If I ever become an Evil Overlord: > > 1. My legions of terror will have helmets with clear plexiglass > visors, not face-concealing ones. > > 2. My ventilation ducts will be too small to crawl through. > > 3. My noble half-brother whose throne I usurped will be killed, not > kept anonymously imprisoned in a forgotten cell of my dungeon. > > 4. Shooting is _not_ too good for my enemies. > > 5. The artifact which is the source of my power will not be kept on > the Mountain of Despair beyond the River of Fire guarded by the > Dragons of Eternity. It will be in my safe-deposit box. > > 6. I will not gloat over my enemies' predicament before killing them. > > 7. When the rebel leader challenges me to fight one-on-one and asks, > "Or are you afraid without your armies to back you up?" My reply will > be, "No, just sensible." > > 8. When I've captured my adversary and he says, "Look, before you kill > me, will you at least tell me what this is all about?" I'll say, "No." > and shoot him. > > 9. After I kidnap the beautiful princess, we will be married > immediately in a quiet civil ceremony, not a lavish spectacle in three > weeks time during which the final phase of my plan will be carried > out. > > 10. I will not include a self-destruct mechanism unless absolutely > necessary. If it is necessary, it will not be a large red button > labelled "Danger: Do Not Push". > > 11. I will not order my trusted lieutenant to kill the infant who is > destined to overthrow me -- I'll do it myself. > > 12. I will not interrogate my enemies in the inner sanctum -- a small > hotel well outside my borders will work just as well. > > 13. I will be secure in my superiority. Therefore, I will feel no need > to prove it by leaving clues in the form of riddles or leaving my > weaker enemies alive to show they pose no threat. > > 14. I will not waste time making my enemy's death look like an > accident: I'm not accountable to anyone and my other enemies wouldn't > believe it. > > 15. I will make it clear that I _do_ know the meaning of the word > "mercy"; I simply choose not show them any. > > 16. One of my advisors will be an average five-year-old child. Any > flaws in my plan that he is able to spot will be corrected before > implementation. > > 17. All slain enemies will be cremated, not left for dead at the > bottom of the cliff. The announcement of their deaths, as well as any > accompanying celebration, will be deferred until after the > aforementioned disposal. > > 18. My undercover agents will not have tattoos identifying them as > members of my organization, nor will they be required to wear military > boots or adhere to any other dress codes. > > 19. The hero is not entitled to a last kiss, a last cigarette, or any > other form of last request. > > 20. I will never employ any device with a digital countdown. If I find > that such a device is absolutely unavoidable, I will set it to active > when the counter reaches 117 and the hero is just putting his plan > into operation. > > 21. I will design all doomsday machines myself. If I must hire a mad > scientist to assist me, I will make sure that he is sufficiently > twisted to never regret his evil ways and seek to undo the damage he's > caused. > > 22. I will never utter the sentence "But before I kill you, there's > just one thing I want to know." > > 23. When I employ people as advisors, I will occasionally listen to > their advice. > > 24. I will require my legions of doom to attend target > practice so that they will have some chance of actually hitting > greatly outnumbered noble rebels. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:57:10 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Fw: Re: Pushing the Envelope? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LabRat wrote: >> I was talking about the infamous 'f***y'. An entirely innocent term in the US and elsewhere, having a completely different and offensive meaning in the UK. >> Wendy wrote: < [Wendy writes: Some of us finally worked it out on IRC last night, and it was most amusing explaining to the US FoLCs present what a 'fanny pack' might mean over here! ] > Good thing you included the term in your example above, Wendy, since I had absolutely *no idea* what f***y could mean Even with my imagination working overdrive, I would never have guessed the true meaning! Christy attalanta@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:57:07 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: First Fight 1/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi guys. Here is the first part of First Fight, the sequel to First Night. I am still looking for a series title, so if anyone has any ideas. . .And I am desperate for feedback (but you guys know that!) Anyway, hope you guys enjoy it! It is still being read for typos, so if there are any they should be fixed by the time I send it anywhere else. ***** First Fight ***** Clark looked down at the beautiful woman lying next to him under the covers of the big bed. He laid back, resting his head against the headboard and staring at the ceiling. It was real. It hadn't been a dream. He was married to Lois Lane; no, he was married to Lois Kent, he thought with a smile. His mom never would believe that he HAD found the girl from the hotel, and what's more, that he had married her. He had found a marriage license in his pocket the night before, so he knew it was legal. Lois had fallen asleep long before he did. He only needed about three hours a night anyway, but he was just too keyed up. So he had waited for his wife. . . *Wife* he thought, *must be the most wonderful word in the English language. Or any other language for that matter.* And Clark knew almost every language in the world. He had waited for his wife to fall asleep and then walked over to the window and stared out at the city for some time. He had picked up all of their clothes and laid them neatly on the chairs in the room. It wouldn't do for the clothes to get all wrinkled just because they hadn't had time to take them off more neatly. As he had tried to brush the wrinkles from his coat, the paper had fallen out of his pocket. On it was a yellow sticky note from that Wells guy saying that he was sorry for tricking them, but he knew they would be happy together; and yes, it was all legal. But, oh man, did they have a lot to talk about. Marriage was difficult under the best circumstances; but this, this was all new territory. He hadn't known what to think when she had started kissing him. For crying out loud, he hadn't even known if they were . . . compatible. But he knew now that they were. *Most definitely compatible*, he thought as a lazy grin spread across his face. He looked over at the clock and realized what time it was. *Oh, man. We better get going, or Perry is going to fire both of us*. He looked at his still sleeping wife and groaned. Neither one of them had anything suitable to wear to work. He reached over and gently shook her shoulder. "Lois? Lois? Honey, we better get going or Perry's going to have our hides. Come on, sweetie, we gotta go." "Just ten more minutes," came the sleepy reply. "Please, Clark, ten more . . ." Her eyes popped wide open. "Clark? What happened?" She looked around and saw her dress laid neatly over the chair and realized just what she wasn't wearing. "Well, I'd like to think that marrying the man of your dreams would leave you with a little more memory than that," he teased. "It wasn't a dream? I married CJ - you - Clark. And you carried me up here and . . ." she sat up straight, clutching the sheets close. "Were we floating?" Clark looked panicked for a second, but quickly recovered. "It sure felt like it, didn't it?" He grinned. Lois looked down at the clock. "Clark! We're gonna be late. Perry is gonna kill us." "Can we call him and tell him that. . ." "That what? Sure, just call him up and say, 'Hi, Perry. Can Clark and I have the day off? No, we haven't figured out what the President is up to. No, neither one of us has the Ebola virus. And I know that Clark hasn't even worked there a week, but we really need the day off. See, remember that guy that I told you about when I was really emotional that day this summer? Yes, the one from Washington. Well, Clark is that guy; and we, well, last night, we, see, we got married.' Sure, Clark, that sounds like a great plan." Lois was almost completely dressed by this time and she looked at Clark who was still lying under the covers. "Aren't you coming? Or do you WANT to lose your job? Don't even tell me that. We are going to need both of our incomes if we are going to have a decent place to live. I am NOT supporting a deadbeat husband. And don't try to tell me you're modest. It's WAAAAAYY too late for that. Wait," she stopped in mid-tirade. "Are we even sure this is legal?" Clark sighed. "No. Lois, it's not any of that. Yes, it is legal; the paperwork is on the table. And you're right. We can't call Perry. Do you remember that there was something that I needed to tell you last night?" "Later, Kent - we've got to go. Check out is already taken care of." She picked up the papers and walked over to open the door. "Are you coming or not? Well, I need to go to my apartment and you need to go to wherever it is that you are staying. Tell me where it is and I'll meet you there at nine. Okay. Bye." And she walked out closing the door. Clark stood up and began to spin. When he finished he was completely dressed and walked out to the balcony. He looked down and saw Lois climb into a cab on her way to her apartment. He glanced around to make sure no one was watching and then took off. He flew as high into the atmosphere as he dared. When he made it above the clouds, he let out an inhuman scream. He just felt the need for the release and he didn't have time to fly to the Arctic. The smile couldn't be wiped off his face. Not today. He wished that he had time to go see his mom and dad, but even as fast as he could get there and back, he didn't have time to do that either. He landed quickly and quietly in the alley next to the seedy hotel that he was calling home. *Home. What kind of home can I give Lois? I can't bring her here tonight and her sister is staying with her, I think. I don't even know if my sister-in-law is staying with my WIFE. This is a mess. I can't afford anyplace better right now. That is on my list of things to do today. Find a place to live that my WIFE and I can afford.* He entered the hotel room and realized that he had less than five minutes to get ready. He jumped in the shower and had just gotten out when he heard the knock on the door. Lois was tapping her foot impatiently, looking at her watch, when he opened the door. Her eyes widened as she took in the smooth muscular chest and narrow waist that was Clark. *Wow, look at that six pack.* She swallowed hard and said, "I said nine, I thought you'd be naked," she said. Tearing her eyes off that body was something she just didn't want to do. She realized too late what had slipped out of her mouth, and tried desperately to cover, hoping he hadn't noticed. "Ready," she corrected, looking as indifferent as she could under the circumstances. He pulled her into his arms and kissed her. He grinned when he saw the shocked look on her face. "I'm your husband, Lois, its okay. I'll be out in a jiff," he promised, vanishing into his tiny bathroom. Lois walked in, and swatted the door shut, never taking her eyes off of Clark's well-muscled back. *How can he keep such a gorgeous body underneath those suits and ties? And HOW did I not notice last night?* But it had been dark last night and she'd had other things on her mind. Deciding that that those thoughts would only make them later for work, she turned to what passed for a kitchen. She had called Perry to find out were he was staying and now she knew why Perry had been reluctant for her to come looking for him. She walked into the *kitchen* and opened a cupboard hoping to find a glass for juice. All she found was Twinkies, Ding Dongs and Hohos. Shock crossed her face and she pictured the six pack again. *It's just not FAIR! How does he do that?