From: "L-Soft list server at Indiana University (1.8d)" To: "ARTF@MemoryAlpha.nil" File: "LOISCLA-GENERAL-L LOG0009C" ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 09:54:35 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: International (English) vocabulary differences On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 16:45:50 -0500, Wendy Richards < wendy@KINGSMEADOWCR.FREESERVE.CO.UK> wrote: >(who, through asking, has learnt the meaning of 'candy striper', 'packing >peanuts', 'SUVs', and many more :)) OK, I give up ... what's "packing peanuts"? Is that supposed to be a US term? Never heard of it, I'm afraid! Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 09:59:08 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: mIRC On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 15:43:04 -0700, Vicki Krell wrote: >Okay, I just downloaded it here, and I have to do that at home, but now what >channel do I go into?? Help!! LOL Not sure if anyone has answered privately or not since you posted this. I don't have mIRC, but many, many people do, and I know they can help you set it up. For the nKerths, go to #nkerth for the ceremony, and #nkerthchat for the chat. We are in both channels at the same time for this, but the ceremony channel is moderated, which means if you aren't involved with the ceremony itself (presenting, etc.) you just sit and watch the action, like watching the Oscars on TV. That's where they'll announce the winners, etc. The chat channel is where you'll be doing any of your typing, and it's where the fun is. :) If you have any questions between now and then, please write me privately and I'll do my best to help you or hook you up with someone who can!! I really hope to see you tonight. :) (And any other nfic readers who can make it!) Oh, and please remember -- use an UNDERNET server! Otherwise you'll be wondering where the heck we are! :) Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 09:33:56 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Nancy Smith Subject: Re: International (English) vocabulary differences MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Packing peanuts are thos little chunks of styrofoam they use to protect breakables in packages. They get all over the place when you open a package, and you're usually finding them in unlikely places for a week afterwards. Nan Kathy Brown wrote: > On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 16:45:50 -0500, Wendy Richards < > wendy@KINGSMEADOWCR.FREESERVE.CO.UK> wrote: > > >(who, through asking, has learnt the meaning of 'candy striper', 'packing > >peanuts', 'SUVs', and many more :)) > > OK, I give up ... what's "packing peanuts"? Is that supposed to be a US > term? Never heard of it, I'm afraid! > > Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 12:43:53 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Packing peanuts I was just informed via private email that Wendy was refering to "packing peanuts" as the stuff you stuff boxes with -- duh! In reading it out of context, I was using "packing" as a verb, not a noun. Like "he was packing peanuts" instead of "the box was filled with packing peanuts". LOL, it shows what context can do! So, yes, of course I know what peanuts are in that sense. Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 11:12:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: JaT Subject: Re: International (English) vocabulary differences MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Packing Peanuts aka styrofoam packing material about 1-2 inches in length. variety of shapes, usually white. James --- Kathy Brown wrote: > On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 16:45:50 -0500, Wendy > Richards < > wendy@KINGSMEADOWCR.FREESERVE.CO.UK> wrote: > > >(who, through asking, has learnt the meaning > of 'candy striper', 'packing > >peanuts', 'SUVs', and many more :)) > > OK, I give up ... what's "packing peanuts"? Is > that supposed to be a US > term? Never heard of it, I'm afraid! > > Kathy ===== The D8As - AIM id is mrd8astl Matthew 23:37-39, Romans 1:19-32, 2 Chronicles 7:13-14 Work in progress: Seven Days of Superman-Table of contents can be found at http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003005.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 15:13:04 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Rich & Dawn Subject: Message Board Index update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi FoLCs! The following stories were updated in the index tables at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Meteor/7378/lnc.html this week: A LOVE WELL WORTH THE WAIT: TRACEYLYNN BEGINNINGS: NAN SMITH DEAR LOIS: SHAYNET GROWING PAINS: AERM1 (AKA ANN) HIDING IN THE SHADOWS: IRENE DUTCHAK LOST AND FOUND:JEFF BROGDEN OPERATION METROPOLIS: JOMARCH PERSONAL LOYALTIES: CINDY LEUCH STORY OF A LIFETIME: ELIZABETH TULL (AKA ALL4MRD8A) THE EXODUS: THANATOS THE MARTHA CHRONICLES 3: ATTALANTA (AKA CHRISTY KUBIT) Completed stories this week are: JUST ANOTHER UNDERCOVER ASSIGNMENT: WENDY RICHARDS MYX AND MATCHED: W&T CHALLENGE NO. 5: WENDY RICHARDS TILL THERE WAS YOU: CHRIS H. TRYST: CHIEFPAM (AKA PAM JERNIGAN) New stories started this week are: SOUL STRINGS: RAGGIEMOM W&T CHALLENGE 6: READER, I MARRIED HIM: WENDY RICHARDS And added to the Archive this week: Married with Children by Jude Thanks to Wendy and Hazel for the recent plugs, and Kathy for including us in the FAQ! Enjoy! The Index Crew ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 20:29:06 +0100 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Packing peanuts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kathy wrote: > I was just informed via private email that Wendy was refering to "packing > peanuts" as the stuff you stuff boxes with -- duh! In reading it out of > context, I was using "packing" as a verb, not a noun. Like "he was packing > peanuts" instead of "the box was filled with packing peanuts". LOL, it shows > what context can do! So, yes, of course I know what peanuts are in that > sense. > Kathy, worry not - I read it precisely the same way. LOL! LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 15:00:30 -0500 Reply-To: truitt22@flash.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: timothy truitt Organization: tnt technical services Subject: Re: Message Board Index update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for all your hard work and for all who help thank you too. merry Rich & Dawn wrote: > Hi FoLCs! > > The following stories were updated in the index tables at > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Meteor/7378/lnc.html this week: > A LOVE WELL WORTH THE WAIT: TRACEYLYNN > BEGINNINGS: NAN SMITH > DEAR LOIS: SHAYNET > GROWING PAINS: AERM1 (AKA ANN) > HIDING IN THE SHADOWS: IRENE DUTCHAK > LOST AND FOUND:JEFF BROGDEN > OPERATION METROPOLIS: JOMARCH > PERSONAL LOYALTIES: CINDY LEUCH > STORY OF A LIFETIME: ELIZABETH TULL (AKA ALL4MRD8A) > THE EXODUS: THANATOS > THE MARTHA CHRONICLES 3: ATTALANTA (AKA CHRISTY KUBIT) > > Completed stories this week are: > JUST ANOTHER UNDERCOVER ASSIGNMENT: WENDY RICHARDS > MYX AND MATCHED: W&T CHALLENGE NO. 5: WENDY RICHARDS > TILL THERE WAS YOU: CHRIS H. > TRYST: CHIEFPAM (AKA PAM JERNIGAN) > > New stories started this week are: > SOUL STRINGS: RAGGIEMOM > W&T CHALLENGE 6: READER, I MARRIED HIM: WENDY RICHARDS > > And added to the Archive this week: > Married with Children by Jude > > Thanks to Wendy and Hazel for the recent plugs, and Kathy for including us > in the FAQ! > > Enjoy! > > The Index Crew ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2000 19:12:19 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: International (English) vocabulary differences MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/16/2000 10:55:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kathybrown91@HOME.COM writes: << OK, I give up ... what's "packing peanuts"? Is that supposed to be a US term? >> you know, those little styrofoam peanuts for packing... ;) --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 14:29:26 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Organization: http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam/ Subject: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Your discussion question for the week... ;) I was at the nKerth awards last night (great job with the ceremony, Dawn!) and some of us got into a discussion about what these awards were supposed to measure ... is it just a measure of popularity, or are we supposed to be judging the quality of the fics, as well? I mean, I like all sorts of stories, but I am aware that some of them have great big plot holes (so did some of the episodes ;), or lots of technical writing faults, while some of them are just beautifully written, with every adjective contributing to the tone of the piece. I may enjoy them equally -- I may even enjoy the flawed piece more, but I'd be less likely to vote for it. Because in my mind, the Kerths should be about the quality of the writing. I also try to balance things out, to spread the awards around ... if a certain story is up in two categories, I'd probably vote for it in only one category (depending on the competition), and let another very good story get my vote in the other category. In the nkerths, I'll be aware of whether the story has a gfic version, which might have already won an award elsewhere -- if it has, I'll be more likely to vote for an nfic-only story... Honestly, if a story by a less-well known author is up against a fan favorite, I might be more inclined to vote for the underdog, just to spread the awards around a bit. Then again, if you do that too much, soon everyone has one, and they cease to mean very much... But then some people have argued that the Kerths should award the stories that we just *like* the most, regardless of the technical details of the writing ... do you agree? We like to think we're emulating the Oscars, but if we were, we'd only let experienced authors & editors vote, not everyone... is this just one big popularity contest? Is there anything wrong with that? :) So tell me ... how did you make your choices (this applies to the regular Kerths as well)? -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ "Here is the end of the alphabet, see? Just three little letters left: X, Y, and Z. We need these three letters, says Larry, to say: X-ray the Yellow Zucchini today!" --Bob & Larry's ABC's (a Veggiecational book) The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 14:13:00 -0500 Reply-To: truitt22@flash.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: timothy truitt Organization: tnt technical services Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pam, I tend to try to spread the vote around as long as I think the quality in a specific category measures up to one that is up for multiple awards. Sometimes, this is very difficult to do. And sometimes I really believe the story that is up for multiple awards really is that outstanding and deserves the multiple awards. When there are 2 or more stories up for multiple awards that really deserve it, it is very difficult to spread the vote around. The problem with the Kerths and Nkerths to me is that we have so many wonderful talented writers out there, that it is very difficult to narrow the decision down to one vote per category. merry Pam Jernigan wrote: > Your discussion question for the week... ;) > > I was at the nKerth awards last night (great job with the ceremony, > Dawn!) and some of us got into a discussion about what these awards were > supposed to measure ... is it just a measure of popularity, or are we > supposed to be judging the quality of the fics, as well? > > I mean, I like all sorts of stories, but I am aware that some of them > have great big plot holes (so did some of the episodes ;), or lots of > technical writing faults, while some of them are just beautifully > written, with every adjective contributing to the tone of the piece. I > may enjoy them equally -- I may even enjoy the flawed piece more, but > I'd be less likely to vote for it. Because in my mind, the Kerths > should be about the quality of the writing. > > I also try to balance things out, to spread the awards around ... if a > certain story is up in two categories, I'd probably vote for it in only > one category (depending on the competition), and let another very good > story get my vote in the other category. In the nkerths, I'll be aware > of whether the story has a gfic version, which might have already won an > award elsewhere -- if it has, I'll be more likely to vote for an > nfic-only story... Honestly, if a story by a less-well known author is > up against a fan favorite, I might be more inclined to vote for the > underdog, just to spread the awards around a bit. Then again, if you do > that too much, soon everyone has one, and they cease to mean very > much... > > But then some people have argued that the Kerths should award the > stories that we just *like* the most, regardless of the technical > details of the writing ... do you agree? We like to think we're > emulating the Oscars, but if we were, we'd only let experienced authors > & editors vote, not everyone... is this just one big popularity > contest? Is there anything wrong with that? :) > > So tell me ... how did you make your choices (this applies to the > regular Kerths as well)? > -- > > Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net > http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam > http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ > > "Here is the end of the alphabet, see? > Just three little letters left: X, Y, and Z. > We need these three letters, says Larry, to say: > X-ray the Yellow Zucchini today!" > --Bob & Larry's ABC's (a Veggiecational book) > > The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 15:41:43 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? I guess I define "best story" as "the one I enjoyed the most". I don't have a specific system for ranking story telling vs grammar vs punctuation vs characterization ... they *all* come into play for me. For example, there are stories that I enjoy very much that wouldn't be called technically perfect. But I enjoy them because they have hit some subjective cord with me -- maybe I've often thought of a similiar scenario, or the story really brings out the emotion in me, or I find the humor particularly funny. On the flip side, a story can be technically perfect, but if I don't enjoy the story premise, it doesn't even make my finalist list. But more often than not, mistakes in grammar, punctuation or plotting will distract me so much from a story that I can't fully enjoy it. And so, even though I don't keep a "score sheet", well written and plotted stories almost always rise to the top of my "enjoy" list. I've always thought the Kerths should be about overall quality -- not quality in one particular area (just plotting, or just grammar) but quality in *all* areas at once. As for popularity, I guess I was always naive enough to believe that the rest of the readers -- or at least a large enough majority -- felt the same way, and thus the "best" story would always win. Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 16:12:05 CDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jessi Mounts Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed This doesn't answer any of Pam's questions, but will transcripts be available of the peanut gallery chat during the nKerths? Yeah, I haven't actually read any of the stories nominated, but the chats are always fun to read. Jessi jessi914@hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 17:12:55 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Demona (Angel Of The Night)" Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? In-Reply-To: <39C50D86.BDF928A8@bellsouth.