* She looked disdainfully at the glass drying in the sink, peering inside to make sure it was clean. When she opened the fridge in search of some orange juice, she was astonished by an even vaster array of junk food stuffed in there. French onion dip, peanut butter twix, and Swiss Cake Rolls. *Well, at least most of it's chocolate,* she thought ruefully. The phone rang breaking her out of her disgust. "Can you get that please, honey. I'll be right out," Clark called. She grumbled to herself as she crossed the small room to the . . .pay phone? *Honey. He sure seems to be making this transition fairly easily.* "Sure, dear, whatever you want." Her voiced dripped sweetness. *But I always said I wanted to be Mrs. CJ, well, Mrs. Clark, I guess I am. I am Mrs. Clark Kent now. Hmm. It has a nice ring to it.* She smiled to herself. Maybe this wasn't so bad after all! She picked up the phone. "Hello? Clark's pay phone. Mrs. Clark speaking," she giggled. "Excuse me? Who is this?" "This is Mrs. Clark. You know, Clark's wife. Who's this?" "Clark's mother. Last night he didn't have a wife. Who are you and where is my son?" "Actually, we got married last night. *Very* sudden. We would have invited you, but. . ." A noise behind her startled her, and she turned around with an alarmed expression. Surely Clark couldn't have dressed so quickly! He couldn't possibly be coming out wearing less than that towel, could he? Though the possibilities were enticing, they didn't have time for that right now and she was on the phone with his mother. Clark emerged from the bathroom, neatly dressed in his usual suit and tie. She gasped, wondering how on earth he had dressed so quickly, and then shook her head. Clark unobtrusively checked his zipper, wondering what she was staring at. "Who is it, sweetheart?" he asked as he leaned over to plant a kiss on her lips but was stopped short by a hand on his chest. "Your mom," she hissed. He grabbed the phone. "Mom, how are you? I was just getting ready to call." He looked over at Lois and mouthed, "Did you tell her?" Lois nodded guiltily. Clark looked up at the ceiling as if in silent prayer. "No, mom, I'm okay. Really, I am. Married? Yes, actually I am. I would have called you but it was so sudden. Who? Well, you remember me telling you about Lois? The girl I met in DC and that I was pretty sure that Lois Lane was her? Well, that's who I married. No, we haven't had a chance to talk about all of that yet. Dad? Everything is fine, really. No, I haven't told her yet. We haven't had a chance to really talk things out. No, I don't know where we are going to live. I know, dad, like a frog. I've heard it a million times. Yes, I'll bring her out to meet you soon. No, probably not tonight. I mean, how could we get there so fast? It would cost an arm and a leg to get plane tickets on such short notice. No, I don't think that it's a good idea for you to come here. Where would you stay? We don't even have a place of our own yet. And my sister-in-law," Lois smiled at that remark, "is staying at Lois' apartment right now. Look mom, dad, I gotta go. We're already late for work and Perry's sure to fire me at least. No, we aren't taking any time off just yet. I'm sure he would give us the time, but he doesn't know yet. You're the only people who know. Except for the three people at the wedding. I don't even know if Lois told the clerk at the hotel when we checked in last night. No, not this hotel. Give me a little credit, mom. We stayed downtown. Now, I really have to go. I'll call you later. I love you, too. Bye." "We'd better be going." He nodded agreeably, and Lois started towards the door. She turned back suddenly, unable to contain her curiosity, the words tumbling out, one on top of the other. "So, explain something to me, husband of mine. You... you... eat like an eight-year-old, and you look like Mr. Hardbody." She laughed, that laugh that makes everyone uncomfortable, feeling silly for having said anything. "What's your secret? And can I have it? I *am* your wife you know. You are supposed to share everything with me." she joked. He looked at her as though he had no idea what she was talking about, and with a grunt of disgust she opened the door to leave. "And there's a lot of things about that conversation that I want to know more about." Clark grinned as he followed her out. She might want to pretend that she hadn't been ogling him, but he knew better. And he liked the thought of his wife ogling him. He was not, however, looking forward to the conversation he knew was necessary. ***** After they arrived at work, finished getting chewed out by Perry, and got their assignments for the day, there was no time left that morning for a talk. In fact, they barely saw each other at all. Later that morning Clark walked across the street to the Daily Planet just as Lois *Kent* climbed out of a cab. "Morning, Lois," he greeted cheerfully, wondering if she was going to take his last name. "Maybe for you, I've been at it for hours," she retorted, then softened the words with a smile. "I went back to Bob Marvin's house to find him, but he still wasn't home," she said sourly. Just then they heard a yell from up above the street. They looked up and saw a man holding on to an I-beam five stories in the air. "Help! I can't hold on! Someone - help me! Please!" Lois hurried closer, fumbling in her big purse for her ever-present notebook to get the story, not noticing that Clark, instead of following, had slipped away from the crowd. He used his special vision to make sure that there was no one else in the alley and he shot into the air. "We need help! People, stand back! There's a man up there!" The man let out a yell as he lost his grip on the beam. His arms flailed as he fell. Suddenly, out of nowhere, a dark streak appeared in the sky. The man appeared to be pushed by the streak onto a platform a few feet away, just off the ground. The streak continued on out of sight. The man just stood there stunned and then he pointed. "That man... that man saved me, that man," he said in astonishment. Lois turned, but there was no one there except Clark, who, walking up behind Lois, looked rather disheveled. Clark gave her a confused look. "He flew me over here," the worker insisted before he passed out. "He's delirious!" Clark said to Lois. "Obviously!" She gave him a good look, her face crinkled in distaste, and she brushed some dirt from his lapels. "Look at you, you're a mess! From now on do what I do, bring a change of clothes to work." She went on in a whisper, "Can't have any husband of mine being a mess." She smiled at him as she strode towards the revolving doors, leaving a relieved Clark hurrying to keep up with her. "Go on upstairs. I'll meet you in a minute." "You mean you don't want to ride in the elevator with me?" He grinned at her. She looked up at him, a smile crossing her face. "No, I would like to, but we'll never get any work done if that elevator stops like it did yesterday. Now go." Clark sighed. "You're no fun. I'll see you later." He wanted to kiss her, but the look she gave stopped him in mid-movement. "Maybe I'll just save that for later." "Good idea." She watched as he walked over to the elevator. They looked into each other's eyes until the door closed. *Sheesh, what is the deal with us and elevators?* ***** TBC ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:10:16 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Judith Williams Subject: OT School project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I received this and thought that all the FOLCs worldwide might like to contribute to it. As you will see, it only takes a minute and I know these kids would be very excited to get responses from so many different places. If I'm out of line with this, I apologize. :) Jude >Class Project > >Hello! We are in the 4th grade at Oliver Beach Elementary School in >Baltimore, Maryland. We are located in Baltimore County, just outside >of Baltimore City and not too far from Washington, DC. Our teacher, >Miss Gretchen M DeVos, is helping us by using her e-mail address as our >e-mail receiver. We have decided, after seeing this done at another >school, to map an e-mail project. We are curious to see where in the >world our e-mail will travel the Internet, between the period of January >27 to February 27, 2001. (only 1 month). This is not a pen-pal >project, so we will not write you back (unless you request it). We >would like your help. If you receive this message, we ask that you: > >1) E-mail back at gretchendevos@hotmail.com and tell us your >city/state/location so we can plot it on our map, AND > >2) Send this letter on to everyone you know so that they can send it on >to everyone they know (and so on) to help us reach even more people. >(We don't mind receiving repeats so send it on to everyone. We're >tracking the number of responses we receive by making a graph in our >math classes using the numbers received by state.) We will post our >results on our school's web page after our deadline so that you can see >how we did. > >With your help, we can make this a very fun and exciting learning >experience. PLEASE help us. Thank you for any help you can give. Our >e-mail address is: > > gretchendevos@hotmail.com > >Your friends, > >Oliver Beach Elementary School >Miss DeVos' Fourth Grade Class >12912 Cunninghill Cove Road >Baltimore, Maryland 21234 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:05:41 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Judith Williams Subject: Re: OT School project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry everyone. My reply to the school bounced back several times. Don't know if Hotmail is have\ing problems or if the school computer is shut down for a holiday. Apologies. o) Jude. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judith Williams" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 10:10 AM Subject: OT School project > I received this and thought that all the FOLCs worldwide might like to > contribute to it. As you will see, it only takes a minute and I know these > kids would be very excited to get responses from so many different places. > If I'm out of line with this, I apologize. :) Jude > > >Class Project > > > >Hello! We are in the 4th grade at Oliver Beach Elementary School in > >Baltimore, Maryland. We are located in Baltimore County, just outside > >of Baltimore City and not too far from Washington, DC. Our teacher, > >Miss Gretchen M DeVos, is helping us by using her e-mail address as our > >e-mail receiver. We have decided, after seeing this done at another > >school, to map an e-mail project. We are curious to see where in the > >world our e-mail will travel the Internet, between the period of January > >27 to February 27, 2001. (only 1 month). This is not a pen-pal > >project, so we will not write you back (unless you request it). We > >would like your help. If you receive this message, we ask that you: > > > >1) E-mail back at gretchendevos@hotmail.com and tell us your > >city/state/location so we can plot it on our map, AND > > > >2) Send this letter on to everyone you know so that they can send it on > >to everyone they know (and so on) to help us reach even more people. > >(We don't mind receiving repeats so send it on to everyone. We're > >tracking the number of responses we receive by making a graph in our > >math classes using the numbers received by state.) We will post our > >results on our school's web page after our deadline so that you can see > >how we did. > > > >With your help, we can make this a very fun and exciting learning > >experience. PLEASE help us. Thank you for any help you can give. Our > >e-mail address is: > > > > gretchendevos@hotmail.com > > > >Your friends, > > > >Oliver Beach Elementary School > >Miss DeVos' Fourth Grade Class > >12912 Cunninghill Cove Road > >Baltimore, Maryland 21234 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:16:38 -0500 Reply-To: "Heidi A. Bingham" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Heidi A. Bingham" Organization: Impressions Web Page Design Subject: Re: OT School project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Sorry everyone. My reply to the school bounced back several times. Don't > know if Hotmail is have\ing problems or if the school computer is shut down > for a holiday. Apologies. o) Jude. Jude ~ I've seen these things before. They're generally fakes. ~ Heidi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:24:30 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: James Tull Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? Elisabeth and I have been wondering the same thing. Due to our personal convictions we will not nominate or cast a vote for any story that has premarital sex in it. It was really difficult this year to read an absolutely fabulous fic and have that happen in the last scene. It tore us up to give the story the 'boot' because of just one scene, but that is our conviction. And we had to do that a LOT this year. Last year there was not nearly as much. >>*Should* the envelope be pushed?<< No. I no more want it here than in Hollywood. >>Is this something I just don't understand?<< Possibly, just like us, I suppose. >>Do authors *want* to push the envelope?<< I know that 7 days of Superman pushed the envelope in regard to the graphic nature of some of the violence contained there in. And if the Archive Editors want it toned down when I submit it, so be it. (I know it made my wife go 'ick' a couple of times. ;-) >>Is this just the current trend of writing, like the longer length of fics, and will eventually reverse itself?<< I think so. >>*Should* it be reversed?<< Personally, I hope so, but I know that my opinion is in the minority. >>Am I alone in thinking that fics have changed, and if they have, is it for the better -- or for the worse?<< You are not alone and it depends on the story. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 12:19:58 -0700 Reply-To: erink@ida.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Erin Klingler Subject: Re: OT School project In-Reply-To: <007a01c09c3a$d069ba40$9d57d618@knology.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >> Sorry everyone. My reply to the school bounced back several times. Don't >> know if Hotmail is have\ing problems or if the school computer is shut >down >> for a holiday. Apologies. o) Jude. > >Jude ~ I've seen these things before. They're generally fakes. ~ Heidi > Actually, I seriously doubt this one's fake. :) I participated in this a couple of months ago, and I got a really nice email back stating all the places the email had gone, to what countries, and what countries they still had missing. I think that if it had been a fake, someone wouldn't have gone to all the trouble to email me back with detailed info. :) JMHO, though. Erin __________________ erink@ida.net Visit my LNC/Kerth Website: www.ida.net/users/davek ***** "It's not the years that count, it's the moments...right now, as they happen." __________________ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:37:03 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: OT School project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting. I found this on the CIAC Hoaxbusters website: <> I guess it was the fact that the address given was a hotmail account in the teacher's name made me look it up on a hoax site. :( --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:46 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nicole Wolke Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Folcs, > Due to our personal convictions we will not nominate or cast a vote for any > story that has premarital sex in it. It was really difficult this year to > read an absolutely fabulous fic and have that happen in the last scene. It > tore us up to give the story the 'boot' because of just one scene, but that > is our conviction. And we had to do that a LOT this year. > Last year there was not nearly as much. I don't mean to be offensive, but maybe a reason is just that the times are changing? Or the writer's genereation or maybe even the nationality of the writers? I just have to say that premarital sex for example is not only common in my country, it is the rule. I don't want to paint a picture of a Sodom and Gomorrha that I live in, but I don't think I lie, when I say, that I have *never* ever heard of anyone stating he or she wanted to wait for marriage here. Honestly, I thought it was cute that Clark was a virgin, but I thought it was something very special and just because he was an alien and a very special person. It's *not* comon here and virginity is *not* a topic here either, it wasn't even a topic anymore in the generation of my parents. There're as many unmarried couples in my aquaintance than married one and even if they do get married at one point, it's the rule to move in together way before marriage. Even in the more catholic parts of the country (that's the part where I live for example) marriages are seldom planned without the "heir" being on his way already. When I married nine years ago, everyone congratulated my parents for becoming grandparents and people were very surprised when they heard there was no Baby on its way, but that we just got married, because we wanted to. *That* was unusual, not the other way round. Please, I don't want to discuss the pro or contra of premarital sex, some people might feel that these developements are deplorable, others might think it's just the right attitude. That's not my point. My point is, that probably every writer in Germany would not think twice about writing about Lois and Clark making love before they are married. The only question would be, if it is out of character, since it changes the series canon, but for us, the more "realistic" choice to write about their relationship would be the premarital sex one. It's not to push the envelope. It's just the way we live. Nicole -- AKA CKgroupie on IRC/AIM NKWolke@t-online.de Are you always searching for news about Dean Cain? And you don't have enough time to search? Here's your solution: Go to "The Dean Cain News Page" http://members.tripod.de/CKgroupie/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:07:29 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:46 +0100, Nicole Wolke wrote: [long snip] >The >only question would be, if it is out of character, since it changes the >series canon, but for us, the more "realistic" choice to write about >their relationship would be the premarital sex one. Nicky, I agree. I don't think it's even out of character for Lois and Clark themselves not to wait; after all, had Jimmy not interrupted them, they would have made love in Super Mann. Personally, until *that* conversation in VD I was convinced that they were already lovers, but that we just hadn't seen them in bed because of concern for younger viewers. Lois wasn't a virgin, so clearly she saw nothing wrong with premarital sex; it wasn't a matter of conscience for her, but one of being sure it was what she wanted. As for Clark, there was clearly more to it, but the series gives us to believe that it was because he wouldn't make love with someone without telling her his secret, rather than it being from any distaste for premarital sex - his attitude in Chip off the Old Clark tells us that, too. Wendy --------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:20:12 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kate Crane Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/21/01 11:51:14 AM Pacific Standard Time, NKWolke@T-ONLINE.DE writes: > The > only question would be, if it is out of character, since it changes the > series canon, but for us, the more "realistic" choice to write about > their relationship would be the premarital sex one. It's not to push the > envelope. It's just the way we live. > > Thanks for that very interesting take on life (and sex) in Germany. As one who would agree with the no premarital sex advocation, I was in no way offended by your explanation. You do make a good point about series canon, though. Though I do not as a rule, read nfic, I am usually not offended, but surprised when the author includes premarital sex of the pg-13 variety, between L&C, as it did not occur in the series. I do tend to skim over these scenes unless extremely well-written, because it somehow tends to get a bit monotonous. I always admire the author who can evoke new emotions from this reader of 1000+ fics ;). And yes, I do believe we are pushing the envelope, just like the rest of society is, and I always appreciate Hazel for her timely messages that might help us to draw the line if needed. I love romance, good A-plots, but appreciate the fade to black scenarios that leaves the love-making to our own imaginations. Kate ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:55:39 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Hazel Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.0.20010219113411.00aa1940@actcom.co.il> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Many thanks to all of you who have, so far, participated in this discussion. I asked: Has the perception of "PG-13" changed over the last two years? Several replies included comments such as: Carol Malo: Nevertheless, so much pop culture is sexually explicit that our L & C fic seems very tame. Marnie: When half the shows on prime time television are getting more and more explict... Jenni: I believe that in general this standard has laxed and so writers, perhaps unwittingly, go with the trend.I do think that it's a case of RL having an effect on how far the writers believe they can go while still remaining in the bounds of gfic. And Nicole: maybe a reason is just that the times are changing? It's not to push the envelope. It's just the way we live. A few such comments were made on the message board thread too. So it looks like my hypothesis was right, and that the envelope of PG-13 is being pushed not just in LnC, but all over the world. How sad. And, for me, very frustrating. I'd hate to have to leave this marvelous fandom; I hope the envelope won't get pushed any further! At least it's nice to know I wasn't imagining things when I asked my question in the first place. :) I'm also a little surprised to see that very many of you feel that the gficcing of nfics plays a large part in it; I guess there are a *lot* more converted gfics than I realized. Now, I've always been grateful to authors for gficcing their nfics; I wouldn't be able to read their work otherwise. One very kind FoLC (who has since left FoLCdom) actually went to the trouble of making a personal conversion of her nfic on my behalf. I do want to emphasize that I really appreciate it. However, to quote Labrat: The entire point, surely, of converting an nfic down to gfic is to let readers who only read gfic read your story. At least, off the top of my head, I can't think of any other reason an author would do it. So, on the face of it, 'pushing the envelope' or steadily increasing the amount of nfic to the point where you alienate those readers and stop them reading the story would be nonsensical. Labrat said it so much better than I can! I don't want authors to stop gficcing. I do want to read their stories. But I can only ask that the conversion be made so that I can actually *read* it. Otherwise, it's basically losing the point. :) Kate summed it up nicely: . I love romance, good A-plots, but appreciate the fade to black scenarios that leaves the love-making to our own imaginations. Yes, indeed, Kate! :) I can't read romance for itself, but I love a strong B-plot interwoven with a good A-plot. Preferably with fade-to-blacks. On another note, Carol wondered: Maybe it's not a bad thing for young adolescents to read about a sexual relationship where there is also respect and equality, where sex is about love rather than power. Jenni also