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 02:29 PM 17/09/00 -0400, Pam wrote: >written, with every adjective contributing to the tone of the piece. I >may enjoy them equally -- I may even enjoy the flawed piece more, but >I'd be less likely to vote for it. Because in my mind, the Kerths >should be about the quality of the writing. Technical perfection does not necessarily equate to good storytelling or compelling creativity. A flawless execution can likewise not be a final determinant for quality. Judging an artform, any artform, is a very subjective task. You have to place technical execution in amongst a greater list of categories (including ingenuity and creativity) before you can come up with a yes or no vote for any piece of writing. There are, after all, any number of eloquent and well written pieces of technically perfect writing 'out there' which are flawless -- by design -- and which still manage to put me to sleep every time I attempt to read them. There's more to creative writing than flawless technical ability. I write fanfiction purely for the pleasure of it as a diversion. I view fanfiction as an opportunity to play all together, and while I'm aware that there are individuals who see it as a stepping stone to something perhaps more 'professional' in nature, I myself do not share that outlook. I already have a professional life. What I want from fanfiction is an additional creative outlet. I'm not looking to subject my leisure activities to intense technical scrutiny, either (for obvious reasons!). Neither am I looking to do something like that to anyone else. That's one of the reasons I'm not usually apt to post a critical comments online. Unfortunately, I've found (more often than not) that even those who 'ask' for technical critique are usually less than prepared to accept it. It's a very difficult thing to give to begin with, more especially because balancing the positive with the negative is such a factor. In the world of fanfiction, it is especially difficult because of the gamut of talent and ability which exists. Some writers are outstanding, while others -- well, suffice it to say that no amount of constructive criticism would do their work justice. But everyone has the 'right' to express themselves creatively in this medium and that's what I love about it. Anything goes. Everyone is regarded as equal before they begin, and everyone is eligible for our 'awards'. I'm frequently invited to join (or to speak on) lists which are designed to assist in the more 'technical' (and less creative) elements of fanfiction story-writing (don't ask me why, I'm probably the most grammatically challenged person who ever walked the face of the planet, yet somehow...) In any event, I have to explain politely at each invitation that those types of forums simply don't appeal to me whatsoever. I do, however, acknowledge and respect that such forums are very readily embraced and desired by some, and so I have nothing negative to say about their purpose in that respect. If there are those who find the struggle for technical perfection to be a useful exercise for their creative work, then by all means they should go after their desire... I will always vote for the story which moves me, in some way. If there's a comma missing here or there, a sentence fragment or two along the way -- as long as it doesn't interrupt the pace and progression of the piece, I won't even bat an eyelash. Best All :) Demi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 16:41:11 CDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jessi Mounts Subject: NEW: Drastic Measures Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Note to those who don't watch a lot of U.S. TV: Teri's been playing her ditsy act to the fullest in a recent series of Radio Shack commercials. I'm not a big fan of those, to put it mildly, and finally decided that if I had to sit through one more of those things, I was going to have to start resorting to drastic measures. Well, one more came and went, so voila... ************ Drastic Measures "Don't even start," Lois warned. Or more accurately, growled. She had to admit, after watching that anthology of mercifully un-aired commercials, her husband had plenty to start about. At the time, she'd thought the story had been more than worth it, but at the seventeenth cringe into the video, she'd seriously began to wonder whether anything was worth that humiliating performance. Her ditsy brunette act wasn't always that bad, was it? "Well..." Clark said cautiously, clearly trying to weigh what would be crossing over into the dangerous territory of "starting". "I'm warning you, Clark..." Lois began. "It's just you-" he tried again. "I don't want to hear it." "It's just you look good in bright colors," he finally blurted out. "I look good in bright colors," Lois repeated dully. "Yeah, you do," he said with the relieved of air of someone discovering the bomb they'd approached so carefully hadn't been armed after all. "Of course, this looks great on you too," he added, reaching across the couch to brush her business suit of the day. Sometime during the display from their TV, she'd unconsciously inched away from him to literally hide in a corner. "But bright, oh, purple would be okay for a change." Bright purple. Sure. As if he actually expected her to walk into work wearing bright purple. But then, for all she knew, the Suit's colors had been his idea, so maybe he really didn't see any problem with Day-glo clothing. She'd have to ask him about that sometime. Anyway, at the moment, he was obviously trying to distract her from the problem at hand. Yes, she'd told him she didn't want to hear it, but now she was curious. "You're hiding something, Clark," she accused. "Okay, come on, let's hear it." "I'm not hiding anything," he protested feebly. "Oh, you are. You really need to learn how to lie." As he opened his mouth for another denial, she added, "And don't say it's not that important. I want to hear it anyway." He snapped his jaws shut and seemed to find himself trapped by that. Finally, he admited, "It wasn't *that* bad, really, but, uh, I don't think that that last 'Bzzz,' was exactly neccesary." Seeing Lois's reaction to that, Clark suddenenly looked horrified and cut off any further remarks, but the damage had already been done. Burying her face in Clark's shoulder, she moaned, "Oh, I knew it. You're embarrassed for me. Of course you are. Why wouldn't you be? I put on my cute little perky voice and let him chase me with toy cars, and I flirted and..and...I was a cupholder! Clark, I let him treat me as a human cupholder! Of course I embarrass you!" Clark gently raised Lois's chin until her eyes met his. "Lois," he said gravely, "you could never, and will never embarrass me. It's impossible. Got that?" Incapable of arguing with that breathtaking declaration, but still not ready to give up her melancholy mood, she only nodded forlornly and demanded, "Then you tell me. Why in the world am I so good at playing the dumb airhead?" "Oh, you're not." Clark said airily. "What made you think you were?" Lois laughed and pummeled Clark with the nearest pillow. "Funny, mister. You happen to be speaking to the woman who got what's-his-name's confession on tape. He sure wasn't going to brag about his ingenious scamming feats to anybody with a brain. Much as I hate to admit it, I'd say I've got the airhead thing down to a fine art." "Then all I've got to say is you're a great actress," Clark said. "Wonderful," Lois said with a laugh. "Where do I go pick up my Oscar?" "No, I mean it," Clark insisted. "You really are the most brilliant person I've met. What's-his-name never stood a chance." Lois leaned in to kiss him lightly as a wordless thank you but then abruptly pulled away. "Now don't you kiss me back, because I'll get distracted, and I've got an important task to finish up." "Oh, do you?" "I do," she said, rising to walk across the room. Taking the tape from the VCR, she announced, "The only evidence ever to exist of my performance is right here, and it's going to stay that way. And don't you help it along. I want to do the honors on this one." With that, she tossed the tape into the fire with more force than was absolutely neccesary and then went back to snuggle into Clark's arms. "And that's it for the Brainless Wonder," she sighed comfortably. "Oh, that's too bad," Clark murmured. "You really did look good in bright purple. And the blue. I really liked the blue." Lois put the nearest pillow to good use again. "Yeah, that's it," she teased. "I'll get Martha to give me some of the blue from your suit. We'll be a matching set." At some point in the evening, that poor tape was melted well past recognition, Lois and Clark never noticed. They'd found more interesting things to occupy them. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 23:52:11 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kaethel Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey guys! > I was at the nKerth awards last night (great job with the ceremony, > Dawn!) and some of us got into a discussion about what these awards were > supposed to measure ... is it just a measure of popularity, or are we > supposed to be judging the quality of the fics, as well? I'm sorry, but I don't quite see what you mean by that. IMHO, the Kerths are a measure of quality as well as popularity, and I don't see how you can draw a line between those two concepts. I'm not saying that popularity necessarily means quality. But I don't think we can make a real difference. Most of the FoLCs do have enough taste to recognise a good quality story from a bad one, IMHO. > I mean, I like all sorts of stories, but I am aware that some of them > have great big plot holes (so did some of the episodes ;), or lots of > technical writing faults, while some of them are just beautifully > written, with every adjective contributing to the tone of the piece. I > may enjoy them equally -- I may even enjoy the flawed piece more, but > I'd be less likely to vote for it. Because in my mind, the Kerths > should be about the quality of the writing. I agree that Kerths should be about the quality of the writing. And I think they *are* about the quality of the writing. FoLCs vote for the stories they think are good quality, since it's *their* favourite stories. > I also try to balance things out, to spread the awards around ... if a > certain story is up in two categories, I'd probably vote for it in only > one category (depending on the competition), and let another very good > story get my vote in the other category. In the nkerths, I'll be aware > of whether the story has a gfic version, which might have already won an > award elsewhere -- if it has, I'll be more likely to vote for an > nfic-only story... Honestly, if a story by a less-well known author is > up against a fan favorite, I might be more inclined to vote for the > underdog, just to spread the awards around a bit. Then again, if you do > that too much, soon everyone has one, and they cease to mean very > much... I don't spread the votes around if I think a story is really better than the others. I consider the categories independently from one another. For example, if A and B are nominated for, say, best drama, and I think A is better, I'll vote for A. Then, if A and B are also nominated for best ep rewrite, and I think A is still better (in this category), I'll vote again for A. Is that dishonest voting? ;) > But then some people have argued that the Kerths should award the > stories that we just *like* the most, regardless of the technical > details of the writing ... do you agree? Actually, I don't think there's a difference between stories you like the most and good quality stories. I can't love a story, let alone vote for it for the Kerths, if it's poorly written or there are plot holes. And I don't believe I have bad taste in fanfic reading, so why would I vote for a story which has many technical flaws? Actually, I doubt *any* story (not only fanfics of this fandom, but generally speaking) is perfect or flawless. But when I vote for a story, it's because I loved it, and when I loved a story, it's as much because of its premise as the fact it's technically well written and didn't have plot holes. > We like to think we're > emulating the Oscars, but if we were, we'd only let experienced authors > & editors vote, not everyone... is this just one big popularity > contest? Is there anything wrong with that? :) IMHO, if nominations and votes were done by only 'experienced' authors and editors, we'd lose the whole ceremony's significance. I think of the Kerths as a nice event for readers to say thanks to the authors whose fics have enthralled us during the year. And would experienced authors (how would they be chosen, btw?) be more able to choose than people who read but don't write? I don't think so. Don't fanfic authors write for *readers* before all? > So tell me ... how did you make your choices (this applies to the > regular Kerths as well)? I choose the stories that evoked some emotion within me. And this means quality stories, IMHO, because like a lot of other readers, something like bad grammar or bad use of words puts me off reading very easily. It happens that I don't nominate or vote for a category, when I don't feel convinced enough by the elligible stories. And I don't think my choices are biased ;) Helene :) kaethel@club-internet.fr ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 17:10:10 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Dockingbay Organization: Microsoft Corporation Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? Although I am a habitual lurker, I felt compelled to add my two cents, and all the respect that it implies, to this latest query. I love fanfiction; especially that dealing with L&C. Despite the fact that I rarely comment on the lists, usually using the person to person e-mail or sometimes the MB's to express my comments regarding stories, I recognize a real personal need to vote in the Kerths and (n)Kerths. I see it as a means to make another effort to the person or persons that have added a real joy to my life with their writing talents. Simply put, I want to thank them and, if my vote helps recognize a story that has really moved me, than that's what I do. My voting criteria? I had to have really liked it. That's it. Professionally, if I see something that has grammatical errors, I have been known to boo, hiss, and moan, but unless the errors in fanfiction are so glaring that I have lost the flow of the story, I don't care. I vote for what I like. Not being an intergral part nor active member in developing what seems to have become great friendships because of your association with other FOLC it is relatively easy not to allow popularity to play into my decisions. Now, that being said - that's probably more babbling than I've done in ages - I readily admit that this years NKerths were extremely difficult to make clear cut choices. Mind you, I'm not complaining. No, actually what this very verbose message is attempting to relay is that I have been thrilled with all the enormous talent and, as always, in awe. Thank you to all of the writers, editors, and web page providers. You all continue to add happiness to my life knowing that, when RL allows it, I can find your talents out there and enjoy. Catherine ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 18:19:47 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Laurie Dunn Subject: Re: NEW: Drastic Measures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL, Jessi. Very good. Cute vignette that rings true. Hopefully the pay makes up for the embarrassment of those commercials for Teri. After all, she has no Clark to make her feel better. LaurieD ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 16:53:44 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Melisma Subject: Re: NEW: Drastic Measures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL Jessi, that was funny! I really enjoyed it - thanks for posting it... Melisma (still giggling under her rock) Visit my website at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 20:28:43 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Pam Jernigan Organization: http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam/ Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gosh, I hit a nerve! :) (But the list's not quiet anymore ) Several people said they'd vote for the same story in multiple categories if it's really the best one ... well, so would I. But in some years and some categories, there are several equally excellent stories ... so I guess I use the consideration of what other categories the story is in as a tie-breaker. Kathy and Demi argued against using "technical skills" as the defining criteria ... it's not the most important thing I look at. But again, it's a tie-breaker. If story A is great, except the author puts commas after every third word, while story B is great, and the prose sparkles ... well, story B gets my vote, even if they both affected me equally, on the emotional side. As a writer, I tend to notice this stuff a little more, and it will pull me out of the story a little (I've read some really horrible stuff in other fandoms -- I couldn't believe the author had dared to publish such a mess! sorry, going off topic ). (And I will say that L&C fanfic is *far* superior to what I've seen in other fandoms, so we should all be proud of that.) > I've always thought the Kerths should be about overall quality -- not quality > in one particular area (just plotting, or just grammar) but quality in *all* > areas at once. Works for me, Kathy :) Trouble is, everyone's got a different definition of quality... Helene wrote: > IMHO, the Kerths are > a measure of quality as well as popularity, and I don't see how you can draw > a line between those two concepts. I'm not saying that popularity > necessarily means > quality. But I don't think we can make a real