said: There are certain things that married people do and that's why I do include in my stories scenes from the bedroom I certainly agree that a married LnC are delightful role models. But they can be wonderful role models without, er, modeling. :) Carol also wrote (sorry for quoting you so much! ): In the best fics there's a complex handling of plot, character, and theme that I'm now coming to expect in all the longer stories I read. The sexual relationship may be part of that. And Yvonne: I can't explain why that is, except that perhaps the whole story-telling process has matured a lot; stories today are more complex, longer, and are more likely to be well-crafted, well-written pieces than in the early days. I cheerfully admit that this makes no sense to me at all. :) Why does a powerful story require nfic status (or envelope-pushing status)? The question isn't whether Lois and Clark enjoy an active relationship; I'm all for it (as long as they're married, but that's another story ). The question is how much is written explicitly and how much is implied. As an example, I will refer to a favorite story of mine: Labrat's Caped Fear. I was surprised to hear how much longer the nfic version is (close to 100K, if I'm not mistaken), because Labrat snipped entire scenes in the gficcing process. Yet we, the readers, are left with no question that Lois and Clark are a happily married and active couple. On a final note, Wanda wrote: I just want to say that I share the stories on the archive with my teen who is now 15, and I have been pleased with the effort that most writers have taken to edit out adult material. I haven't personally felt that anyone was "pushing the envelope," but that's just my opinion. See, authors? It's well worth the effort. :) I'm glad, for Wanda's sake, that the stories are falling well within her threshold. But I must emphasize that like Wanda, we all have our opinions. And I've been giving mine. :) Hazel, who knows she hasn't responded to all comments, but at least it's a start! _______ "Lots of little Bigwigs, Hazel! Think of that, and tremble!" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:08:09 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: ChiaraPrato Subject: The weak point 5/5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The next day Lois looked at him, laughing. She always knew it was fun talking with Clark, but now he could really be himself with her, and that was really incredible. Lois couldn't remember when she had laughed so much in her life. She was still sore from her ordeal, but she really did feel a lot better. Suddenly, Clark jumped up and in a flash he was standing by the windows. "I think they're coming - Bureau 39 agents! Come with me, quickly!" "Where? It's daylight out there; they would see you fly!" "I know. After what happened with Trask, my father and I built a shelter. We have to go there." "OK, but what about your parents?" "I don't think they're in any danger. Trask died before he was able to tell anyone I'm Superman and nobody saw Superman help the Kents, but I need to warn them." He opened what Lois had thought was a wall and helped her inside. "Wait here, I'll be right back." Clark was back in a couple of minutes. They heard cars stop in front of the house. Clark had brought with him all of their clothes and anything else that could prove that they had been there, then he put his arms around Lois and helped her down the long tunnel. Lois didn't speak, but Clark was able to hear her heart beating furiously. Their descent stopped when they reached an area deep under the house. "We're below the level of the cellar here, it's a little cold, but there are blankets and everything else we'll need." "Clark? I'm concerned for Martha and Jonathan!" "I know, so am I, but I'm keeping an eye on the situation. I'm listening to everything they say... so if something goes wrong, I'll go upstairs. But this time you have to promise you'll stay here... you have to swear it! If they have Kryptonite, I can't protect you. If anything is going to happen, this is a safe place; they won't find you here." "Don't talk like that." He kissed her to stop her protests. "Everything will be OK..." He turned his face up towards the ceiling and then his eyes began to twinkle. "Mom's a great actress!" "Why? What's happening upstairs?" "Their leader just asked about us, and if she knows how to contact Superman, and she is pretending a panic attack... 'Where is my son? Where's my baby' I love this woman!! He paused. "Damn!" "What?!" "Doc just pulled up." Clark was quiet, listening to what was going on upstairs. *** The doctor was a smart man, all these cars and trucks made him a bit suspicious. He came into the house as soon as he knocked. Hi, Jonathan, Martha. I just came over to check up on you. You should still be in bed. I'll have to recommend that you find another doctor if you can't follow my orders!" Martha gave a deep sigh of relief "Yes, I'll do that, as soon as these 'gentlemen' leave." "Not so quick, Mrs. Kent. Where are you hiding them?" "What are you talking about?" "I'm pretty sure, it's a perfect place here. No one to see Superman land, it 's secluded and quiet..." He motioned for his men to start searching the house for either the reporters or Superman. " It'll be better for you if you tell me where they are!" "Listen to me very carefully! You can't come in here, tell us that something has happened to our son and his partner, then threaten us, and unleash your trained dogs to search our place! You can play the bully all you want, but you've probably never seen an angry mother! If you try to hurt Clark or his friend you'll have to answer to me!" "Calm down, Mrs. Kent. Nobody wants to hurt your son, as long as he's not Superman!" Martha laughed but was now calmer. "If Clark was Superman... well he was really shameless about avoiding all the work here on the farm. Thanks so much, Mr. Whateveryouare, this summer we're going to make him work harder!" "Martha, honey, calm down!" Jonathan was worried that his wife was pushing things too far. "Now, if you'll excuse me. I think you've been in our house too long." She grabbed the phone and dialed the Smallville police. "Martha Kent here." "Put the phone down..." "The police will be here in no time. You know it comes in handy when you've known the sheriff since she was in diapers." "You are playing with fire." "And you are playing with my son's life!" "Chief, no one's here. No trace of Superman, nor the two reporters, but we found this..." The man showed him an album filled with newspaper clippings, all of them about Superman. "Well, I can see you have a real interest in this alien." "Martha... Mrs. Kent, is everything all right? Hello?? " The police officer sounded alarmed. "Please let me speak with the sheriff, it's very urgent!" Martha turned toward the man in front of her. "An extreme interest, when every one of those is from the Daily Planet and the articles were written by my son. Oh, how silly of me. I didn't let you have the fun of figuring that out for yourself. I'm sorry..." "Mrs. Kent? Are you all right? What can I do for you?" Sheriff Harris was worried for Martha, this was the first time she had called her at work. "We have a big problem here at the farm... *unwelcome* guests..." "I'll be right there!" "Thanks, *Sheriff*!" "Very funny, Mrs. Kent, but do you really believe that a country sheriff can stop us?" "Well, Trask was stopped by her. I'm tired of all this. Who do you think you are? You come in here with guns drawn and threaten two old people... what do you want to do? Do what Trask did? He tied us up and almost set us on fire. Is that what you want to do to us? Or maybe you'll tie us to an ant hill?" "You're pretty brave, Mrs. Kent, but I don't think you understand the seriousness of the situation." "I don't think you understand. Superman is so powerful, he could have the world at his feet, but instead of seeking power, he saves the world instead. By the way, do you remember when he destroyed the Nightfall asteroid? Well, I thanked him for that; can I say the same about you?" In the silence that was the country, the sirens from the sheriff's car echoed loudly. "There is nothing here for us, now, but I warn you; we will be back - someday." "Pray that my son is safe, otherwise you should be the one who is worried, you can be sure of that, I'm a lot more dangerous than Superman!" Jonathan and the doctor were staring at Martha, completely shocked. Never had they seen Martha so firm in all her life. They were afraid for her, and down in the shelter Clark was too. *** While he was listening to everything that happened above, his fear grew as he realized that he was losing his powers. He realized that he was weakening quickly. Lois felt him tense. "What's happening?" "They have Kryptonite..." "Kryptonite?!" He nodded and she tightened her embrace. "Everything will be fine soon... it'll be all right..." "Lois? if something were to happen to them, I couldn't forgive myself. I'd better go..." "NO!! You can't!!!" "Lois.." "You don't understand. It would be worse for them; they've protected you until now. There would be no escape from them, not for them, nor for us." "You can hide here..." "No! I'm not going to leave you... I finally found you and I won't let you go!" *** "Mrs. Kent, if you happen to see Superman... please give him this little present. You seem to be pretty resourceful, I'm sure you'll find a way to give it to him." The man gave her a crystal made of Kryptonite that was bigger than the one Wayne Irig had brought to their house almost a year before. It would have been beautiful if it weren't for the devastating effects it had on their son. "And be sure to tell him... we have a lot more where this came from." Then he motioned to his men and they quickly left and got into their cars and trucks and in few minutes they vanished. The sheriff's car screeched to a halt just in front of the Kents house. "Martha, Jonathan, are you all right? Doc, what are you doing here?" "Thanks for coming so quickly, Rachel! Oh my god, I was so scared!!!" Martha was finally able to let her emotions flow. "You were wonderful!" Jonathan said as he held her in his arms and kissed her. "That's true, I was wonderful," she giggled. "I have to see how the kids are... but before I do I guess I should explain..." Martha told her guests what had happened, of course avoiding the part about her son's secret identity, while Jonathan ran out quickly in order to put the Kryptonite in a safe place. The official excuse was that Superman was quite a good friend of Lois and Clark, and he was going to be there in a few hours to up on them, after the their bad experience, and since no one knew the real dangers this rock had on the superhero they wanted be sure it was out of sight. *** Lois looked at him, very worried. "Clark.. how are you?" "Are we switching roles now?" "Don't be funny... can I do anything for you?" "Just be close to me..." She held him tightly. "So, is this close enough?" she asked, smiling and kissing him. "It is... for now." Her kiss became deeper and he shared her passion. She felt the fear that he felt for his parents grow more and more. As his desperation grew, so grew his need to touch her body, to caress her and to kiss her. "Clark, we have to stop kissing each other only when we're worried... well, we want to start kissing more often, period." "I always knew you were a genius!" "I always thought you were the intelligent one!" Clark made her sit on the little bed that was there and he sat next to her. "I'm scared," he confessed. "Not for me. But for them, and for you. Lois, I don't want someone to hurt you to get at me... I don't want my parents to suffer because they raised me as their son. They are my parents... the only ones I've ever known - my real parents couldn't have hoped I'd be found by better people." "I know, Clark; but they'll be all right..." "And if they were hurt?... How can I help them.?" "Clark, it's not your fault. They have no reason to hurt your parents. They don't know we are here, they think we are dead. The article in the Planet hasn't gone to print." "Yeah, I know, but..." Lois' hand caressed his mouth and he was silent. "Shhh" she whispered, a moment before kissing him, then she held him again. "Nothing will happen." Clark hid his face in Lois' hair. "I couldn't bear it if something happened that was my fault. Lois, I'm so sorry for what happened to you... you don't know how much..." "Clark, I couldn't bear to live without you... never again..." This time he kissed her. They hugged fiercely, but Lois was trembling. Clark took a blanket and wrapped it around her shoulders. "And how are *you* feeling?" "Fine" Lois nodded in answer. "What's happening upstairs..." she asked after a long silence. "The Kryptonite..." he whispered. Lois turned towards him with terror in her eyes. "No... no... I mean I can't feel it anymore..." Lois started to breathe again, smiling. "Kids? Can I...?" "Mom!" "You kids can come upstairs... whenever you're ready!" "MOM!" Clark laughed, embarrassed because of the implications of that simple statement. A couple of days later "So, you've really decided to leave? Are you sure you can't stay here a couple more days?" "We've thought about it, but we really have to go. Lois is fine now, and we need to figure out how to stop Bureau 39." "I'm sure that you'll do it." Clark held her in a big hug. "Thanks Mom! For everything." Martha shrugged her shoulders, smiling, then she turned toward Lois. "Honey... you take care of yourself... and take care of him too!" "I will, Martha, I will." Jonathan started his car. "But you didn't tell me why you are using the car..." Martha watched them get in and then stepped up to the window. "If they are checking the house they probably have radar too. I don't want them to think we were here all the time." "But you've always avoided them..." "I can, but Lois' body - I don't think she could handle the speed - we'll drive away from the farm and then we'll fly to Metropolis." "Bye, Martha and thanks...." "Be careful." "We will!" Martha watched the car drive away with a sob. But she felt somewhere in her heart that all would be right again, or at least she hoped it would. The end. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 16:49:15 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jill Melena Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Yvonne wrote;<< I choose to write nfic because it allows me to write stories which are grittier than the PG format lets me write. It's not just the love-making which I'm referring to, it's the freedom to write the occasional swear word, or have my characters talk frankly about adult issues, which attracts me. It's certainly not a desire to write something different, it's a desire to write something that happens to interest me and gives me a lot of satisfaction>> That’s exactly the same reason why I read an nfic version over a gfic version. Much as the story may be fantasy, that fantasy has to be believable; and the real world has grit. While it is possible for stories to be true to the characters within a PG 13 rating, depending on where the story is intended to go, that can be stifling (again, depending on the situation). Labrat wrote;<< The only reason I write nfic these days is because it frees me from the restraints of gfic and allows me to explore as fully as I wish adult situations and dialogue. Some banter for example which is beyond pg13 limits. The actual physical act I couldn't care less about. But if there's some banter in there that I don't want to lose...I can't very well cheat the nfic readers by not including the act, since the banter alone puts it beyond pg13. I think I'd be lynched. >> Personally, banter is my favourite part of any story (along with angst ). In a lot of cases, Labby, you probably could get away with skipping the act as long as you reach us with the dialogue, unless it were important to the plot. I’ve read some very good scenes where the author cuts out before the actual ‘act’, and left my with no desire to string her up. Wendy wrote;<< Why do I want to write love scenes? Not because I have any desire to push an envelope, or to be 'different', but because the kind of stories I prefer to have, as Tank put it, a strong B-plot incorporating Lois and Clark getting together as a couple. Sex often comes into that, though for different reasons. Usually it's as an affirmation of their love, and in that case I suppose I could just close the bedroom door behind them and leave it there, or pick the tale up an hour or so later. But, on the times when I don't do that, I usually have a reason, and that's often tied up with an aspect of the B-plot which involves insecurities on the part of one or other character, and which need to be resolved in the context of lovemaking.>> It seems to me that a love scene is emotionally more fulfilling and even more pleasurable to read when it’s instrumental to the B-plot. Gratuitous and superfluous sex scenes I generally skip over. When ‘translating’ from nfic to PG13, a lot of the emotional message and the dynamics of the relationship can be watered down. Many nfics are more powerful stories – I don’t particularly care for euphemisms. I think that fics are becoming more graphic because our culture in general is moving in that direction, rather than simply the L&C universe. It’s not so much a matter of pushing the envelope or competing with others as it is getting the story across so that we can really connect with it, the characters, and their motivations. What the average 13 year old hears in a day most likely exceeds the explicitness experienced by a 35 year old. Does that mean that the PG13 rating should be moved up? Of course not. It can be too much for kids as it is. And while there are ‘adult’ comments which I’m sure would still go over my head , 13 year olds can still get the gist of most euphemisms. They don’t miss much. There should definitely be somewhere where people (underage or not) can read gentler stories. Carol Malo wrote;<< Should a 14 year old be reading this stuff? (no, of course not -- s/he should be reading Jane Austen or Michael Ondaatje!!)>> I still don’t like Jane Austen. And much as I’ve just said that 13/14 year olds (couldn’t you guys have stuck to one age? ;) ) don’t need more graphicness stuffed in their faces, I’ll admit that I started reading romance novels right after I turned 14. (My mother is wonderful, but when she told me that I couldn’t read one of her books… you’d better believe I took it out of the library and read it in secret – though I’m sure she figured it out. ) There’s also a big difference between what kind of ‘graphicness’ we’re dealing with. A thirteen year old has hormones, and it might do them some good to read a story involving sex which deals with, as Carol said, “respect and equality, where sex is about love rather than power”. Scenes of violence or of sexual abuse would be somewhat more disruptive, I think. But it has to be rated somehow, and I see nothing wrong with our current rating standards, though of course sometimes things slip through since it’s a matter of judgement. (I was once reading a fic where at one point I stopped and thought, ‘oh, jeez, this is gfic?’) It’s easy enough to walk into any library or bookstore and buy a romance novel; L&C needs to keep up it’s image on the net, where ‘porn’ becomes a big issue. Wendy wrote;>> Which leads me on to another question - is it length of love scenes, or is it the degree of 'graphicness' in the description? In other words, is it that you skim lightly over a love scene of half a page - assuming that there are no offending *very* explicit references - but find a love scene of four pages or more too much? Could this be part of the problem? Personally, even while reading nfic I’ll probably skim a love scene that’s longer than half a page, unless it’s very well written. I think it’s the explicitness which makes it inappropriate for the PG13 rating, but even within nfic there’s such thing as too much. As I’ve stated earlier, it depends on the relevance to the B-plot. Generally I’ve found L&C to have a lot less superfluous sex than many novels, in which I’ll start skimming sooner. I think that really says something about the quality of our authors. -Lena _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 17:07:15 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carolyn Schnall Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? In-Reply-To: <20010220.112246.-69757.3.cmoncado@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Adding my own two cents without having read today's posts, I can say that I was concerned about this subject in regard to my last installment of Psychic, which carries a violence warning. I wanted to put something in the story that would shake the characters up and it was not really nfic, though it might have seemed related to nfic. I expressed my concern to Kathy, who handled it in a wonderful way. So the story got posted and the warning is there like a beacon:) Also, I can recall that there was a lot of steam in one or two of the stories I read in late 1997, when I first discovered the G-rated archive. The parameters in this regard probably vary greatly from person to person and some people never actually say how they feel when they really disapprove. I have had a few people tell me that my nfics were too explicit, while others have told me that they enjoyed the same stories because they did not feel like voyeurs while reading them. I'm sure one cannot please everyone and the only way to find out how you will react is to actually read the stuff....nuf said:) Carolyn >Okay - my two cents. > >I haven't been around long, you guys know that so I can't say that I have >noticed a change. However, I am not sure what the line is. (Does >lcfanfic.com do PG13? I don't remember and I have having internet >connection problems or I would check.) I don't look at the ratings there >before reading a story, probably because I haven't really read anything >that I think would be inappropriate (and I am to the M's now!). What >bothers me more than a slightly suggestive scene is violence and I tend >to skim over that and on to the romance (ie: sorry, don't remember the >title, maybe Dear Lois, where Clark/Supes goes to a wartorn area and is >shot at with Kryptonite - if you've read it you know what I mean and I >don't want to spoil anything for anyone else - the war scenes and such >were a bit much for me, but if I remember right there was a warning). I >won't watch gratuitous or explicit sex in movies and I don't like >violence in movies (History buff that I am, I refuse to watch Gladiator) >and I don't like to read it either. As for on the MB or archive, I think >there should be (and I am pretty sure there is on the archive) so kind >of, well, not warning, but comment "Adult situations, semi-explicit" or >something. But, I am still a newbie, so there may be things in place >that I don't know. And what about say a graphic birthing scene or >something? Where does that fit in (not that I plan on writing one)? > >I am writing, as I am sure you know, a series (or two*bg*) with a married >LC and I don't think I am going "too far" with the scenes, but I don't >know what is too much. Of course, I tend to be conservative on what I >think is too much,so my opinion may be "wrong" as too what is too much. >I tend to be a "Close the door" type, but there is some kissing and >sttuff in some of my stories and I don't think that I am doing too much, >but what do I know? > >Oh, goodness, I am starting to sound like Lois. I babble well. I don't >know that I said anything new or anything, but opinions really can't be >wrong, so I don't have to worry about that, but, oh never mind. I'll >shut up now. > >CM ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:10:07 -0800 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nancy Smith Subject: Re: A Valentine Vignette MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's okay, Carolyn, I forgive you! Nan Carolyn Schnall wrote: > Hi Nan: > > The bad news: I have not read much of your stuff, though I had hoped > to make an effort after meeting you at LAFF. Hence, I did not really > understand all of what was happening in the vignette. I didn't > realize it was Lori, not Lois, until after I had started reading it. > So, I was a little stumped. There now, I confess it... > > The good news: it was very nicely written and some of the technical > items you referred to seemed inspired:) > > I hope to rectify the other matter before the next LAFF....:) > > Carolyn ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 17:32:29 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Rachel Subject: Re: OT School project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: No Name Available To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 2:37 PM Subject: Re: OT School project > Interesting. I found this on the CIAC Hoaxbusters website: > > < June 1999 > > As best we can tell, this is a real message. And, while it is a chain letter, > it at least has a time limit embedded in it to stop its spread after a > certain date. Curiously, some people were still spreading this letter after > the date listed as the end date. > > Hello! > We are a 2nd grade class in Belmont, Michigan. We are located just > north of Grand Rapids, Michigan. We are a part of the Rockford > School District. LOL. I've gotten this one before! I prefer these things to other chains b/c with chain letters like this, it's reasonably simple to check out the facts. Belmont Michigan does exist, it *is* north of Grand Rapids, and they *do* have a teacher named Mrs. Ary who taught (you guessed it) 2nd grade in 1999. I live in Grand Rapids so it wasn't hard for me to check this assignment (one phone call to a friend who went to school in Rockford got me the information). I got it in 1999, however, before the deadline so I actually was able to participate :) Rachel ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 17:44:03 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Rachel Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Wendy Richards To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 3:07 PM Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? > Lois wasn't a virgin, so clearly she saw nothing wrong with premarital sex; > it wasn't a matter of conscience for her, but one of being sure it was what > she wanted. As for Clark, there was clearly more to it, but the series > gives us to believe that it was because he wouldn't make love with someone > without telling her his secret, rather than it being from any distaste for > premarital sex - his attitude in Chip off the Old Clark tells us that, too. > I'm suddenly finding this even more interesting. Would this fit under the category of: Do you write a story to reflect your moral views of life, or to reflect the way life is? I believe someone said they wouldn't nominate a story that mentioned premarital sex as an activity Lois and Clark chose. Is it just the sex issue, or would it also be something else you disagreed with, say going to movies (when I was little, a lot of kids in my area weren't allowed to go)? I'm just curious how people draw their lines (I'm in college--we're supposed to be like this :) Rachel ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 17:00:06 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: First Fight 2/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is part 2! ***** "Hey, CK," called as he headed towards the elevator. "Hey," Clark said in response. "Hold that eleva-" Jimmy grimaced as the doors closed on him. "Where're you off to?" "I just got a call from Bob Marvin. He has some stuff for us. Tell Lois for me, would ya?" He took a good look at his new friend. "What happened to your suit?" "Don't ask," Clark said simply, gesturing to the other elevator car, which was opening its doors. "See you later." As the elevator doors closed, Clark turned to go to the rest room, swiping at the grime on his coat. After he cleaned up, Clark got himself a cup of coffee, and then went in search of Lois. She was working alone in one of the conference rooms. She silently rose and closed the blinds on all of the windows. He smiled. "Anything?" "Just this." She sat on his lap and kissed him hard on the lips. "Isn't that enough?" He played with the ring on her finger. "Anyone notice this yet?" "No, not yet. I've been, well," she looked somewhat guilty, "trying to make sure no one notices - you know, flipping open my notebook over my hand, holding my coffee cup a certain way. What are we going to do when someone notices that both of us just got married?" "Tell them," he murmured as he tried to kiss her some more. "Eventually, they'll notice. I mean when the kids come along and all." "Oh, Clark, kids? There is so much that we need to talk about." "I know." He grinned wickedly. "But wouldn't you rather be doing this?" He kissed her with a hunger that neither had ever known. She pushed him away. "Yes, I would, but we have work to do." She moved to the seat she had been in before he had interrupted her. She leaned back in her seat. "I can't find Bob Marvin anywhere. Without him, we don't have a story." She shrugged wearily. "Jimmy said to tell you that he was going to pick up a package from him." "WHAT?! When were you planning on telling me? Did he say what was in the package?" "No. Just that he was picking it up and that he'd bring it back here once he got it. So what do we do now?" he asked, deferring to her experience. "Well, first we piece together whatever it is that Jimmy is bringing us, if that's possible. Then we try and figure out what is going on and if there is a story there... I hope you didn't make dinner plans," she finished. "I am all yours," Clark assured her, resting his chin on his folded arms and giving her a beautiful smile. "Now that's what I like to hear. You know," she walked over to his chair and sat down on his lap again. "We have a few minutes until Jimmy gets back. And Perry thinks that we are working hard." She ran her hand over his tie, her fingers resting on her class ring that she had discovered under his shirt the night before and getting an idea. "What do you suggest we do in the meantime then, Mrs. Kent?" "Mrs. Kent? Hmmm," her nose wrinkled a little bit, "I don't know if I like that. But I think that I know what I'd like to do. I think that I would like to do this." She kissed him softly on the cheek. "And this." She kissed his other cheek. "How about this?" He gently held her head and tenderly kissed her lips. "Hmm, that was nice. Could we try it again?" "Sure." He kissed her more deeply this time. Suddenly, he stopped. His superhearing had picked up footsteps outside the door. "What? What is it?" Clark picked Lois up as he stood up and set her gently on the floor. He stepped back just as Jimmy walked in. "There you guys are. Lois, CK, here's the info that Bob Marvin had for you. He said that this was enough to get you started but that if you wanted the rest of the goods then you would have to meet him tonight." He looked at them. "Are you guys okay? You look kinda weird." Lois glanced at Clark. "Why. . . why do you say that, Jimmy?" "Umm, well you look a little flushed, Lois. It's probably nothing. Hey, CK. Rumor's going around the pit is that you're hitched. Someone saw you wearing a ring or something. All the women are taking bets. They, especially Cat, don't want it to be true. So are you?" Clark wiggled the fingers of his left hand at him. "Yes, Jimmy. I married recently." He smiled as he shared a knowing look with Lois. "VERY recently." "WAY TO GO, CK! Why didn't you say anything?" "I, uh, just didn't see any reason too." "Oh, well." They could hear Perry hollering for him outside the conference room. "That's my cue. Later." Jimmy left the room. "Coming, Chief." Lois waited until he was out of earshot. "Whew. That was close. How did you know he was coming?" Clark shrugged. "I thought I heard something." "So everyone knows that you're married. What are they going to think if someone catches us kissing? If no one knew that you were married, it wouldn't be such a big deal. But now that everyone knows, they'll think that I'm the 'other woman'. Me. Lois Lane. The other woman. That is not a role that I am comfortable with. The girlfriend. The fling. Those I could deal with. But the other woman? I can't do that." "Lois?" "Yes, Clark." "You're babbling." "Sorry. I can't help it sometimes. Whenever I get nervous, or afraid, or excited, I just start talking and talking. And I can't stop. I just go on and on. . ." Clark had shut the door and had now shut her up with a kiss. Soft and gentle. He broke it off and looked at her. "That's enough, sweetheart. And you're not the other woman. You are the only woman for me. I would've thought that last night would have proved that. Besides, there's one other thing wrong with that little speech that you gave." "Really? What's that?" "You said 'Lois Lane'. It's not Lois Lane anymore. It's Lois Kent." He smiled at her. He wanted to see what she would say about the name change. "Lois Kent, huh? And what if I want to keep my own name? I am a world-renowned reporter you know. It wouldn't do for me to just up and CHANGE my name." "Why don't we talk about that later? Right now, let's kiss." "Sounds good to me." As the distance between them closed, Perry opened the door. Clark jumped back guiltily. "No, Lois. I, uh, no, I don't see anything in your eye." "Well, umm, thanks for checking Clark." Perry just looked at them. "Kids, I don't know what I'm interrupting here, but it doesn't look like there is any work getting done. Why are the blinds closed? Clark, what would your wife think if she knew that you were in a conference room with the blinds and door closed, alone with an attractive woman? And, great shades of Elvis, why didn't you tell me you were married? And weren't you Lois' guest last night at the ball? Are you even wearing a ring? I know you weren't yesterday." "Umm, I think she'd be okay with it, Chief. She trusts me. And, well, we just got married. She was busy last night and the ball was work. Not a date or anything. Anyway, after the ball, we just kind of decided to get married. Spur of the moment kind of thing. I mean, we met over 10 years ago, but last night, we just decided to do it. Take the plunge. Get married. So, yea, I'm married and I do wear a ring." He wiggled the fingers on his left hand yet again. "And I didn't tell you because it just happened." "Well, then what are you doing here? Shouldn't you be at home with her? And, son, you're starting to babble. If you aren't careful, you'll be as bad as Lois." "I don't think anyone could be as bad as Lois when it comes to babbling." He smiled at her as she shot him 'a look'. "She, uh, she has to work late tonight, Chief. She may even be called out of town on business. So, I figured I would get as much done as I can while she's busy and hopefully we could take next weekend off to get away for a day or two?" The last was a question rather than a statement. "Well, if you're sure she's busy. . .Sure, son, take next weekend off. You, too Lois. You'll both be tired by the end of next week and you'll need the time off too." "Thanks, Chief. I'd appreciate it." "Now let's get some work done you two." ***** It was late, and the newsroom was nearly empty except for two tired reporters, who had spent the last several hours hunched over the crumpled bits of paper that comprised Marvin's report, trying to piece it together in some semblance of order. "This is impossible," Lois said with a sigh. "Nothing matches, no dates... We're never going to get through this. Oh, and I'm starving!" she complained. She looked at him seductively. "I know what I want, but I can't have it right now, soooooo I'll have settle for some good Chinese take-out." "I know a place," Clark ventured, getting up and