difference. Most of the FoLCs > do have enough taste to recognise a good quality story from a bad one, IMHO. I didn't mean to insult anyone ... tho I guess that was an inherent danger in this sort of debate. And I'm not disparaging any of the Kerth winners; the winners weren't always *my* favorites (obviously, given that some people disagree with me on various subjects ) but they were all good stories. I just sometimes get the feeling that some people look at the ballot and say "hey, there's my favorite author, I'll just vote for everything she's written", whether or not they've read the other nominees. And I admit there have been times that I haven't read them all, either -- which makes my vote biased, because I'm more likely to read the stories written by known quantities -- if I have a choice between new fic by Wendy and new fic by Judy Regular, I'm gonna read Wendy's first. And I may or may not get back to read Judy's. If I don't read it, I'm not gonna nominate it, and I'm unlikely to vote for it ... but I don't have time to read all the fic that comes out (I love that we're such a prolific bunch, but it does have a downside). (Another reason it's so important to publish fic recommendations on this list! :) > I don't spread the votes around if I think a story is really better than the > others. I consider the categories independently from one another. For > example, if A and B are nominated for, say, best drama, and I think A is > better, I'll vote for A. Then, if A and B are also nominated for best ep > rewrite, and I think A is still better (in this category), I'll vote again > for A. Is that dishonest voting? ;) Nope, not at all. Like I said, I just look at it as a tie-breaker: If A and B are both really terrific stories, I might take a look at which functions better as a drama, and which is better identified as an ep rewrite, and vote that way. If those are both A, well, then, that's how I'd vote, but often, by looking at it in that different light, I can make distinctions. I can't be the only one with systems like this, guys! We all complain, year after year, that all the stories are terrific ... so how do you narrow it down between 2 fabulous stories? > IMHO, if nominations and votes were done by only 'experienced' authors and > editors, we'd lose the whole ceremony's significance. It would certainly change it quite a bit, and I'm not really advocating that. There are various problems with setting that up, as you point out -- who would pick the "voters"? And there are certainly readers whose opinion I trust far more than some authors ;) It'd probably become a clique and a breeding ground for resentment, but what the heck, I thought it'd be an interesting topic for discussion :) Catherine, thanks for coming out of lurking :) I think you (among others) have nailed it -- you may not have technical quality in mind when voting, but that forms part of your opinion about the story, because if a story's written poorly, it has less of a chance to draw you in and impact you, emotionally. Food for thought, thanks :) -- Pam Jernigan / ChiefPam / jernigan@bellsouth.net http://www.geocities.com/~chiefpam http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~jernigan/ "Here is the end of the alphabet, see? Just three little letters left: X, Y, and Z. We need these three letters, says Larry, to say: X-ray the Yellow Zucchini today!" --Bob & Larry's ABC's (a Veggiecational book) The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 04:53:25 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Interesting topic, Pam, and you=92ve got us talking again, which is always good to see! And your response said a lot of what I was planning to say, though not all, and perhaps not from the same perspective. How do *I* decide to vote? According to my view of quality overall - and, as has been pointed out, that is a subjective view. I know there are stories which appear to be universally loved in FoLCdom and which don=92t do= a lot for me; equally, there are stories which seemed to me to be clear, outright winners in their category and which didn=92t get placed, at Kerths or nKerths. I like originality in a plot, an interesting premise, well executed. I love angst, but I can equally happily vote for a WAFFy or action story where I=92ve enjoyed it. I do try to read everything, and generally manage it unless, for some reason, I abandon the story as not my type at all, or as unreadable (the very, very few in our fandom which are just so badly written that it requires a lot of effort to figure out what the author=92s saying - which I=92= d be unlikely to vote for in any event). This means that I=92m usually choosin= g in a category between stories which I have actually read. (I=92m just a fast= reader, and I have a good memory for story content ). As for choosing between stories, I do recognise Pam=92s dilemma; it=92s exactly what I faced= in the Kerths. I never vote for myself, so that sometimes rules out a story in a category. But even with some categories down to four in the Kerths, because there were so many stories written overall last year the shortlists usually contained stories all of which I wanted to win. Very, very difficult... so yeah, it was a case of thinking =91I=92ll vote for LabRat in= Best Dramatic, Yvonne in Best Alt, Chris in Ep Rewrite, Sheila in....=92 and= so on, with stories which had multiple nominations and all of which I thought were deserving of awards. Does technical perfection make a difference? Only when it=92s the difference= between weak technical skills and competent skills; poor spelling/grammar only makes a difference to me when it=92s very bad. Simplistic sentence structure might make me rate a story less well than a few misplaced commas -= as Pam said too, I notice these things more since I started writing. I=92m even more critical of published novels in relation to grammar and construction! Too often now, I find myself thinking that there are far better writers posting fanfiction.... A story like Cindy=92s Prelude - and Cindy freely admitted that spelling and grammar aren=92t her strong point, and the version posted on the boards hadn=92t been fully edited - seized my attention because it was just so *good,* and any technical flaws certainly didn=92t take away from its appeal. I voted for it above stories which had fewer spelling/grammatical errors. Perhaps what matters to me more is characterisation and motivation. We are writing about Lois and Clark, and therefore the characters should behave like Lois and Clark. If they don=92t - and there=92s no good explanation for= it - then that=92s a story I am less likely to vote for, particularly since I=92m far more a fan of the B-plot than A-plot. Where there is a good explanation for either character acting very differently - such as that the story is an Elseworld, as opposed to merely alternate beginnings - I can usually accept the difference: Mobile Richard=92s Life in a Different World is a good example here. Like Helene, I would hate to see any suggestion that story nomination be done by a smaller group of =91experienced=92 writers/editors; I think this would be the quickest way possible to turn FoLCs off the Kerths. We can all judge =91quality,=92 and =91quality=92 is a subjective judgement. I have fre= quently said to one of my writer friends that I really liked X story, only to discover on some occasions that the friend in question was only lukewarm about it. So what=92s the difference between =91quality=92 and =91popularity=92? Do pe= ople vote for the same writer over and over, because they like that person=92s work generally? (Good grief, I hope not!! - actually, like Pam, I would like to see awards spread around more). I don=92t think that would necessarily lead to devaluing the awards because =91everyone has one,=92 because there are so= me excellent writers out there who have yet to win Kerths; they=92ve been nominated several times, but always pipped at the post - and frequently by someone a little more prolific and apparently =91popular=92. So - picking up= on something Pam hinted at - yes, grateful and honoured as I feel for having been voted into first place in several categories in both Kerths and nKerths, I feel hugely embarrassed at coming away with the number I did, especially as I believed - on both occasions - that there were better stories than mine in the categories, and writers whose work I believed was more worthy of the honour. Can it be suggested that a =91popular=92 story is not a =91good=92 story? Ye= s, perhaps; but how can the difference be expressed? Isn=92t it all subjective anyway? Just because I think X story is not a particularly good story, who says my opinion is in any way superior to the opinions of dozens of FoLC who think that story X is one of the best they=92ve read this year? I=92m ne= ver sure what determines =91popularity=92 - is it, as Pam suggested, the result = of people reading stories by an established author before stories by an unknown? But that means it=92s going to be very difficult for =91unknowns=92= to *become* established. How can someone have their work appreciated if people aren=92t reading it in the first place? I know not everyone can read everything, so perhaps we should be recommending stories here more often, especially if it=92s a great story by a newcomer - I know I=92ve mentioned s= ome excellent stories which are being posted on the boards by really talented new writers, and when they hit the Archive I=92ll be back to remind the list= about them. Great topic, Pam; I=92m not sure that we=92re going to be able to reach any conclusions here, but it=92s certainly a fascinating discussion. Wendy ---------------- Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 06:27:55 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "C.C. Malo" Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pam wrote: <> This surprised me. Now I have to confess I didn't vote this year for the nKerths because I hadn't managed to read all the nominees in each category. (except the vignette category and I felt dumb submitting a ballot with a vote in one category only) Although some of my favourite authors were nominated, I would have felt uncomfortable voting for them without having read everything in the category. Voting would mean I'd compared the stories which I hadn't. So, I'm curious how people feel about this. Would you vote for a story even if you hadn't read all the stories in a category? Is there some other factor involved here? Carol (who is still catching up on fanfic reading & feedback writing) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 07:23:39 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Charlotte Fisler Subject: Re: NEW: Drastic Measures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Great little story. Charlotte ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 12:41:06 +0100 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Only one thing I really want to comment on with this particular thread and that is the idea of a small group of 'writers and editors' being the judges of who is nominated in the Kerths/nKerths, rather than FoLCs in general. It's an idea which disturbs me on many levels. First of all - as others have noted - who decides who these paragons are? Do they elect themselves? And what would give them the right to assume that they know better on what constitutes a 'quality fic' than the rest of us? I'm sorry, but the whole idea - as I said at the time it was first mooted on irc - just seems terribly elitist to me. It advances from the basic assumption, after all, it seems to me, that the vast majority of those voting don't know what they are doing and can't be trusted to vote in the 'right' fic and so the nominating process should be restricted to those who know 'better' than they. And I dislike the underlying idea it promotes that only writers and editors can judge quality in the first place. What makes them particularly endowed with that wisdom? Readers can't judge quality? And is quality purely dependent on having good technical writing skills? As Wendy has already pointed out, not necessarily. I myself recently read a fic which is highly regarded among many FoLCs, as is the author. Technically, it was a mess. The author admits to knowing little about grammar, punctuction or spelling and would probably be the first to agree with that assessment. ;). But the story - well that was another thing entirely. The story was wonderful. I was fascinated throughout and didn't mind the technical imperfections at all. Such things can be easily corrected by editors and beta readers - what matters, imo, is the soul in the writing. Its heart. To paraphrase the old cliche, it's not the tale, it's the teller. And it's not the technical skills either which makes great fic, imo. Nope, I honestly can't think of anything more horrifying than the scenario presented by this one. I'm not saying that such an award event would necessarily be a bad thing. An Editors' Choice Award or A Writers' Choice Award wouldn't give me any problems and would even make an interesting compliment to the main Awards. But as a replacement for an award event in which those who are the best judges of what was best in the year - those who actually read and enjoyed the fic - please, no. . LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 13:11:17 +0100 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: How do you vote for the (n)Kerths? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Carol wrote: > So, I'm curious how people feel about this. Would you vote for a story even > if you hadn't read all the stories in a category? Is there some other factor > involved here? > Personally, Carol, I'd be mightily surprised if there wasn't. My own feeling on this particular point is that people cast votes for all kinds of reasons personal to them and I wouldn't be surprised to hear that some of those reasons were because they were simply voting for stories by a favourite author or on the basis of 'I haven't read all five stories in this category, but I have read two, so I'll just choose between those, because I don't really have time to catch up before voting closes'. And, undoubtedly, the entire range of reasons inbetween! But, isn't this just how life is? How all awards are judged in part? The Oscars just occasionally are won by the movie or actor who got the most pity votes. Sentiment often wins out over quality. Or big box office. It's not imo *right* - but it is reality, I think. To be honest, I've never considered or expected the Kerths or nKerths to be any different. For myself, I always take my votes seriously. I weigh up the pros and cons and take time to read everything first. I feel a certain sense of responsibility to make my choices in as unbiased and impartial a manner as I can. I never vote for a particular story, for instance, because it was written by a good friend. I do try to separate the author from the process and judge it on the story alone and my own reactions to it when I read it. Of course, that makes me feel terribly guilt stricken when I vote for another fic over a friend's. But so far I haven't compromised on that one. Course, as I have a great many good friends who are fantastic authors, quite often my conscience is spared the torture. ;) Until, of course, I have to choose between two great fic by two good friends. :) But, hey, that's part of the fun, isn't it? Would I like others to take as much care? Sure I would! I personally believe it is the right thing to do and the fair way to vote. But to be honest I *don't* expect everyone to do the same. And I have the gut feeling that often others don't. But, for me, that's just the way the cookie crumbles. People will always be people. And their reasons for voting, as in everything else they do, will always be varied and legion and not necessarily always good - or bad - or even logical. ;) LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 13:24:23 +0100 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Let's Hear it for The Lurker! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A recent email with a very good friend prompted me to send this. There is someone in FoLCdom right now who is sadly underpraised and = under-rated imho. As a lurker who jealously guards her privacy, she often misses out on = kudos and praise for all the sterling work she does for all of us. = So...let's have a big round of applause for...The Lurker! This wonderful fan maintains the websites for the Nfic Directory and the = Gfic Index. The latter site gets an average of an amazing 1,000 hits a = month alone and much of the design, if not the majority, was down to her = alone. She stepped into the breach at the last minute to get the Nkerth = Award plaques together when the original designer felt she couldn't = continue to participate. She has maintained the Nkerth site for the past = two years and gives a lot of her time to help the process as part of the = Nkerth committee. If you ask her, she'll modestly insist that she had a = lot of input and assistance on the websites, but, trust me, she was the = driving force on all of them and they wouldn't exist without her. Lurker, thank you for all you do for us! Most fans may not even know = your name and be unware of your presence behind the scenes, but I know = that they all appreciate your hard work and I'm sure they will join me = in saying, 'Well done and thank you!' LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 09:33:44 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Let's Hear it for The Lurker! Absolutely, Rat! There are lots of people in FoLCdom without whose activities we would not have the fandom we do: website hosts, Archive managers and co-ordinators, award ceremony organisers and so on. But you're right: we do tend to know who a lot of these people are, and while we may not be sufficiently appreciative of their hard work much of the time, at least we *know* what they do. The 'Lurker' has contributed significantly to our enjoyment of fanfic and nfanfic; so, from me too, many thanks! :) Wendy ------------ Wendy Richards wendy@kingsmeadowcr.freeserve.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 18:37:44 +0100 Reply-To: "yconnell@ukf.net" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: yconnell Subject: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit After the lively discussion on US/UK vocabulary differences, I thought it might be fun to set a vocabulary quiz. It's open to anyone from anywhere, and the game is simple: supply the US equivalent of the following words and phrases. They're all in common usage in the UK. No cheating by looking up reference sites or books, and if you *do* reply, please remember spoiler space! Easy ones first : (one point each) back garden chips (food) crisps polo-neck mad skip (noun) tights pavement biscuit handbag suspender belt soft drink court shoes lift (noun) squaddy (noun) Now some phrases: (2 points each) to bump off to grass someone up to duff up up the duff he topped himself Yvonne (seriously wondering if this will fall flat on its face ) (yconnell@ukf.net) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 12:59:12 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Amy Linnea Lauters Subject: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII How fun to come back to this! :) S P O i L E R S p a c e Easy ones first : (one point each) back garden -- back yard chips (food) -- french fries crisps -- potato chips polo-neck -- I think a turtle-neck mad -- insane or nuts skip (noun) -- hmmm ... a boat? tights -- pantyhose pavement -- concrete or asphalt biscuit -- cookie handbag -- purse suspender belt -- I think just suspenders soft drink -- soda court shoes -- shoes for fancy dress, like Mary Janes lift (noun) -- elevator squaddy (noun) -- dunno! Now some phrases: (2 points each) to bump off -- to kill? to grass someone up -- to beat them up? to duff up -- to mess up? up the duff -- as in, "I've had it up to here?" he topped himself -- he killed himself? < )>> nah, this is great fun. Amy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 11:16:23 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: JaT Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sorry, this went to Yconnell first! First time that's happened to me! s p o i l e r s p a c e --- yconnell wrote: > After the lively discussion on US/UK vocabulary > differences, I thought it > might be fun to set a vocabulary quiz. It's > open to anyone from anywhere, > and the game is simple: supply the US > equivalent of the following words and > phrases. They're all in common usage in the > UK. > > No cheating by looking up reference sites or > books, and if you *do* reply, > please remember spoiler space! > > Easy ones first : (one point each) > > back garden Backyard > chips (food) French Fries > crisps ?? > polo-neck Sweater? > mad outrageously happy? > skip (noun) ?? > tights ?? > pavement sidewalk > biscuit cookie > handbag purse > suspender belt suspejnders > soft drink carbonated beverage ex:pop,soda,'coke' > court shoes tennis shoes > lift (noun) elevator > squaddy (noun) ?!?! > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > to bump off kill? > to grass someone up rough-house or wrestle? > to duff up ?? > up the duff ?? > he topped himself ?? ===== The D8As - AIM id is mrd8astl Matthew 23:37-39, Romans 1:19-32, 2 Chronicles 7:13-14 Work in progress: Seven Days of Superman-Table of contents can be found at http://www.zoomway.com/boards/ubbhtml/Forum5/HTML/003005.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 18:20:51 GMT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Okay, I'll give this a try! Just to warn others, the 'reply to' is set to send it to Yvonne, so you may need to type in the list address (I had to). S P O I L E R S P A C E Easy ones first : (one point each) -- Sure, easy in your eyes! back garden -- Back yard? chips (food) -- French fries crisps -- Chips (as in potato chips) polo-neck -- Sorry, don't know. Unless it's a polo shirt and/or golf shirt. mad -- crazy? loony? nuts? skip (noun) -- No clue tights -- I use this for those things like nylons, but thicker and for ballet. Don't know what it means in the UK, though. pavement -- The stuff on a road/sidewalk? (ie concrete) biscuit -- Cookie handbag -- purse? suspender belt -- Sorry, no idea soft drink -- Pop? Soda? Coke ? court shoes -- Tennis shoes? (or, as we now have, running, track, walking, athletic, etc, etc, etc) lift (noun) -- Elevator squaddy (noun) -- Nope, don't know Now some phrases: (2 points each)> to bump off -- kill someone? to grass someone up -- no clue to duff up -- (I got help on this one -- the answer given to me was 'to dress up,' i.e. wearing Sunday best) up the duff -- (help on this one too -- Dressed up to the hilt, to the nines, etc) he topped himself -- commit suicide? Okay, there are my answers! I hope I did decent (I think I'm better at this than the story scavenger hunts!) Bethy _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 11:20:31 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Melisma Subject: Re: Let's Hear it for The Lurker! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lab, Wendy - I will third your sentiments re The Lurker. But also have a question: Is the Lurker on this list? What other forums is s/he in? Not necessarily looking for hir identity - just wondering how to thank hir in person, by contacting the forum(s) s/he is in directly, if that is possible... Melisma (under her rock, using the gender pronouns favoured by Star Trek: The New Frontier for a gender-nonspecific person :) Visit my website at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:10:07 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Dennis Arendt Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Amy Linnea Lauters To: Sent: Monday, September 18, 2000 10:59 AM Subject: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 > How fun to come back to this! :) > S > P > O > i > L > E > R > > S > p > a > c > e > > > > back garden -- back yard > chips - french fries > crisps -- potato chips > polo-neck -- sweater > mad -- insane > skip - boat > tights -- pantyhose > pavement -- concrete > biscuit -- cookie > handbag -- purse/tote > suspender belt -- ? > soft drink -- soda/cola > court shoes -- tennis shoes > lift (noun) -- elevator > squaddy -hobo/bum > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > to bump off -- to kill > to grass someone up -- ? > to duff up -- to screw up > up the duff -- that's enough > he topped himself -- killed himself > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 14:17:19 -0500 Reply-To: truitt22@flash.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: timothy truitt Organization: tnt technical services Subject: Re: Let's Hear it for The Lurker! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I too appreciate all your hard work. I am a loyal reader of fic and nfic. thank you. merry ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 12:19:02 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Okay, I'll give this a try, too. S P O I L E R S P A C E > > back garden - back yard > chips (food) - french fries > crisps - potato chips > polo-neck - turtleneck? > mad - crazy > skip (noun) - no idea > tights - pantyhose > pavement - well, we call it pavement in Canada, too, but the surface of a road > biscuit - cookie > handbag - also called handbags here, but more commonly referred to as a purse > suspender belt - suspenders > soft drink - soft drink (g) or pop > court shoes - tennis shoes? > lift (noun) - elevator > squaddy (noun) - no idea - really looking forward to finding out. > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > to bump off - to kill > to grass someone up - to flatter or butter up? > to duff up - ? > up the duff - ? > he topped himself - he killed himself (cut off his head, literally, I would think.) How'd I do? Irene ===== sirenegold@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 16:06:58 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Clarissa Kent Organization: @Home Network Member Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit S P O I L E R S P A C E > > back garden- backyard > chips (food)- french fries > crisps- potato chips > polo-neck- golf shirt > mad- crazy > skip (noun)- boat > tights- leggings? > pavement- cement > biscuit- cookie > handbag- purse > suspender belt- suspenders > soft drink- pop > court shoes- running shoes > lift (noun)- elevator > squaddy (noun)- no idea! Maybe a sport? > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > to bump off- to kill someone > to grass someone up- To beat someone up > to duff up-?? > up the duff-?? > he topped himself- he killed himself > > Yvonne > (seriously wondering if this will fall flat on its face ) > I enjoyed it! ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 00:23:50 +0100 Reply-To: LabRat Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LabRat Organization: LabRat Subject: Re: Let's Hear it for The Lurker! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mel wrote: > > I will third your sentiments re The Lurker. But also have a question: Is the > Lurker on this list? What other forums is s/he in? Not necessarily looking > for hir identity - just wondering how to thank hir in person, by contacting > the forum(s) s/he is in directly, if that is possible... > Oh, I think you just did, Mel. ;) LabRat :) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 19:37:13 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Laurie Dunn Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 9/18/2000 10:43:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time, yconnell@UKF.NET writes: s p o i l e r s p a c e << Easy ones first : (one point each) I'll give it a go! back garden back yard chips (food) French fries crisps potato chips polo-neck uh... a soft, knitted collar on a shirt? mad insane skip (noun) ??? tights stretchy clothing, I'm probably wrong pavement sidewalk biscuit I know! Here they're cookies! handbag purse suspender belt ??? soft drink non-alcoholic? court shoes for playing tennis in lift (noun) elevator squaddy (noun) ??? Now some phrases: (2 points each) to bump off to kill to grass someone up lol yeah, right to duff up ??? up the duff I haven't failed a test in years.... he topped himself he did better than the last time >> submitted by LaurieD ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 00:46:59 +0100 Reply-To: "yconnell@ukf.net" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: yconnell Subject: FW: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Forwarding this for Melisma, who fell into the 'Reply to' trap ;) Y. ******** S P O I L E R S P A C E Okay, I will bite :) Will prolly make a fool of myself, but this one sounds like one I could actually get some points for... Oh yeah, and my translation is from MY experience, which may be different from people from other parts of North America. (I have lived all over the place, so my vocab shows it :) > back garden - backyard > chips (food) - French fries. Only I'm not sure, but I think English chips are what we would call home fries - fairly thick cut, none of this shoestring, thincut potato business that McDonalds likes to make us eat with our burgers... Personally I prefer them thick that way! > crisps - potato chips > polo-neck - Okay, here I have to make a stab... Some sort of a sweater. A pullover, perhaps? > mad - crazy > skip (noun) - no clue > tights - nylons > pavement - cement > biscuit - cookie > handbag - purse > suspender belt - oy, no idea > soft drink - pop, soda... for eg Coke or Fanta > court shoes - tennis shoes, runners, running shoes > lift (noun) - elevator > squaddy (noun) - this is a new one, have no idea > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > to bump off - to kill someone? > to grass someone up - dunno > to duff up - no idea > up the duff - no clue > he topped himself - he did better (at something) than he ever did before? Oh my, I didn't do very well, did I?!? Melisma (going to look for her British/US/Canadian dictionary, here under her rock) Visit my website at http://www.intergate.ca/personal/melisma/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 20:13:38 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kate Crane Subject: Question for Wendy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wendy, I am reading your wonderful Lightning story and am not half way through so I won't comment yet, but please, it's driving me crazy: is a domino just a cape, such as something an eighteenth century man would wear? I know you describe it somewhat but I still feel like I can't quite picture it in my mind. Thanks ever so.... oh, let me make this one comment: s p o i l e r s p a c e I was very touched by Martha's response to Lois about Clark making her think he was dead (TOGOM): "But Honey, *he* thought he was dead!". . . . . . "Clark Kent was dead." Great new way to look at this. . . I was kind of tired of reading (in numerous fics) about how terrible Clark was for making her think he was dead, and this totally made his position understandable and was a sound reason for putting Lois through hell. Kate, who's getting back to reading, and not much else today ;). ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 20:58:08 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/18/2000 3:21:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, sirenegold@YAHOO.COM writes: << S P O I L E R S P A C E > > back garden - back yard > chips (food) - french fries > crisps - potato chips > polo-neck - turtleneck? > mad - crazy > skip (noun) - no idea > tights - pantyhose > pavement - well, we call it pavement in Canada, too, but the surface of a road and in the U.S. we also often say pavement... > biscuit - cookie > handbag - also called handbags here, but more commonly referred to as a purse also the term handbag is common here... > suspender belt - suspenders > soft drink - soft drink (g) or pop this is common in the U.S. too... > court shoes - tennis shoes? > lift (noun) - elevator > squaddy (noun) - no idea - really looking forward to finding out. > >> --Laurie, who is also looking foward to teh meaning of squaddy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 22:56:37 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Lorie Y. Crisp" Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OK, I've read all the replies, and I've pretty much figured out the same ones everyone else did. Now I WANT THE ANSWERS!!!! the "squaddy" word is driving me nuts. Lorie :-) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 23:24:14 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: StarKitty Subject: Fw: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ok, I sent it to Yvonne on accident. Sorry, Yvonne! ----- Original Message ----- From: "StarKitty" To: Sent: Monday, September 18, 2000 11:22 PM Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 > Ok, I'll take a stab at it > s > - > p > - > o > - > i > - > l > - > e > - > r > - > s > - > p > - > a > - > c > - > e > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "yconnell" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 18, 2000 10:37 AM > Subject: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 > > > > After the lively discussion on US/UK vocabulary differences, I thought it > > might be fun to set a vocabulary quiz. It's open to anyone from anywhere, > > and the game is simple: supply the US equivalent of the following words > and > > phrases. They're all in common usage in the UK. > > > > No cheating by looking up reference sites or books, and if you *do* reply, > > please remember spoiler space! > > > > Easy ones first : (one point each) > > > > back garden--uh . . . back yard? > > chips (food)--french fries > > crisps--potatoe chips > > polo-neck--no idea > > mad--crazy? > > skip (noun)--no idea > > tights--ditto > > pavement--sidewalk > > biscuit--nope, no idea > > handbag--purse? > > suspender belt--suspenders? > > soft drink--soda? > > court shoes--pumps > > lift (noun)--elevator > > squaddy (noun)--huh? > > > > Now some phrases: (2 points each) > > > > to bump off > > to grass someone up > > to duff up > > up the duff > > he topped himself > > > > I've never heard those phrases before. I'll have to wait for the answers. > > Tara > > > > Yvonne > > (seriously wondering if this will fall flat on its face ) > > > > (yconnell@ukf.net) > > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 01:04:33 -0700 Reply-To: ardchem@earthlink.net Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Lisa M. Ramirez" Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII I haven't been to England it years, but I'll give this a try. S P O I L E R S P A C E back garden - BACK YARD chips (food) - FRENCH FRIES crisps - POTATO CHIPS polo-neck - TURTLE-NECK SWEATER mad - CRAZY skip (noun) - I think it's a DUMPSTER. Big, ugly things. tights - NYLONS or PANTYHOSE pavement - SIDEWALK (though some people call it pavement in the U.S., too.) biscuit - COOKIE handbag - PURSE suspender belt- GARTER BELT. Holds up womens stockings soft drink - SODA, COKE court shoes - BASIC PUMPS, is the closest shoe I can compare this with. Pumps have somewhat low heels and covered tops. lift (noun) - ELEVATOR squaddy (noun) - ?????? Now some phrases: (2 points each) to bump off - KILL SOMEONE to grass someone up - I think this one means to TATTLE on someone or to TELL on them for doing something they shouldn't have to duff up - I think this means to DRESS UP up the duff - DRESS TO HILT he topped himself - BECAME DRUNK???? My English as opposed to American is exhausted. I am very curious as to squaddy means. > (seriously wondering if this will fall flat on its face ) I think you've a winner here. Lisa M. Ramirez ardchem@earthlink.net In times if crisis, I change "stressed" to "desserts". Life is much sweeter after that. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 12:24:07 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Question for Wendy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Kate (and anyone else who might be wondering ;)) > I am reading your wonderful Lightning story and am not half way through so I > won't comment yet, but please, it's driving me crazy: is a domino just a > cape, such as something an eighteenth century man would wear? I know you > describe it somewhat but I still feel like I can't quite picture it in my > mind. Yes; well, if you've read your Georgette Heyer, a domino is a hooded cape - the hood was very loose and would fall forward over the upper part of the face. By Regency times, they were most commonly worn to masquerade balls, by both men and women, in combination with a mask. (Women wore coloured dominoes, dunno about the men ). I did try to explain within the text what it was - for instance by having other characters wonder about the very heavy cape that [the character] was wearing, since it seemed to be too heavy and enveloping for its purpose. ;) .... > > oh, let me make this one comment: > s > p > o > i > l > e > r > s > p > a > c > e > > I was very touched by Martha's response to Lois about Clark making her think > he was dead (TOGOM): "But Honey, *he* thought he was dead!". . . . . . > "Clark Kent was dead." > Great new way to look at this. . . I was kind of tired of reading (in > numerous fics) about how terrible Clark was for making her think he was dead, > and this totally made his position understandable and was a sound reason for > putting Lois through hell. Thank you! I still think that Clark *should* have thought about Lois in that situation, but that his 'crime' was certainly mitigated by his own perception of the situation - I think I did that one to death in Shattered Illusions. Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 06:39:41 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 Yvonne, I'd say this was popular all right! Nice one! (now there's another Brit colloquialism ). Well, since not all have been guessed, I'm going to have a go. >back garden - back yard >chips (food) - french fries (but really home fries, to get the closest equivalent) >crisps - potato chips >polo-neck - Americans call it a roll-neck, don't they? >mad - crazy >skip (noun) - dumpster >tights - pantyhose >pavement - sidewalk (*not* the concrete or asphalt it's made of) >biscuit - cookie >handbag - purse (and *we* call a purse the much smaller container you put your cash into - what do Americans call that?!) >suspender belt - garter belt. >soft drink - soda or pop >court shoes - pumps (which *we* use to mean trainers, running shoes etc) >lift (noun) - elevator >squaddy (noun) - Here, *I* don't know the US term, so I'm not going to be able to enlighten you! Unless you're thinking of GI, Yvonne? > >Now some phrases: (2 points each) > >to bump off - to kill, 'terminate with extreme prejudice' >to grass someone up - to dish the dirt, turn State's evidence (depending on the context) >to duff up - to beat up, do over >up the duff - up the pole, pregnant >he topped himself - he offed himself Okay, did I do better at finding the US equivalents? I may have had the advantage of knowing what the UK English terms meant, but that doesn't mean I'd automatically know what 'Murcans' call them! :) Wendy ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 13:32:40 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Phillip Atcliffe Subject: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz In-Reply-To: <017901c0222c$20225440$916105a0@hrm.keele.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On Tue, 19 Sep 2000 12:24:07 +0100 Wendy Richards wrote: > Yes; well, if you've read your Georgette Heyer, a domino is a hooded cape - the hood was very loose and would fall forward over the upper part of the face. By Regency times, they were most commonly worn to masquerade balls, by both men and women, in combination with a mask. (Women wore coloured dominoes, dunno about the men ). < The men certainly did earlier in history -- say, George I or II eras -- again as testified by Miss Heyer, e.g., in The Masqueraders, in which, at one point, most of the main characters are wandering around in dominoes at a ball -- pink, rose, blue, grey and black, according to taste and/or wish to be mysterious . Later, anent Irene's vocab challenge, she wrote: >Well, since not all have been guessed, I'm going to have a go. < [Snip stuff Wendy got right] >polo-neck - Americans call it a roll-neck, don't they? Depends on the kind of "polo-neck", I think. There's a distinct between the roll-/turtle-neck kind and what here in the UK is known as a "polo shirt", which is also described as having a polo-neck despite it being entirely different to the other type. Don't ask me what they call the latter type in the US -- a tennis shirt, maybe? >mad - crazy < Also angry, pissed, etc. [Snip II] >handbag - purse (and *we* call a purse is the much smaller container you put your cash into - what do Americans call that?!) < Coin purse? [Snip III] >squaddy (noun) - Here, *I* don't know the US term, so I'm not going to be able to enlighten you! Unless you're thinking of GI, Yvonne? < I should imagine so. Also "grunt". >Now some phrases: (2 points each) >to bump off - to kill, 'terminate with extreme prejudice' < Also "waste". >to grass someone up - to dish the dirt, turn State's evidence (depending on the context) To squeal, be a stoolie, etc. Phil ------------------------------------------------------------------ "We gotta get out into Space / If it's the last thing we ever do!" -- Return to the Forbidden Planet A sentiment echoed by Phil Atcliffe (Phillip.Atcliffe@uwe.ac.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:32:51 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kaethel Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit S P O I L E R S P A C E Giving it a try, Yvonne > Easy ones first : (one point each) > back garden back yard? > chips (food) French fries > crisps chips? > polo-neck sweater? > mad crazy? > pavement sidewalk > biscuit cookie? > handbag purse? > suspender belt ah... uh... the only thing that comes to mind is 'suspenders', but that seems very close to the UK word... > lift (noun) elevator > Now some phrases: (2 points each) No idea for those! I'll be very interested to see the answers, though :) Helene :) kaethel@club-internet.fr ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:25:09 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Phil! *You* read Georgette Heyer?! Mind you, that helps to explain your wonderfully romantic and WAFFy stories... ;) > Later, anent Irene's vocab challenge, she wrote: [snip] Well, Phil, I know you haven't met Irene, though you have certainly met Yvonne. I've been fortunate enough to meet both, and although both are extremely likeable , friendly and funny people, they don't really look or sound alike enough to be confused! It's Yvonne's challenge... ;) Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 09:27:40 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/19/2000 7:40:19 AM Eastern Daylight Time, wendy@KINGSMEADOWCR.FREESERVE.CO.UK writes: << >polo-neck - Americans call it a roll-neck, don't they? >> Um, not where I live --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 09:30:27 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/19/2000 8:26:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Phillip.Atcliffe@UWE.AC.UK writes: << what here in the UK is known as a "polo shirt", which is also described as having a polo-neck despite it being entirely different to the other type. Don't ask me what they call the latter type in the US -- a tennis shirt, maybe? >> polo shirt It's a jersey type knit shirt with a knit collar. Like those ones iwth the Izod logos or Polo (little horse) logos on... --Laurie (who prefers logo-less shirts) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 08:52:09 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: LaNita Cornwall Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Well, we always called those golf shirts. My ex-had a ton of them. Counted 150 at one point. And I carry my money in a billfold in my purse. quinn -----Original Message----- From: No Name Available [SMTP:Larus2407@AOL.COM] Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 8:30 AM To: LOISCLA-GENERAL-L@LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz In a message dated 09/19/2000 8:26:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Phillip.Atcliffe@UWE.AC.UK writes: << what here in the UK is known as a "polo shirt", which is also described as having a polo-neck despite it being entirely different to the other type. Don't ask me what they call the latter type in the US -- a tennis shirt, maybe? >> polo shirt It's a jersey type knit shirt with a knit collar. Like those ones iwth the Izod logos or Polo (little horse) logos on... --Laurie (who prefers logo-less shirts) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:50:34 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > And I carry my money in a billfold in my purse. Ah; well, you see, we call a 'billfold' a wallet, and men carry those. Women's purses are very different, being designed to carry coins as well as notes (bills). Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:24:03 GMT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed > > And I carry my money in a billfold in my purse. > >Ah; well, you see, we call a 'billfold' a wallet, and men carry those. >Women's purses are very different, being designed to carry coins as well as >notes (bills). I'm not sure if it's the same in the rest of the US, but I grew up calling a 'billfold' a 'wallet.' I also call a women's 'purse' (UK version) a wallet (it contains a place for coins, notes/bills, and usually for credit cards, driver's licenses, etc). A 'coin purse' is a smaller, one pocket thing that is designed only for coins. At least in my little world! As for 'polo-shirt,' I've heard that term here, but I've always called them 'golf shirt' because that's what my dad calls them (and he wears them for golf). I've never heard the term 'rollover' in connection to clothes (only as a type of car accident), but I do have 'turtlenecks.' This is fun! (In case any other American's differ from me -- I've lived in the midwest most of my life, with a some time in Texas and California). Bethy _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 12:28:14 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/19/2000 9:51:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK writes: << Ah; well, you see, we call a 'billfold' a wallet, and men carry those. Women's purses are very different, being designed to carry coins as well as notes (bills). >> Yes, and women's wallets are designed with a coin compartment . --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 17:51:20 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Laurie wrote, in answer to me: > << Ah; well, you see, we call a 'billfold' a wallet, and men carry those. > Women's purses are very different, being designed to carry coins as well as > notes (bills). >> > > Yes, and women's wallets are designed with a coin compartment . ...in the US. Here, they're purses, and we keep them in our handbags. Unless you're Margaret Thatcher, in which case you use your handbag to clobber members of your cabinet with. Wendy (who *is* willing to explain 'clobber' if people on *that* side of the Atlantic don't understand it! ) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 13:44:36 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/19/2000 12:52:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK writes: << Here, they're purses, and we keep them in our handbags. Unless you're Margaret Thatcher, in which case you use your handbag to clobber members of your cabinet with.>> Or me who carries a backpack and never a purse or handbag... --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 19:53:37 +1100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jenny Stosser Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 Comments: To: "yconnell@ukf.net" In-Reply-To: <01C0219F.BD636BA0.yconnell@ukf.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 04:37 AM 19/09/2000, yconnell wrote: >After the lively discussion on US/UK vocabulary differences, I thought it >might be fun to set a vocabulary quiz. It's open to anyone from anywhere, >and the game is simple: supply the US equivalent of the following words and >phrases. They're all in common usage in the UK. > >No cheating by looking up reference sites or books, and if you *do* reply, >please remember spoiler space! There's a cute part of the US MSNBC website for their Today show, with a quiz on translating Aussie slang, for those who have developed an Olympic-sized interest in the country Down Under . I took the quiz myself, and only got 75%, so I guess that says that there are differences between Sydneysider Slang and Melburnians versions? Many of the phrases and words that Yvonne has used here are the same in Australia, but I'll just give Aussie equivalents if they're different: >Easy ones first : (one point each) UK Oz >back garden same or backyard >chips (food) same (or French Fries from Macca's) >crisps chips, potato chips >polo-neck Jumper >mad crazy or angry >skip (noun) ? as a noun I've never heard this used. Don't know >what it refers to. >tights Stockings or pantyhose >pavement footpath >biscuit same >handbag same >suspender belt same (holds up stockings that aren't pantyhose) >soft drink same, or fizzy drink >court shoes same I think >lift (noun) same >squaddy (noun) no idea! > >Now some phrases: (2 points each) > >to bump off to kill >to grass someone up no idea? to butter them up? to suck up to them? >to duff up no idea >up the duff up sh*t creek? >he topped himself he did better than his previous performances > > >Yvonne >(seriously wondering if this will fall flat on its face ) > >(yconnell@ukf.net) jenerator@free.net.au -*-This message is umop ap!sdn (Jenerator or Some1Else on IRC) -*- JenerEight on AIM -*- ICQ: 11477318 Photos of David (8) and Megan (5) on the Stosser Family HomePage: http://geocities.com/Heartland/Estates/4583 Please sign our guestbook! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 07:52:15 +1100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jenny Stosser Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 & Strine quiz #1 In-Reply-To: <002a01c0227d$fde87420$c2512581@k4x6e3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 08:10 AM 20/09/2000, Dennis Arendt wrote: >----- Original Message ----- > > > S > > P > > O > > i > > L > > E > > R > > > > S > > p > > a > > c > > e > > > > > > > > squaddy -hobo/bum I wonder if this is the definitive answer? I wondered whether it was a version of the word "squatter" as in someone who lives in a place which is condemned? (NOT as in the cattle baron squatters in Australia's history!) I was looking for something else entirely on my desk the other day, and came across a wonderful book called "Let Stalk Strine" by Afferbeck Lauder. (Phil may recall this book?) It purports to be a dictionary of Australian language (not necessarily slang, but rather words as they are pronounced by Australians). In addition to the dictionary type sections, it also has "conversations" for the reader to attempt to try and translate. Have a go at reading the following, if you're interested, and see if you can translate it. (Hint. try reading it out aloud, and pretend you're Crocodile Dundee ) Him: Water bat jars-chewer nigh Goa natter teat night? Jarssa touvers. Wicker deffer few drinxer Nairn F.T. Her: Well I doan fee larp twit treely. I beenin tair nawl die. Hair bat chew calmer nova to mipe lice? Wicked F. Teat mipe lice. Jen jenerator@free.net.au -*-This message is umop ap!sdn (Jenerator or Some1Else on IRC) -*- JenerEight on AIM -*- ICQ: 11477318 Photos of David (8) and Megan (5) on the Stosser Family HomePage: http://geocities.com/Heartland/Estates/4583 Please sign our guestbook! ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:22:12 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Audrey Rempel Subject: Re: Strine quiz #1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Jenny, I love speaking Strine! Actually, I just like listening to it, I'm sure my accent is horrible. But here's my translation. > > > S > > > P > > > O > > > i > > > L > > > E > > > R > > > > > > S > > > p > > > a > > > c > > > e > > > > > > > > > > Have a go at reading the following, if you're > interested, and see if you > can translate it. (Hint. try reading it out aloud, > and pretend you're > Crocodile Dundee ) > > Him: Water bat jars-chewer nigh Goa natter teat > night? Jarssa > touvers. Wicker deffer few drinxer Nairn F.T. > Her: Well I doan fee larp twit treely. I beenin > tair nawl die. Hair bat > chew calmer nova to mipe lice? Wicked F. Teat mipe > lice. > > Jen Him: What about you and I going out to night? Just the two of us. We could have a few drinks [something] of tea. Her: Well, I don't feel up to it really. I've been in town all day. How about coming over to my place? We could have tea at my place. How'd I do? Audrey __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 00:52:14 +0100 Reply-To: "yconnell@ukf.net" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: yconnell Subject: Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just a quick note to say I meant to post a few scores today, but I've run out of time, so I'll be back tomorrow ;) I'm amazed at how popular this was! Yvonne (yconnell@ukf.net) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:25:40 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz On Tue, 19 Sep 2000 17:51:20 +0100, Wendy Richards < w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK> wrote: >> Yes, and women's wallets are designed with a coin compartment . > >...in the US. Here, they're purses, You asked for the American term, though, and she was giving you that. Very interesting thread, btw! >(who *is* willing to explain 'clobber' if people on *that* side of the >Atlantic don't understand it! ) Nope, very common usage here. >Yvonne, I'd say this was popular all right! Nice one! (now there's another > Brit colloquialism ). Are you saying that "Nice one!" is a Brit colloquialism? Or something else that I missed? We say "nice one!" all the time. :) Kathy (who calls a golf shirt a "polo shirt", and a "purse" a wallet -- as Laurie said, we just call it a ladies' wallet vs a men's wallet. It's clear from the context what the person means.) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 14:37:52 +0930 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Jill Kaye Subject: Re: negative feedback In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.20000831184209.0067cda4@sheepskin.cs.indiana.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I know what you mean. I am also a musician. Not a professional one because I am still at school, but I plan to be one when I leave. I am always playing in competitions and I get nice comments from the audience. ~Larissa~ Okay, I haven't been here in a while and now, I'm on digest so I apologize >if I am reopening an already closed subject. > >Okay, I am the queen of negative feedback. Do you want to >know why? Well, I thought you would ask. Some of you guys >know that I'm a professional musician (it isn't as glamorous >as it sounds :)). I have gotten all kinds of nasty comments, >"You're sound is bad, you'll never get a job" ; "You're too >short, you can't possibly have enough air" ; "You're rhythm >is not so good" ; well, you get the picture. > >Even those those comments ticked me off to know end but >you know what?? I got BETTER. Because I combined the >'bad' comments that were said rather harshly with >'constructive' comments that were spoken by teachers >and others who respected me AND 'wonderful' comments >that were said to me by my "fans" (anyone who likes >my playing is a fan to me ). Some of the >nasty comments had a teeny-tiny amount of truth >in it, so I worked on my sound. By working on my >sound, I began working on my air (because they go >hand and hand in the art of French horn playing), and >when I did that.... so on and so forth. The comment on >"you'll never get a job" was total and utter garbage. Not >worth my time worrying about it. > >Why am I bringing in a totally off-topic subject (sorry >Kathy)?? Because it has to do with any art that is >full of opinions. We have to remember, it's only opinion. >Writers, keep the stuff you like and trash the stuff you >hate. If your FDK says, "I don't like Lois's portrayal" >WHO CARES?? and hit that delete button. This is your >art. If someone else says, your sentence structure sucks, >then think--translation, "Maybe I should look at my >sentence structure and that person was a jerk for >saying it sucks and didn't give me any suggestions >on what was wrong." > >Anyway, I hope my expertise on negative feedback >has helped in anyway, and if you think my information >was useless, maybe just *maybe* someone else didn't. > >Farah ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 23:07:00 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: StarKitty Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wendy Richards" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 4:39 AM Subject: Re: Vocabulary Quiz No. 1 > Yvonne, I'd say this was popular all right! Nice one! (now there's another > Brit colloquialism ). > > Well, since not all have been guessed, I'm going to have a go. > >handbag - purse (and *we* call a purse the much smaller container you put > your cash into - what do Americans call that?!) That would be a money pouch or a wallet. I carry a very cheap one in my pocket because my wallet has a *very* small pouch for change and I almost always carry too much for it, plus, because of how my purse is made (and packed) it's usually really hard to get my wallet out. Tara ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 20:23:35 +1000 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: jem Subject: Re: Strine quiz #1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Very good but try this - tea is another word for dinner down these here parts jem ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 12:12:30 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Phillip Atcliffe Subject: COMBO: Heyer and Quizzes In-Reply-To: <023601c0223d$087971a0$916105a0@hrm.keele.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:25:09 +0100 Wendy Richards wrote: > Hey Phil! > *You* read Georgette Heyer?! Mind you, that helps to explain your wonderfully romantic and WAFFy stories... ;) < I read lots of things... I'm actually very fond of Miss Heyer's early stuff -- the pre-Regency tales like The Masqueraders, Powder and Patch (though any resemblance between the Philip in that story and me... well, there _isn't_ any!), Cold Simon, Beauvallet -- and, of course, the best of them all, These Old Shades. Justin and Leonie are two of my favourite fictional characters. Later, I put my foot in it regarding the vocab challenge, and Wendy wrote: > Well, Phil, I know you haven't met Irene, though you have certainly met Yvonne [...] It's Yvonne's challenge... ;) < Oops... Mea culpa. I grovel in mortification, very glad that there's no web-cam here to record it . I am _sorry_, Yvonne. I have no idea why I attributed the quiz to Irene, unless her name came to mind readily because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm action figure (I just have to figure out how to make the cape...). Forgive me? Still later, Jen wrote: >> I was looking for something else entirely on my desk the other day, and came across a wonderful book called "Let Stalk Strine" by Afferbeck Lauder (Phil may recall this book?). << Not 'arf, as they say here. Not only do I own a copy of it, but I remember scouring Melbourne for another one years ago to give to a visiting Russian exhibition director (the "beautiful Russian scientist" in my past, something with which I delight in teasing security people ). Could I find one? No way; the ruddy thing was out of print for about the only time since it was originally written! Still, I loaned Aylena my copy for a few weeks, and she said it helped her understand the Australian accent better... Interstingly, there's a local equivalent of Strine here in Bristol -- or Bristle, as I gather it should be pronounced . There's a series of books on the subject of the "Bristle" dialect which were written in the late 60's (by comparison, Strine is from the 50s, IIRC), and I have an omnibus copy. The books follow the Strine pattern -- a dictionary of words, and conversation showing the use of the language. There are a lot of similarities between Bristle and Strine, but a few differences, too, but I won't go into those. >> Have a go at reading the following, if you're interested, and see if you can translate it. (Hint. try reading it out aloud, and pretend you're Crocodile Dundee ) << Sorry, didn't bring me croc-skinning knife . It's probably cheating for me to have a go, but Audrey did so well that all I can add is to fill in a couple of the gaps she left. >> Him: Water bat jars-chewer nigh Goa natter teat night? Jarssa touvers. Wicker deffer few drinxer Nairn F.T. >>Her: Well I doan fee larp twit treely. I beenin tair nawl die. Hair bat chew calmer nova to mipe lice? Wicked F. Teat mipe lice. << Him: What about you and I going out to tea tonight? Just the two of us. We could have a few drinks and then have tea. Her: Well, I don't feel up to it, really. I've been in town all day. How about you come over to my place? We could have tea at my place. So, Audrey, you did very well. 9/10 at least. Phil, who still shudders at the memory of Carol Burnett and Helen Reddy doing a song called "Stalking Strine" -- as if Americans have any right to look down their noses at "funny accents"! -------------------------------------------------------------- "If you let a smile be your umbrella... you'll get wet teeth!" -- a forgotten comedian, quoted by me: Phil Atcliffe (Phillip.Atcliffe@uwe.ac.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 14:52:34 GMT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Bethy Em Subject: New Culture difference question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Well, after our big vocabulary discussion, I came up with a new question. In the US, we use a comma to separate numerals and a period to mark decimals (3,469.5). In Europe (I'm not sure about the UK, but I know it's true in France and Spain), the comma and period are switched (3.469,5). My question is how that is read in words -- in the US we say three thousand four hundred sixty-nine *point* five. With the comma, do you say 'point' or is there another term? Bethy (who really loves learning about these differences in culture :-ŝ) _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 16:29:53 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Phillip Atcliffe Subject: Re: New Culture difference question In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On Wed, 20 Sep 2000 14:52:34 GMT Bethy Em wrote: > Well, after our big vocabulary discussion, I came up with a new question. In the US, we use a comma to separate numerals and a period to mark decimals (3,469.5). In Europe (I'm not sure about the UK [...] < We do it "your" way, Bethy. In fact, I'm fairly sure that that covention is used everywhere in the English-speaking world, although the commas are often dropped, sometimes in favour of spaces (on _both_ sides of the decimal point/comma), which may well be a European concept, particularly in technical material, e.g., 2 174 234.856 371 > [...] but I know it's true in France and Spain), the comma and period are switched (3.469,5). My question is, how that is read in words -- in the US, we say three thousand four hundred sixty-nine *point* five. With the comma, do you say 'point' or is there another term? < Beats me. FWIW, my European students never seem to have any trouble understanding what I mean when I use the "English" convention. It's possible that they might use the radio term "decimal", as in "three thousand, four hundred and sixty-nine decimal five", but that's just speculation on my part. I suspect that each language has its own term, and that's what is used normally; when figures need to be translated, then the English idiom -- "point" is used verbally, if not on paper. Any EuroFoLCs out there who can shed light on this one? Phil ------------------------------------------------------------ "Sic Transit Gloria Barramundi" (Or, So Long and Thanks for All the Fish!) -- not Douglas Adams, but me: Phil Atcliffe (Phillip.Atcliffe@uwe.ac.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 12:57:31 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: COMBO: Heyer and Quizzes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/20/2000 12:16:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Phillip.Atcliffe@UWE.AC.UK writes: << because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm action figure (I just have to figure out how to make the cape...) >> Really? Where do I sign up for one? --Laurie (Irene's #1 fan) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 13:16:36 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Aurélien BLANCHARD Subject: Re: New Culture difference question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi everyone. My name's Aur=E9lien and I'm French, so I can answer your quest= ion=20 as far as French is concerned. To say a number that has a decimal in it, we=20 do use a comma instead of a point and we actually pronounce the word comma i= n=20 French instead of point, which is "virgule". So 23,5 for example would be=20 pronounced "vingt-trois virgule cinq". As for Spanish - I also know the=20 language - I know it's the same: they say "veintitr=E9s coma cinco". I hope this helped. Aur=E9lien E-mail: aureb83@aol.com **************************** Dans un courrier dat=E9 du 20/09/2000 18:37:55 Heure d'=E9t=E9 Paris Madrid,= =20 Phillip.Atcliffe@UWE.AC.UK a =E9crit : << > [...] but I know it's true in France and Spain), the comma and period are switched (3.469,5). My question is, how that is read in words -- in the US, we say three thousand four hundred sixty-nine *point* five. With the comma, do you say 'point' or is there another term? < =20 Beats me. FWIW, my European students never seem to have any trouble understanding what I mean when I use the "English" convention. It's possible that they might use the radio term "decimal", as in "three thousand, four hundred and sixty-nine decimal five", but that's just speculation on my part. I suspect that each language has its own term, and that's what is used normally; when figures need to be translated, then the English idiom -- "point" is used verbally, if not on paper. =20 Any EuroFoLCs out there who can shed light on this one? >> ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 14:52:43 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Margaret Brignell Subject: L&C authority for fanfic? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi, I've been reading the recent thread on constructive criticism in which someone mentioned that even the show had errors. Yes, although this may come as a shock to many, the show did indeed have errors. I recently had a critique which *correctly* pointed out that the episode I was using for the basis of my story had a faulty premise. The person thought I would like to correct this faulty premise in my story. I decided not to change my fanfic, because (besides being fed up with making changes to this particular story) I feel that L&C is the "authority" for any reality I expand on in my own work. I loved the show, in spite of--or perhaps because of-- the flaws. This lead me to wonder: What do you use as the foundation for the "reality" in your stories when writing fanfic, your own view of the real world or the way the show aired the "reality"? If you are basing a plot point in your story on a faulty premise/ timeline /characterization in an episode of L&C, do you correct the error made by the episode in your fanfic, or do you go with what happened in the show and come up with some ingenious explanation or workaround for the error? I try to base the "reality" in my stories on the episodes as they aired. This sometimes means coming up with some *very* creative reasons for why things happened Sometimes I just leave it and hope that if people bought it when they watched the ep, then they'll buy it in my fanfic. I was wondering how other people handle it. Margaret .P.S. If this has already been done to death in the period while I was only lurking to get time to write said fanfic, just ignore me:) ****************************** Margaret Brignell brignell@sympatico.ca Ottawa, Canada %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% My fanfic now available at: http://www3.sympatico.ca/brignell/ ****************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 22:48:14 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Hazel Subject: Re: L&C authority for fanfic? In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20000920145243.007eccd0@pop1.sympatico.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 02:52 PM 20/09/00 -0400, Margaret wrote: >What do you use as the foundation for the "reality" in your stories when >writing fanfic, your own view of the real world or the way the show aired >the "reality"? > >If you are basing a plot point in your story on a faulty premise/ timeline >/characterization in an episode of L&C, do you correct the error made by >the episode in your fanfic, or do you go with what happened in the show and >come up with some ingenious explanation or workaround for the error? What an interesting question, Margaret. I'd suggest that it depends on what you're trying to do with your fic. If it's an ep rewrite, then yes, I would seriously suggest taking the time to correct the plot error (or characterization error, or whatever). In fact, that's partially what ep rewrites should do. :) If you'll indulge me and allow me to use my own story as an example, I had alt-Clark cutting and sewing out the S instead of taking the one on his baby blanket -- and making two of them, since the ep clearly had one shield on his chest and another on his cape. The actual ep ignored this (as it also ignored the fact that a ski suit was *not* going to look as good as Martha's handiwork.) This is, of course, a very minor detail, but it was very important for me to fix it. :) OTOH, if it's an in-betweenie, or something that *continues* a premise on the show, then I would say you're stuck with whatever illogic the show bestowed upon us. Otherwise, you might as well make your story an elseworlds or an alt or whatever. Mind you, I've seen several people begin fics by saying, "In my universe, Lex never died/the argh arc didn't happen/LnC weren't told they can't have kids/what-have-you -- and that's also fine. So really, I think it depends *why* you're writing the fic. Do the details matter? Then get them right, or give us a good reason why they're not. :) Hazel _______ "Lots of little Bigwigs, Hazel! Think of that, and tremble!" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 18:01:23 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Ann E. McBride" Subject: Re: COMBO: Question for Wendy and Vocab Quiz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 9/19/00 9:51:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK writes: << > And I carry my money in a billfold in my purse. Ah; well, you see, we call a 'billfold' a wallet, and men carry those. Women's purses are very different, being designed to carry coins as well as notes (bills). >> Well, the leather accessory in which I put my coins, bills, and credit cards is my wallet. I carry my wallet in my purse. But some people call a wallet a billfold. And some people have seperate change purses which are very small. Ann ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 23:03:58 +0100 Reply-To: "yconnell@ukf.net" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: yconnell Subject: Vocabulary Quiz No.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well, as I said yesterday, I'm delighted that this was so popular. I'm still short of time, but I did get a chance yesterday to score the majority of the entries, and I thought you'd prefer some scores to nothing at all . I'll post the answers...um, at least, what *I* think the answers should be tomorrow when I've got more time. Suffice to say, I see that 'pavement' caught quite a few of you out, 'skip' seems to have flummoxed most of you, and I've really enjoyed reading the inventive interpretations of some of the phrases . Here you are, in descending order: Wendy - 14+10 total: a near-perfect 24 (but I'm considering disqualifying her for having prior knowledge of the quiz ) Lisa - 14+4 total: 18 (first to get skip!!!) Irene - 10+4 total: 14 (like the comment on squaddy!) Brenda - 9+4 total: 13 Amy - 9+4 total: 13 Bethy - 8+4 total: 12 (I'm afraid that help you got on the phrases was a little miss-guided!) Clarissa - 8+4 total: 12 LaurieD - 9+2 total: 11 (and congrats for the most specific translation of soft drinks) Laurie - 10+0 total: 10 James - 7+2 total: 9 (well done for pavement!) Helene - 8+0 total: 8 Not sure how to mark Phil, since he added some extra suggestions to ones already made by Wendy. Yvonne (yconnell@ukf.net) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 23:20:14 +0100 Reply-To: "yconnell@ukf.net" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: yconnell Subject: Re: COMBO: Heyer and Quizzes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Oops... Mea culpa. I grovel in mortification, very glad that there's no > web-cam here to record it . I am _sorry_, Yvonne. I have no idea why > I attributed the quiz to Irene, unless her name came to mind readily > because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm action figure (I just > have to figure out how to make the cape...). Forgive me? > Hey, of course! :) I really don't mind being confused with Irene - just don't know if she'd feel the same way . Yvonne (yconnell@ukf.net) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 18:26:11 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: COMBO: Heyer and Quizzes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- yconnell wrote: > > Oops... Mea culpa. I grovel in mortification, very > glad that there's no > > web-cam here to record it . I am _sorry_, > Yvonne. I have no idea why > > I attributed the quiz to Irene, unless her name > came to mind readily > > because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm > action figure (I just > > have to figure out how to make the cape...). > Forgive me? > > > > Hey, of course! :) I really don't mind being > confused with Irene - just don't know if she'd feel > the same way . > > Yvonne > (yconnell@ukf.net) It doesn't bother me in the slightest, Yvonne! Irene Off to write more FOD? No, afraid that's not mine. I wish it were, though. I'd love to take the credit for it! ===== sirenegold@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 08:54:45 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Frantz Subject: Re: LOISCLA-GENERAL-L Digest - 18 Sep 2000 to 19 Sep 2000 (#2000-260) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi! I'm coming out of lurk mode here for some help. I need an .avi of Clark doing his 'spin thing' -- for a presentation at a church service no less . There are several .avi's and music videos that have his spin thing as part of the whole, but I need just the spin from Clark to SM. Anybody have, or know of where I could find it?? I don't have the software to cut short an existing avi.... Oh, if you have any ideas/thoughts please email me privately at: weeblos@triad.rr.com. Thanks! Kathy <----heading back to lurk mode.... ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 15:21:50 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Phillip Atcliffe Subject: COMBO 3: Action Figures and Quizzes In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE On Wed, 20 Sep 2000 12:57:31 EDT No Name Available (but we know her as=20 Laurie ) wrote: Quoting me apologising to Yvonne: << because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm action figure (I=20 just have to figure out how to make the cape...) >> =20 > Really? Where do I sign up for one? =20 Well, first, you have to find the right figure to use as a basis. I'm=20 converting a Poison Ivy figure (got the red hair already! ) out of a=20 two-figure "Batman and Robin" set that I got from TRU for =A32 (dunno=20 what I'll do with the Robin figure, 'cause it's in a silly metallic=20 red finish). Unfortunately, it was their last one, so I can't take=20 orders. Lee will have a strong family resemblance to Lois/Ultra Woman (who is=20 about 90% complete -- just need to do the fiddly bits like the mask and=20 the mini-shields that hold the cape on), because she's also made from=20 an Ivy figure, but with the hair painted black. My Superman figure=20 doesn't look anything like Dean Cain, though. Once they're done, I'll try to take a photo of the "family group" and=20 scan it. Later, Yvonne (NOT Irene! ) scored me (or didn't) with the following: >> Not sure how to mark Phil, since he added some extra suggestions to=20 ones already made by Wendy. << Well, Wendy had already answered the vast majority; all I did was=20 fill in a couple of gaps. I don't think I should count since I forgot=20 who set the quiz. Phil, who really wishes that they'd put out an L&C range of figures!=20 Anyone else remember discussing this on loiscla years ago? ------------------------------------------------------------ "I think... I think I am! | I think _I_ am: Therefore I am... I think?" | Phil Atcliffe =20 -- The Moody Blues | (Phillip.Atcliffe@uwe.ac.uk) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 08:45:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: COMBO 3: Action Figures and Quizzes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Phillip Atcliffe wrote: > On Wed, 20 Sep 2000 12:57:31 EDT No Name Available > (but we know her as > Laurie ) wrote: > > Quoting me apologising to Yvonne: > << because I'm in the middle of making a Firestorm > action figure (I > just have to figure out how to make the cape...) >> > > > Really? Where do I sign up for one? > > Well, first, you have to find the right figure to > use as a basis. I'm > converting a Poison Ivy figure (got the red hair > already! ) out of a > two-figure "Batman and Robin" set that I got from > TRU for £2 (dunno > what I'll do with the Robin figure, 'cause it's in a > silly metallic > red finish). Unfortunately, it was their last one, > so I can't take > orders. > > Lee will have a strong family resemblance to > Lois/Ultra Woman (who is > about 90% complete -- just need to do the fiddly > bits like the mask and > the mini-shields that hold the cape on), because > she's also made from > an Ivy figure, but with the hair painted black. My > Superman figure > doesn't look anything like Dean Cain, though. > > Once they're done, I'll try to take a photo of the > "family group" and > scan it. > This is of Lee? Really?! I thought maybe this had something to do with some other superhero from either the DC or Marvel universe that had nothing to do with my story! I'm excited, Phil and just waiting to see the scanned picture. Irene ===== sirenegold@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 16:59:02 +0100 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Wendy Richards Subject: Re: L&C authority for fanfic? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Margaret asked: > > If you are basing a plot point in your story on a faulty premise/ timeline > /characterization in an episode of L&C, do you correct the error made by > the episode in your fanfic, or do you go with what happened in the show and > come up with some ingenious explanation or workaround for the error? Well, I think it does depend on what the main objective is. Are you rewriting the episode, or scene, *in order to* correct the error, or is the error/issue merely something minor in the background? Even in the latter case, well... hey, this is fanfiction, and we can change what we like as long as there's some justification given for it. Especially where what we're writing is Elseworld; if we indicate that everything in the series, as it happened, is canon for our story, then we're pretty much stuck with things as they are. If the 'error' is significant enough, then some people do try to explain or justify it. In my case, it depends on exactly what I am doing with a story, and why I'm writing that particular story. If it's an episode rewrite, then I may well be writing for the precise purpose of 'putting right' something I think was badly handled, for example. To take TOGOM, an episode I've been accused of being obsessed with... ;) My problem with this ep is that Clark allows Lois to think he's dead. She is devastated, and he has to know that. Yet he keeps her in ignorance. And even by the time we finally get to the revelation, there's no closure on the issue of the grief he caused her then. How have I handled that? I've rewritten the ep, but I've also covered the 'you-let-me-think-you-were-dead' ground in other stories, in passing, by either including the apology and explanation which I think should have happened, or by providing some clear justification for Clark's actions. I've written Clark apologising profusely for letting Lois think he was dead. I've rewritten the ep with him not only telling Lois he wasn't dead, but also revealing that he's Superman. I've written a vignette in which he comes ASAP to tell her that he's alive, and uses as an excuse the claim that he was wearing a bullet-proof vest. I've had Lois, grief-stricken, go to Smallville to see Clark's parents, only to run into Clark, alive and well, and therefore find out the truth. And I've written Lois understanding that one major reason for Clark not telling her the truth was *not* that he didn't care about her, but that *he* thought he (his Clark persona) was dead. You might say that's a fairly major plot point; what about minor ones which are simply less important: Hazel's already given an excellent example from her own 'The Mirror Crack'd' (great story, in case anyone hasn't read it). I used the A-plots of the first three Season 2 episodes as back-drop for my Healing Time. In The Source, after Lois is suspended, there is a very sweet scene in which Superman comes calling and tidies up her Rolodex for her at Super-speed, then gives her a pep-talk about believing in herself. Lois comments that Clark said pretty much the same thing, and Superman replies, "Clark's a pretty smart guy." Well, that line always makes me wince... I subsequently discovered that I'm not the only one. I decided that I just *could not* write it in my story. So, in Healing Time (as I know some people noticed), Superman tells Lois at that point "I guess we both know you pretty well, Lois - and I know we both care about you." A very minor alteration, but it allowed me to lose a line I disliked! Don't know if these examples help, Margaret, but I think they're probably indicative of my approach as a writer, anyway. Wendy -------------------------- Wendy Richards w.m.richards@hrm.keele.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 14:34:57 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Kathy Brown Subject: Re: COMBO 3: Action Figures and Quizzes On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 15:21:50 +0100, Phillip Atcliffe < Phillip.Atcliffe@UWE.AC.UK> wrote: >Once they're done, I'll try to take a photo of the "family group" and >scan it. Oh, please do! This sounds hilarious! Kathy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 17:50:26 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: No Name Available Subject: Re: L&C authority for fanfic? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 09/21/2000 3:42:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time, w.m.richards@HRM.KEELE.AC.UK writes: << I've written Clark apologising profusely for letting Lois think he was dead. I've rewritten the ep with him not only telling Lois he wasn't dead, but also revealing that he's Superman. I've written a vignette in which he comes ASAP to tell her that he's alive, and uses as an excuse the claim that he was wearing a bullet-proof vest. I've had Lois, grief-stricken, go to Smallville to see Clark's parents, only to run into Clark, alive and well, and therefore find out the truth. And I've written Lois understanding that one major reason for Clark not telling her the truth was *not* that he didn't care about her, but that *he* thought he (his Clark persona) was dead. >> Well, after this paragraph, I'll agree with whoever accused you of being obsessed with TOGOM! --Laurie ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 23:57:49 +0200 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Niklas 'Hawk' Jonsson Subject: Regarding the sequel(s)... Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hiho. Since I've been getting a few more questions then usually lately about the sequel(s) to my version of the pilot episode, I thought I'd emerge from lurkdom for the few seconds it takes to respond... I'm still writing on them. :) Yes, them. My multi-tasking brain is as always fuctioning at peak preformance only when I'm doing at least fifty different things at once. *sheepish grin* Anyways, there are currently nine sequels in the works and the most recent one is my rewrite of the episode "Whine, whine, whine". The largest change from the original episode ( besides Superman being a telepath in my version and all that... ) is that it isn't Dan Scardino who suggests the lawyer this time. It's my very own little Mary Sue, Hawk. Which lawyer does Hawk know, you wonder? Well, does the name Ally McBeal ring a bell or two? *grins* Anyway, the last thing I wrote was Supermans first visit to the offices of Cage/Fish & associates where he's going to meet with his honest lawyer. Which is sort of ironic since Ally really is a blood-sucking lawyer, litterally! Oh yes, did I forget to mention that Ally isn't a human any longer in my fic-verse? She sorta like died, but was brought back to (un)life and turned into a Vampire... Yes, I'm sick. Yes, I'm deranged. Yes, I'm perverted. Yes, I'm crazy. Yes, I'm bonkers. Yes, I like to repeat myself and for you fans of Terry Pratchett, sometimes five exclamation marks just aren't enough for me... :) --<< Sent By >>-- Niklas "Hawk" Jonsson ICQ:21771860 http://hawksgalaxy.com hawk@telia.com "Always obey your superiors, if you have any." - Mark Twain ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 16:49:14 -0600 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Debby Subject: She's back... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Yes, I'm back. My new eddress is huitziln@cais.net (old: debby@swcp.com) and in theory have a super-fast wireless connection, at least in the morning and since not too many people are hooked up to our particular T1 line, for the last several days. I don't plan to have any more access problems (as long as the experimental nature of the ISP set up here at my apartment complex works okay). I complained about my old provider trying to double bill me for August, but after I pointed out the error of their ways and dumped them... they haven't sent me a bill. I'm sure I can work all this into a Lois story :) "Lois, let me get this straight: you're going to break into your ISP's office and pour honey in their main server just because their billing program has a Y2k problem?" "And you see something wrong with that?" What did I do on my vacation from the net? I cleaned off my hard drive (a big task!) and read parts 6 through 10 of Dawning... finding lots of typos, argh, particularly in part 10... but it's all much better and cleaner now. After I get through the next 12 parts, I can start writing on it again, or on other ideas I have. I also plan to write shorter letters... I don't have an ftp site any more but am going to be looking into that. I can apparently send attachments. I also have all those scripts still available. I hope you've all been good or at least sneaky while I've been gone :) Your friend and mine, Debby huitziln@cais.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 20:28:55 EDT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Andrew Troy Keller Subject: Re: COMBO 3: Action Figures and Quizzes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just to let everybody know,Firestorm never wears a cape. You don't believe me? Check out the old FIRESTORM comic-books,and see for yourselves. Just a suggestion,of course. --Andrew Troy Keller ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 01:08:03 GMT Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Diyan Subject: Re: Action Figures Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Just to let everybody know,Firestorm never wears a cape. >You don't believe me? >Check out the old FIRESTORM comic-books,and see for yourselves. >Just a suggestion,of course. >--Andrew Troy Keller there are Firestorm comic-books?? Andrew- it sounds like you've missed out on a *great* L&C story: Irene Dutchak's "Firestorm." Okay, I can't resist this opportunity to plug one of my favorite stories :) Irene won two Kerth Awards this past March for "Firestorm" and it's first sequel, "Starfire and Sunstorm": Best Series and Best Next Generation/Early Years Story. Also, I've heard it said by more than one person that they never liked next gen stories (stories about L&C's kids) until reading the Firestorm series. The following is an excerpt from the story(http://www.lcfanfic.com/stories2/firestor.txt): ********************** There was a large, soft, brown manila package inside the carpetbag. Inside was a fire-red, one-piece outfit - a sleeveless, high necked, form-fitting bodice that flowed into tight leggings. It had an insignia with a stylized flame on the chest. Also included in the package was a bright yellow cape obviously meant to be worn with it. Tucked into the neckline was a pair of very studious looking glasses. "You've got to be kidding! I'd look like a bonfire in this!" Lee looked in the carpetbag to see what other surprises Gramps and Uncle Herb had waiting for her. Exasperated, she pulled out a pair of black high-heeled leather boots. "It's a good thing I can fly. I'd never be able to walk in these," she thought in disgust. She found another envelope, this one addressed to her. She opened it. Inside were a letter and a folded newspaper clipping. She sat down to read the letter. "Dear Lee, By this time, you will have found your new outfit. What can I say? I was bound and determined to get you out of your librarian's outfits and into something more colourful. I know you will look absolutely ravishing! Believe me, I really do know. Or to be more accurate, I remember! You can thank me when you get back. As for the glasses, you could say they're a family tradition! Love, Gramps" Lee shook her head in exasperation. She slowly opened the newspaper clipping. She had a horrible feeling she knew what she would find. "Metropolis' Fiery New Super-Hero! - Exclusive by James Olsen." And there she was - in all her glory. It was a picture of Lee in a dramatic pose, leaping into the sky, her hair streaming out behind her. There was no story with the picture - just the headline. Even the date had been cropped off. "Yep, I was right! I do look like a bonfire!" she thought. "At least, no one will be looking at my face!" She studied the picture once again. "Well, I guess I can pack up my skirts. I'll never be able to put this outfit on under them!" ****************** Irene- hope you don't mind this little advertisement -Dia (yes, I'm back on the list! :)) _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 20:29:30 -0500 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: peabody Subject: Re: She's back... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Debby wrote: > I complained about my old provider trying to double bill me for August, but > after I pointed out the error of their ways and dumped them... they haven't > sent me a bill. I'm sure I can work all this into a Lois story :) > > "Lois, let me get this straight: you're going to break into your > ISP's > office and pour honey in their main server just because their billing program > has a Y2k problem?" > "And you see something wrong with that?" LOL, Debby! The vignette above is just one of many reasons I'm glad that you're back :) Pat peabody@mcs.com pattijean@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 19:00:35 -0700 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: "Irene D." Subject: Re: Action Figures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Diyan wrote: > >Just to let everybody know,Firestorm never wears a > cape. > >You don't believe me? > >Check out the old FIRESTORM comic-books,and see for > yourselves. > >Just a suggestion,of course. > >--Andrew Troy Keller > > there are Firestorm comic-books?? > > Andrew- it sounds like you've missed out on a > *great* L&C story: Irene > Dutchak's "Firestorm." Okay, I can't resist this > opportunity to plug one of > my favorite stories :) > > Irene won two Kerth Awards this past March for > "Firestorm" and it's first > sequel, "Starfire and Sunstorm": Best Series and > Best Next Generation/Early > Years Story. Also, I've heard it said by more than > one person that they > never liked next gen stories (stories about L&C's > kids) until reading the > Firestorm series. > > The following is an excerpt from the > story(http://www.lcfanfic.com/stories2/firestor.txt): > > > ********************** > > There was a large, soft, brown manila package inside > the carpetbag. Inside > was a fire-red, one-piece outfit - a sleeveless, > high necked, form-fitting > bodice that flowed into tight leggings. It had an > insignia with a stylized > flame on the chest. Also included in the package > was a bright yellow cape > obviously meant to be worn with it. Tucked into the > neckline was a pair of > very studious looking glasses. > > "You've got to be kidding! I'd look like a bonfire > in this!" > > Lee looked in the carpetbag to see what other > surprises Gramps and Uncle > Herb had waiting for her. Exasperated, she pulled > out a pair of black > high-heeled leather boots. > > "It's a good thing I can fly. I'd never be able to > walk in these," she > thought in disgust. > > She found another envelope, this one addressed to > her. She opened it. > Inside were a letter and a folded newspaper > clipping. She sat down to read > the letter. > > "Dear Lee, > By this time, you will have found your new > outfit. > What can I say? I was bound and determined to > get > you out of your librarian's outfits and into > something more colourful. I know you will look > absolutely ravishing! Believe me, I really do > know. Or to be more accurate, I remember! You > can thank me when you get back. As for the > glasses, > you could say they're a family tradition! > Love, Gramps" > > Lee shook her head in exasperation. She slowly > opened the newspaper > clipping. She had a horrible feeling she knew what > she would find. > > "Metropolis' Fiery New Super-Hero! - Exclusive by > James Olsen." And there > she was - in all her glory. It was a picture of Lee > in a dramatic pose, > leaping into the sky, her hair streaming out behind > her. There was no story > with the picture - just the headline. Even the date > had been cropped off. > "Yep, I was right! I do look like a bonfire!" she > thought. "At least, no one > will be looking at my face!" She studied the picture > once again. "Well, I > guess I can pack up my skirts. I'll never be able to > put this outfit on > under them!" > > ****************** > > Irene- hope you don't mind this little advertisement > > > -Dia (yes, I'm back on the list! :)) Dia, of course I didn't mind. But it did take me aback! Not something I was expecting to read. Thanks for the recommendation, Irene P.S. Welcome back to the list! ===== sirenegold@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 22:36:08 -0400 Reply-To: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" Sender: "Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman Fanfic" From: Margaret Brignell Subject: Re: L&C authority for fanfic? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Re my question: >> If you are basing a plot point in your story on a faulty premise/ timeline >> /characterization in an episode of L&C, do you correct the error made by >> the episode in your fanfic, or do you go with what happened in the show >> and come up with some ingenious explanation or workaround for the error? Wed, 20 Sep 2000 22:48:14 +0200 Hazel wrote: > I'd suggest that it depends on what you're trying to do with your fic. If > it's an ep rewrite, then yes, I would seriously suggest taking the time to > correct the plot error (or characterization error, or whatever). In fact, > that's partially what ep rewrites should do. :) > OTOH, if it's an in-betweenie, or something that *continues* a premise on > the show, then I would say you're stuck with whatever illogic the show > bestowed upon us. Otherwise, you might as well make your story an > elseworlds or an alt or whatever. You have a good point. I don't really want to re-write the eps (unless you count pretty much every episode after the Wedding argh, with the exception of Brutal Youth. But then again, I don't have any inclination to re-write them, so they don't count;). Perhaps that's why I've pretty much stuck to doing the pre-Metropolis, pre-ep and post-ep genre. I'd rather explain why the characters were the way the appeared in the show, not change them. Perhaps this is why I have so much difficulty with the concept of changing the anomalies in the show. The changes never seem "true" even if they do make more intellectual sense than the original. I know that sticking to the original is often incredibally difficult. For example, when I wrote "Clark...Who?" the number of timeline improbabilities, inconsistencies, plot holes and such were infinitely more than I could have ever expected (up until then I'd pretty much thought the Pilot was perfect... you live and learn). Lois was supposed to be experiencing the same events that appeared in the Pilot so I felt that changing the original would somehow be cheating myself and the reader. I will admit though that it would have been *much* simpler to just revise the parts of the Pilot that were giving me problems than to somehow incorporate them into my story as is. I'm not sure I succeeded, but I gave it my best shot:) [I won't even begin to talk about the problems rationalizing TA and "Only You: Recall"] > So really, I think it depends > *why* you're writing the fic. Do the details matter? Then get them right, > or give us a good reason why they're not. :) The devil is in the details >On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 16:59:02 +0100 Wendy Richards wrote: > If the 'error' is significant enough, then some people do try > to explain or justify it. Yes, I think this is where I'm coming from myself.. the explaining/justifying I mean;) > after Lois is suspended, there is a very sweet > scene in which Superman comes calling and tidies up her Rolodex for her at > Super-speed, then gives her a pep-talk about believing in herself. Lois > comments that Clark said pretty much the same thing, and Superman replies, > "Clark's a pretty smart guy." > Well, that line always makes me wince... Oddly enough, I found this line highlighted Clark's plight very well at that point in their relationship . Clark can't get any respect from Lois. She only puts up with him because Perry forced her into it. She hangs on every word that Superman says. Clark in his Superman persona is confident, witty, and able to tell Lois things she would never hear coming from anyone else. At that point his only real choice is to use his influence as Superman to get her to see Clark in another light... not that it made any difference In only five words the writers deftly illustrated Superman and Clark's dilemma. As a result I didn't wince;) So, if I had to write that scene, I would probably have taken it as is. > Don't know if these examples help, Margaret, but I think they're probably > indicative of my approach as a writer, anyway. I think both of your comments and examples have helped me understand my approach as a writer. I think if I tried to correct the errors, my version would lose something that was in the original. Besides, it's fun to figure out the workarounds [I can say that now that the pain of pounding my head on the keyboard has abated;)] Given the choice, I'd rather write something that has no relationship to any particular episode. But if I do decide to write another story based on the episode, I think I'll continue to consider the episode to be unchangeable and work it from there. I prefer it that way. Thanks so much for your input, it's helped me clarify my thoughts:) Margaret P.S. Since Debby has advised she has lost her ftp site, I've taken Debby's site link off my web page. I've also posted the final version of "Only You: Fantasy" to my website now that it is definitely on its way to the archive:) ****************************** Margaret Brignell brignell@sympatico.ca Ottawa, Canada %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% My fanfic now available at: http://www3.sympatico.ca/brignell/ ******************************