fetching his coat. "I'll be right back." He looked around to make sure no one was watching. When he was satisfied they were alone, he gave her a long, soft kiss. "Don't you want to know what I want?" she mumbled into his lips. "I'll bring an assortment," he replied. Lois shrugged, and tried to go back to work. Her husband was SO handsome and so willing to do anything to make her happy. And SO well built. She could definitely get used to this. And those kisses. Well, they were out of this world! She sighed. This whole marriage thing was sure good so far, but she knew that not everything would be easy. She wondered what her parents were going to think when they found out. She had never told them about CJ - Clark - and she hadn't ever planned on it. At least not until she found him again and they were dating or something. The more she thought about it, the more she realized that, although she had dreamed about seeing CJ and kissing him again, she had never imagined what life together would be like. Not as friends or a couple or married or anything. Just that long, slow kiss that seemed like it would never end and the ride into the sunset. That kiss had never even developed into anything more in her mind. Maybe he had imagined different things for them. He seemed to be slipping into the role of a husband more easily than she was slipping into the role of a wife. She sighed again. He called her "sweetheart" and "honey" and seemed to mean it. The once or twice she had used some kind of term of endearment it was dripping with sarcasm - once at the end of the wedding and once before answering the phone. He had used pet names for her several times throughout the day and last night as well. And she liked it more than she cared to admit. Especially last night. Last night. It had been magical. She had even felt like she was floating on air. It had never been like that with Claude. Claude. *Clark, how am I going to tell you about Claude?* From what he had told her the night before, he had only ever kissed one other woman since they met, so he probably didn't have a "Claude" in his past. She didn't know how to tell him that she had made some mistakes while she was waiting for him to reappear in her life. It had never felt "right", but things happened that she had regretted for years and now she regretted even more. It didn't take long for Clark to fly halfway around the world and reach one of his favorite little restaurants in Shanghai. He ordered a variety of dishes, hoping she would enjoy them. Something spicy, something mild, a little of the chicken, and some of the shrimp... As he flew, he thought about the wonderful woman who was waiting for him at the Planet. Ever since he saw her, even before Air had gone over to her and been rebuffed, he knew. He had just known that this was the only woman for him. When their eyes locked as he stood in the elevator, his heart had jumped and his feet had almost left the ground then and there. Floating or levitating was something that was new to him and he had still had trouble controlling it at the time. He sighed. It didn't look like they were going to get the time alone that they needed tonight. They still had to meet with Marvin. They wouldn't get home until late. But where would they go? He hadn't had a chance to look for a new place all day. He couldn't take her to his hotel room. He was embarrassed that she had even seen it that morning - though the ogling and "Mr. Hardbody" comment had almost made it worthwhile. He had to smile at that. Lucy was staying at Lois' apartment and since she wasn't ready to tell anyone that they were married, that seemed to be out. He could just see it. They show up at her apartment. "Lucy, I'm home and I brought my husband with me," and Lucy's jaw would drop and that would be the end of that. Or worse. Lucy wouldn't be there when they arrived and they would be kissing, or something more, and Lucy would walk-in on them. How would they explain that? How could he explain that he could fly, see through walls and light candles or start a fire just by looking at the wick or wood? That would be a little more difficult. How could he tell her? He rolled onto his back and looked at the stars as he rolled over scenarios in his mind. Tell her to close her eyes for a minute, take off and then have her open them as they stood in the clouds. That would work - or not. She would probably have a heart attack and die. He couldn't have that on his conscience along with all of the others that he hadn't been able to help. He talked to himself. "See, Lois, I keep trying to tell you that, well, either I'm an alien or a science experiment from the Soviet Union that went terribly wrong. I am really strong and bullets don't hurt me. I could get shot point blank and it wouldn't do anything to me. I can carry tractors in one hand - I have been able to do that since junior high. That morning that you left D. C.? See that was the morning that I found out that I could fly. Fly, you ask? Yes, fly." It wasn't going to work. He had to come up with something. Maybe he would go see his parents, but when? He had to get dinner back to Lois and he couldn't very well sneak out in the middle of the night and fly off. Lois wouldn't understand if he left her lying alone in bed the second night after their wedding. He sighed. The Planet lay just below and he hadn't come to any resolution yet. ***** "That was quick!" Lois said in surprise, as he planted the bundle of bamboo containers down before her. "I took a short cut." "Still hot!" she enthused, opening one eagerly and dipping her fingers in to help herself to a mouthful. She let out an appreciative noise. "Ooh, this is out of this world!" "You could let me help with that, you know," he said suggestively. "Sorry, we're still at work - maybe later!" Clark happily watched her enjoy the food, smiling, hardly tasting his own dinner. "Well, can we talk? Not *the* talk, because this *is* a public place and I don't want to have that talk until we're alone. Please, Lois talk to me!" He looked at her with his best puppy dog eyes. Lois laughed softly. "I just can't resist those eyes. Sure what do you want to talk about?" "You." "Me, huh? What if I don't want to talk about me?" "Well, then what do you want to talk about?" "You. You are *much* more interesting than me. You've traveled the world. You've been here for two days and," she took a big bite, "you already know the best place to get Chinese." She tried not to spit out her chicken as she spoke. "Where did you get this?" "Shanghai. It's in China." He wondered what she would do with the truth. She laughed again. "Fine. Keep your secret for now, but I have my ways of getting secrets out of you." He leaned forward to look in her eyes. "You do?" "Yup." "Are you going to tell me what they are?" "No, you'll have to wait and see." "When are you going to show me?" "Later tonight. If you're good." "Me? I'm always good. I thought you'd know that by now." "Well," Lois looked down and blushed deeply. "You proved that last night." It was Clark's turn to laugh nervously, as he turned crimson. "You think so?" "I *know* so. Maybe you'll show me again later?" "Maybe. If you're good." "Me? I'm never good. I thought you'd know that by now." Clark leaned in ready to kiss her like his life depended on it, but she stopped him as the elevator opened with the cleaning lady in it. She took her cart and walked down the hallway. Lois pushed back from Clark and cracked open her fortune cookie with anticipation, but her face dropped as she looked at it. "It's in Chinese!" she complained. Clark reached over and took it from her. "Oh, don't tell me that you read --" she began, in disblief. "A good horse is like a member of the family," he read cheerfully, handing it back. "I hate that! That is not a fortune!" Lois declared. Clark chuckled, and stretched his long legs out in front of him. "You are a strange one, Clark Kent," she said slowly, struck by the incongruity of a Kansas farm boy reading Chinese, understanding what Jimmy's prattle about computer interfaces earlier that day, and knowing ballroom dancing. And kissing like he did. "Am I, Mrs. Kent?" he inquired, amused because she had no idea just how strange he truly was. "Mrs. Kent." She wrinkled her nose. "Let's not push that just yet. I don't know if I want to change my name. In fact, I'm kind of attached to my own name." Clark opened his mouth to speak, but Lois cut him off before he could say anything. "We'll talk about it later. Yeah. A strange one. But I think I've got you figured out," she returned confidently. "Really." "Hmm-mm." "Didn't take you very long." He looked at her intensely and she squirmed. Did she really have him figured out? She thought she did, but that look made her wonder. He knew there was no way she could know his secret. Not unless she had seen him fly off to save that worker and he knew she hadn't been paying attention. How was she going react when she finally did tell him? She would be upset for not telling her sooner, he was sure, even though they had only known her for a few days. He had imagined what it would be like to find her again and tell her his secret. It would be really nice not to hide from someone. He couldn't wait to take her on her first moonlit flight; she would love it - he did. He sighed. She was his wife. He would have to tell her soon. Otherwise, how would he explain levitating in his sleep? It was a good thing it hadn't happened the night before. They *had* floated some, but she had barely noticed. "Well, it's my business, looking beyond the external," she said, not feeling quite as smug as she had a moment before seeing the steady, penetrating look he was giving her; the light in his eyes was reaching down to her soul. She felt a sudden lurch of panic and fear and excitement that she couldn't suppress. "Don't fall for me, farm boy," she warned him with a smile. "I don't have time for it." "Umm, it is WAY too late for that. I am long gone, city girl. Come here." He checked to make sure they were alone again and he pulled her close and kissed her like there was no tomorrow. She let the kiss continue for a minute and then pulled away. "Clark, what if someone sees us? I am not ready to make this public just yet and we don't really have anywhere to go. Lucy is at my place and sorry, but I really don't want to stay at yours. No offense. And I can't afford another night at the honeymoon suite." She kissed him one more time. "Now, come on, let's go find Marvin and he'll give us the rest of the information we need." She gathered the papers and led the way out of the newsroom, needing to escape the closeness of the moment they had shared. Needing to break the spell she could feel being woven around her when he gazed at her with those soft brown eyes and at the same time wanting to stay there forever. There would be plenty of time for that later. Wherever they ended up. Clark followed more slowly. For a moment there she was responding to him. He knew that there was a tender side underneath the "Mad Dog Lane" exterior that everyone at work saw. He had seen it in Washington and again the night before once she realized how awful she had been to him and before she realized that he was CJ. It was just going to take time to get used to this whole marriage business. He was just going to have to be persistent he decided. It wouldn't take long. Just a few minutes alone without a big story on their minds. Next weekend at the latest. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 23:54:11 -0000 Reply-To: Yvonne Connell Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Yvonne Connell Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Hazel > And Yvonne: I can't explain why that is, except that perhaps the > whole story-telling process has matured a lot; stories today are more > complex, longer, and are more likely to be well-crafted, well-written pieces > than in the early days. > > I cheerfully admit that this makes no sense to me at all. :) Why does a > powerful story require nfic status (or envelope-pushing status)? The > question isn't whether Lois and Clark enjoy an active relationship; I'm all > for it (as long as they're married, but that's another story ). The > question is how much is written explicitly and how much is implied. As an > example, I will refer to a favorite story of mine: Labrat's Caped Fear. I > was surprised to hear how much longer the nfic version is (close to 100K, > if I'm not mistaken), because Labrat snipped entire scenes in the gficcing > process. Yet we, the readers, are left with no question that Lois and Clark > are a happily married and active couple. Hazel, reading that sentence of mine again, I can see that I failed to say what I was trying to say. I'll probably fail again, because I'm not much good at this, but I'll give it a go :) I was trying to say that perhaps there's a trend for stories to contain more of everything - more acrimony, more bad language, more anguish, more heartache, more violence, and possibly more laughs and sweet, tender moments. Thus, the tendency is towards vivid stories with a higher degree of detail about the highs and lows of life. Another way to put that would be to say stories are more lurid and extreme, but I guess it's in the eye of the beholder as to which way you view this (that's not meant as a dig at anyone, btw! - I'm just saying that we all have different thresholds with which we're comfortable). Yvonne (yvonne@yconnell.fsnet.co.uk) > > On a final note, Wanda wrote: I just want to say that I share the stories > on the archive with my teen who > is now 15, and I have been pleased with the effort that most writers have > taken to edit out adult material. I haven't personally felt that > anyone was "pushing the envelope," but that's just my opinion. > > See, authors? It's well worth the effort. :) I'm glad, for Wanda's sake, > that the stories are falling well within her threshold. But I must > emphasize that like Wanda, we all have our opinions. And I've been giving > mine. :) > > Hazel, who knows she hasn't responded to all comments, but at least it's a > start! > > > _______ > > "Lots of little Bigwigs, Hazel! Think of that, and tremble!" > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 19:06:49 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Lab Rat Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:55:39 +0200, Hazel wrote: The >question is how much is written explicitly and how much is implied. As an >example, I will refer to a favorite story of mine: Labrat's Caped Fear. I >was surprised to hear how much longer the nfic version is (close to 100K, >if I'm not mistaken), because Labrat snipped entire scenes in the gficcing >process. Yet we, the readers, are left with no question that Lois and Clark >are a happily married and active couple. > Why thank you for the compliment, Hazel. I'm not sure that I can entirely take any real credit for that though to be honest. CF was the easiest conversion I've done to date simply because I began it - and had it half written - before I started what I tend to call my nfic period. ;) Halfway through I was suddenly jerked off course and wrote a series of nfic PWP vignettes. My first ever nfic, all the fic I'd written in the other fandoms I'd been involved with being strictly gfic. And the mildest possible type of gfic at that. So, CF languished on my hd till I got those out of my system. And when I went back to finish it...well I was a confirmed nfic writer. No going back there. This meant that I made the conscious decision to turn the previously strictly gfic CF into an nfic. But because most of the gfic was already written, the nfic tended to be 'set in' as it were in complete scenes, inserted into the middle of what was already there, rather than the way I normally write them - in for example Burnout or Lonesome - where they are scattered throughout the narrative, often being simply the odd line here and there. Ergo, when it came to the conversion, all I had to do was reverse the process in most cases and snip out the entire nfic scenes. Not really that hard work or clever at all. LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 00:10:08 -0000 Reply-To: Yvonne Connell Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Yvonne Connell Subject: Fanfic Question re. US phone system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My ever-helpful beta-reader has raised a question (darned woman! ) = regarding a scene I've just written in Purity, so... Here in the UK, you can dial 1471 and hear a message telling you the = phone number of the last person to call you, and at what time - unless, = of course, the caller has barred this information from being broadcast = when they placed the call. Is there an equivalent in the US? Yvonne (yvonne@yconnell.fsnet.co.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 19:42:06 -0500 Reply-To: "Heidi A. Bingham" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Heidi A. Bingham" Organization: Impressions Web Page Design Subject: Re: First Fight 2/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Carol ~ I'm new on the list and I just want to say I'm really enjoying these stories. :-) Love the way you wound the marriage in from where the TV series starts, quotes and all, with Lois in the dark about CK's secret! Lots of kissing too. Aaaaaahhhh. ~ Heidi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:20:30 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Fanfic Question re. US phone system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit << Here in the UK, you can dial 1471 and hear a message telling you the phone number of the last person to call you, and at what time - unless, of course, the caller has barred this information from being broadcast when they placed the call. Is there an equivalent in the US? >> As far as I know, the closest to that in the US is *69 (pronounced star 69). If you hit *69 you will call back the last number that called you. This won't tell you the phone number (unless you ask whoever answers the phone, of course ;) or the time; it just dials the last number that dialed you. I'm not sure about this, but I don't think you can block anyone from *69-ing you. There is also a (small) charge for the service. Hope that helps. Christy attalanta@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:23:02 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Fanfic Question re. US phone system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 02/21/2001 10:21:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, Attalanta@AOL.COM writes: << As far as I know, the closest to that in the US is *69 (pronounced star 69). If you hit *69 you will call back the last number that called you. This won't tell you the phone number (unless you ask whoever answers the phone, of course ;) or the time; it just dials the last number that dialed you. I'm not sure about this, but I don't think you can block anyone from *69-ing you. There is also a (small) charge for the service. Hope that helps. >> Hmm, if I do that, it tells me the phone number rather than dialing it back. And there is a charge for doing it. But many times I get a recording that tells me that hte number is not available by that method--meaning that it's either blocked, a telemarketer or possibly a cell phone (that's not on?). --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:26:25 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Rachel Subject: Re: Fanfic Question re. US phone system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: No Name Available To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 10:23 PM Subject: Re: Fanfic Question re. US phone system > Hmm, if I do that, it tells me the phone number rather than dialing it back. > And there is a charge for doing it. But many times I get a recording that > tells me that hte number is not available by that method--meaning that it's > either blocked, a telemarketer or possibly a cell phone (that's not on?). > > --Laurie I think it works like caller id, in that, if you won't come up on a caller id, you won't be coming up using *69 either. I could be wrong (since we have caller id so we never use it), but it makes sense :) Rachel ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:42:50 EST Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Pushing the Envelope? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wendy wrote: > Lois wasn't a virgin, so clearly she saw nothing wrong with premarital sex; > it wasn't a matter of conscience for her, but one of being sure it was what > she wanted. As for Clark, there was clearly more to it, but the series > gives us to believe that it was because he wouldn't make love with someone > without telling her his secret, rather than it being from any distaste for > premarital sex - his attitude in Chip off the Old Clark tells us that, too. >> However, that doesn't explain why they waited until they were married. Lois didn't have a moral objection to pre-marital sex (unless she was experiencing a so-called second virginity) and Clark didn't want to sleep with anyone without sharing his secret. So what was stopping them after Lois knew the truth? (I'm not saying that I find it out of character for them to sleep together before marriage; I'm just wondering what made them decide to wait... besides TPTB ;) I'm also not sure what you mean by Clark's "attitude in Chip off the Old Clark." Are you talking about what he says to Martha and Jonathan when they suggest that his having an illegitimate child is preposterous? I have to say that I believed Clark's response was more rooted in embarrassment and feeling insulted that his parents don't realize that he *could* be having sex, than in communicating his true beliefs about premarital sex. I too believed that Lois and Clark were lovers before VD (wow, taken at face value that's an odd sentence ;) I first thought it at the end of WWW when they say they're both ready to take the next step. Then, when the next episode failed to show any evidence of them having made love, I realized I was wrong. Again after they became engaged I was pretty sure they'd made love at some point, only to discover that I was wrong yet again. However, I have to admit that I was glad when it was revealed in VD that Clark was a virgin and that he and Lois were planning on waiting til their wedding night. That isn't because of any personal objections to premarital sex, but because it seems like premarital sex has become the norm in movies and TV shows. Sure, many (maybe even most) Americans have premarital sex, but *everyone* does not, so it was nice to see a smart, attractive couple decide to wait for their wedding night and not be ridiculed for it. Christy attalanta@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 23:20:42 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Liz S Subject: Re: First Fight 1/? Hi, Carol. I meant to comment before that I really enjoyed your "First Night" which continued another favorite story of mine. And, thank you for continued again with "First Fight". I am really enjoying how you've taken some of the lines from the Pilot episode, yet, with the change in context, have made them mean something else again. Looking forward to more! Liz S. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:37:42 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Carol L Moncado Subject: Re: First Fight 1/? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit *blushing* AWWW!!! Thanks, Liz! CM On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 23:20:42 -0500 Liz S writes: > Hi, Carol. I meant to comment before that I really enjoyed your > "First > Night" which continued another favorite story of mine. And, thank > you for > continued again with "First Fight". I am really enjoying how you've > taken > some of the lines from the Pilot episode, yet, with the change in > context, > have made them mean something else again. > > Looking forward to more! > > Liz S.